Go Back  PPRuNe Forums > Ground & Other Ops Forums > Questions
Reload this Page >

Landing a Boeing 757

Questions If you are a professional pilot or your work involves professional aviation please use this forum for questions. Enthusiasts, please use the 'Spectators Balcony' forum.

Landing a Boeing 757

Old 12th Apr 2005, 17:53
  #1 (permalink)  
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: UK
Posts: 5
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Landing a Boeing 757

Hello All,

I had a conversation with someone about landing a 757 and they said that it is fairly common practice to land with the left wing a little low. The reason stated is that in the left main landing gear there is a switch which actuates the spoilers, so encouraging the left MLG to contact first helps stabalise the aircraft as the braking begins.
Can anyone tell me if this is a recommended technique (official or unofficial!) or a complete load of garbage.
Many thanks.
boardnick is offline  
Old 12th Apr 2005, 18:15
  #2 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Surrounding the localizer
Posts: 2,200
Likes: 0
Received 2 Likes on 1 Post
Dunno about the left wing low malarcy....but I was taught 30 ft check and flare...20 feet close thrust levers....and gently does it...

Then when your really good.....drop everything by 10 feet..i.e check flare at 20 feet..close thrust levers at 10 feet. Dont forget to fly the nose wheel onto the runway..otherwise she will bite..with a thump!
haughtney1 is offline  
Old 12th Apr 2005, 18:39
  #3 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 2001
Location: uk
Posts: 1,963
Received 68 Likes on 26 Posts
To use your own expression - 'a load of garbage' - I don't know all the answers but have been flying the 757 for about nine years now !
beamer is offline  
Old 12th Apr 2005, 18:46
  #4 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Heathrow
Posts: 291
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
You can land left wing down - sometimes dropping one gear first helps in a crosswind, but not really. Better to get both sides down at the same time - it feels better and makes no perceptible difference with the speedbrakes. If you land exceptionally smoothly, sometimes the only indication you are on the ground is the speedbrakes coming out. Haven't done that too often though!

I find landing a 75 as described above works well, but now I use the radio callout as a guide and judge it all by visual picture. A number of times the 75 has shouted "50" at me when we have been at about 70 feet, if you trust it you end up messing up a nice approach.

In a cross wind with proper coordination of controls you will land pointing in the right direction and with both sides together. If you have any drift on, the aircraft will shake just after touchdown which can be uncomfortable. If you have it lined up exactly with the runway, this does not happen. Insufficient aileron on a crosswind landing will mean one side touches first, but if you put enough in, that won't happen.
Jetstream Rider is offline  
Old 12th Apr 2005, 18:50
  #5 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 1999
Location: Daansaaf
Posts: 167
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Garbage.

Automatic spoiler deployment requires both main landing gear trucks to un-tilt together with idle thrust.
shlittlenellie is offline  
Old 12th Apr 2005, 18:53
  #6 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 1999
Posts: 2,312
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
It may well be the case if the observer has been on flights with a marked crosswind from the left, otherwise the premise and the reason suggested is indeed " a complete load of garbage".
Bealzebub is offline  
Old 13th Apr 2005, 09:14
  #7 (permalink)  
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: UK
Posts: 5
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Thank you to everyone who has replied, you have been a great help.
boardnick is offline  
Old 13th Apr 2005, 21:33
  #8 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: A GOOD PLACE TO FLY, DRINK, **** AND SLEEP.
Posts: 150
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
pull back, close thrust levers, close eyes and wait....
JackOffallTrades is offline  
Old 14th Apr 2005, 08:19
  #9 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Location: Location:
Posts: 39
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Rudder wise treat every landing as a Xwind to avoid the shimmies.
For a smooth touchdown relax the back pressure on the column slightly just before main wheel impact.
Jo90 is offline  
Old 14th Apr 2005, 08:53
  #10 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: SX in SX in UK
Posts: 1,082
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
All pilots land left wing low, because they are sitting on the left. If you watch a sequence of aircraft landing, in about 80% of landings, the left wheel will touch first.
Kolibear is offline  
Old 14th Apr 2005, 09:04
  #11 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: SW England - and happy!
Age: 51
Posts: 177
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Ah, I see the logic, what if the FO is flying?

Does it land on the right wheel first!

Does that mean that 80% of captain's don't let their FOs fly??

Gazeem is offline  
Old 14th Apr 2005, 09:08
  #12 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: UK
Posts: 441
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
And of the 50% of 757 pilots that sit on the RHS...?
Give me stength!
Boeing 7E7 is offline  
Old 15th Apr 2005, 14:12
  #13 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: UK
Posts: 613
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Angel

And if you're carrying a training pilot in the observers seat, does it land nose wheel first???
BN2A is offline  
Old 15th Apr 2005, 14:43
  #14 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 1999
Location: uk
Posts: 152
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
The switch is on the nose/main gear which activates very early in compression during landing/ first contact.

Last edited by Kestrel; 15th Apr 2005 at 15:49.
Kestrel is offline  
Old 15th Apr 2005, 15:22
  #15 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 1999
Posts: 2,312
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Not so Kestrel,

The spoilers are ( in the armed position) fully extended and the lever driven to the up position, when the main gears are untilted and the thrust levers are at idle. Failing this they are also extended when either reverse thrust lever is moved to the reverse idle detent, provided again the main gear trucks are in an untilt condition. In the latter case the speedbrake lever does not need to be in the armed position.

The nose gear A/G compression sensing logic is used for controlling stall warning and portions of the caution and warning system.
Bealzebub is offline  
Old 15th Apr 2005, 15:43
  #16 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: EGNH
Posts: 42
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Not so Bealzebub!

Are you suggesting that you could apply reverse thrust with the nose wheel in the air, not so, below is the AMM32-09-02 reference for air ground sensing:

When the airplane takes off, the air/ground relays change some of
the systems from the ground mode to the air mode. The opposite
procedure occurs when the airplane makes a landing. The change
between the flight mode and the ground mode occurs through the
inputs of these sensors and switches and their related electronics:
(a) The truck tilt sensors of the main landing gear.
(b) The not compressed sensors of the nose landing gear.
(c) The pressure switch for the shuttle valve on the truck
positioner.


Remember, it's only As I See It, oh and Boeing as well! Oh yeah and Kestrel too
As I See It is offline  
Old 15th Apr 2005, 16:12
  #17 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Surrounding the localizer
Posts: 2,200
Likes: 0
Received 2 Likes on 1 Post
Just a thought.......as PF...by the time your'e selecting reverse, you will have had to fly the nosewheel onto the runway in any case.
As I see it...I didnt believe Beazlebub was suggesting reverser deployment before the nose oleo is compressed, further to this...as you well know with the spoilers armed and thrust levers closed....the spoilers (as a normal part of system logic) will extend...destroy the lift aft of the C.P. and hence cause a small but not insignificant nose down moment...all done to reinforce the process of tilt/compression and consequently activation of thrust reversers.

As an interesting note...in my B757 FCTM..and technical manuals, I can find no reference to the nose oleo/thrust reverser relationship.

(just goes to show that with Pilots....Boeing reckons knowledge aint power!!! )
haughtney1 is offline  
Old 15th Apr 2005, 17:21
  #18 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 1999
Posts: 2,312
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
As I see it,

You should look !

Watch a 757 the next time one touches down. The spoilers will deploy before the nosewheel has compressed, or indeed touched the ground. As haughtney1 has suggested, read it again.

I appreciate you and /or kestrel may think otherwise, but I would be concerned if Boeing feel otherwise because every time I have landed one for the last 20 years the spoilers have activated with the main gear untilt sensors prior to nose wheel touchdown ( other than when the speedbrakes are disarmed of course ). The point about the reversers was simply to add that they are also able to activate the spoilers even when the speedbrake lever is disarmed.

The reference you have provided, refers to the components of the Air /Ground sensing system. You will understand that not all constituents of it are relevant to each and every system.

If you disagree perhaps you could explain this seeming anomaly ?
Bealzebub is offline  
Old 15th Apr 2005, 20:26
  #19 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Heathrow
Posts: 291
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
On both the 757 and 767 the spoilers will deploy before noswheel touchdown. When the auto speedbrake is inoperative, it has to be deloyed manually and it says in the MEL to make sure the nose is pitching down before selecting speedbrake. Sometimes in the 767 the spoliers popping out will cause a pitch up moment as you try to land the nosewheel - not usually a problem if you fly it on to the runway, rather than holding it off. Can't remember if the reversers will deploy before nosewheel touchdown (I think they will) - but they will on the 747 - saw it happen yesterday.
Jetstream Rider is offline  
Old 16th Apr 2005, 15:08
  #20 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 1999
Posts: 2,312
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
__________________________________________________
Not so Bealzebub!

Are you suggesting that you could apply reverse thrust with the nose wheel in the air, not so, below is the AMM32-09-02 reference for air ground sensing:
__________________________________________________


Although I was referring to the spoiler deployment, since you bring up the point, I am afraid you are not correct yet again. The reversers will deploy with the nose wheel in the air. This is because the portion of the Air/Ground sensing system utilised is the main gear untilt. That is (a) in the reference you have provided.
Bealzebub is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service

Copyright © 2024 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.