OK, here is the question.

Which one is more quality?

PPL in 3 weeks or 6 weeks or maybe even any other period?

Eikido

eikido,

I enjoyed superb weather and didn't encounter a single non-flying day so perhaps I was lucky? The duration of the course was three weeks but I'd actually booked four weeks to allow for poor weather and the fact I might need extra hours if I was struggling with the course. Always build some contingency time into your plans - always!

I can't see what the big deal is with this. If you don't think you could complete an intensive training course and fly safely, so what? Don't do it, as you probably wouldn't pass the course within the time anyway. Not everyone does.
Myself and others have done it and are enjoying flying safely in the UK as a result if that training.

Yikes, is it true that Stephen Fisher is connected with OBA now? I remember that name and it is connected with all sorts of odd goings on. I hope that AT is aware of his rather chequered history!!!!

Edit:
look at this link:
http://www.pprune.org/professional-p...oing-gone.html

Lots more if you care to search "IFTA" or "Stephen Fisher"

My understanding is that IFTA was another XL disaster albeit on a smaller scale and with the exception that nobody was "ATOL" protected!

I think you'll find that Fisher is (like Paul Thompson -no relation of Adrian) simply a Florida-based CAA examiner for professional stuff and not involved, financially, in OBA in any way.
Their compliance is the responsibility of the CAA not the FTO's.

Who is Stephen Fisher? Is Adrian no longer there?
I'm getting wee bit nervous at the moment because I'm booked to go to OBA in November, and all of a sudden the prices are going up, new management, crashes, and all the instructors are leaving.

I'm committed now because I almost have my M20 visa and changing all of that is going to take another 3 months! Just got to hope that everything is cool there.

I believe SF is just affiliated with the school, to my knowledge he is not a co-owner, but has an interest in the company.

whats going on with the prices there? im doing a bit of forward planning with regard finances and in this months flyer the 100 hrs is quoted as £6397, now go online and it is £8065!! +26% :eek:. thats £80 an hour, i know places in UK that are £80-85 an hour if these prices are correct it does seem a bit pointless going there now, in fact recently saw a share in a 150 for £999 with flying £60 per hour wet - shame i have been a student with them before and enjoyed myself and was looking forward to flying there again.

Indeed, I have a share in a TB9 at a local airfield, and it's £70 per hour wet. Cost me £1500 to buy in although that was some years ago. I'd say that your C150 angle far outweighs Ormond Beach, but in the name of fairness and reasonableness, Adrian Thompson and I are the antithesis of good friends. I was once a student at his school and he threw me out after an argument over money, when I suggested he take me to court to recover what he reckoned I owed him (my opinion is I owed him nothing). It was 2 days before Christmas, which was a nice touch.

Mods on here have my details already, I'll happily stand by my testimony, and I have a witness to his dragging me from a classroom.

The aircraft were at best tatty then, sounds like things have at least not improved.

Not a pleasant man. Not a pleasant experience: one which clearly I will endeavour not to forget.

Yes - most people on here seem to think the only ones who feel the wrath of himself, are the timewasters, or ones who spend their time at the pub (of which there are NONE withing easy distance from the school). This is not the case. YOU are at risk of something similar happening to you, regardless of how hard working you think you or, or if you are naive enough to think it will not happen to you.

A simple query, or a comment taken the wrong way, and you will find yourself stuck in the middle of nowhere, frantically searching for a rescue flight home that you can afford. Last minute one-ways from Florida cost a fortune. Getting to Orlando itself is difficult - if you can't hire a car, it is a 70 odd mile taxi ride - something you should also be aware of.

Caveat emptor!

I totally concurr with spicejetter!! I would also add that no matter how well you think that you are getting on with AT, the relationship can and does change in an instant and YOU will be the loser. Don't believe the propaganda that it is only the timewasters who fall foul of despots!

Just be aware and have a plan "B" if you go there especially now that the terrible twins are together at OBA! AT & SF.

AMEN AMEN BUYER BEWARE

OBA is not what they advertise and AT is differently not a very nice man.

OBA is great place with many thousands of satisfied customers.

Like anywhere successful, OBA has attracted a little gang of haters and nutters, who pose as victims, so this advice will probably be ignored:

1. Hasn't anyone noticed that £=$1.75 instead of $2 + ? That said, OBA is probably still cheapest for courses but there was/is always somewhere cheaper (than anywhere you chose !) for hour-building. However, don't make the mistake of deluding yourself with a false comparison e.g. a share may involve you in 'unlimited' liability and overheads. There is, also, the factor of where is it ? (e.g. Naples and Ormond Beach are definitely nicer than Orlando, Florida, Cowtown Kansas or Shoreham Sussex) and can you actually achieve the hours because of weather, aircraft availability, airport opening etc.? Be wary, also, about 'headline' rates per hour- they omit to mention extras such as landing fees, accommodation, club sub, insurance, fuel surcharges etc.

2. On the behavioural front, any school/hotel has no reasonable alternative to excluding naughty boys/people who won't pay. Responding stupidly by inviting them to sue you is a blanket denial, as well as extremely rude and simply asking to be taildragged off their premises if you've had both the cheek and courage to remain !

3. OBA tell me that Mr Fisher is simply paid (for whatever he does there) = employee not proprietor. In any case, abusing Fisher,Thompson etc.with posts on a forum for professional/student pilots is not .... 'sensible'- they are both experienced CAA examiners and are entitled, if not obliged, to defend their personal and professional reputations so you are, also, causing trouble for PPRuNe which publishes such defamation.

Just Back
 

Hi. I just came back from oba yesterday.4 and a half weeks and I have my PPL. I was grounded for half a week with the weather but apart from that was flying everyday. It was hard work doing the exams and the flying in that short space of time but definately do able if your motivated enough.
I have no major gripes with the place. The organisation at times was a little messed up but nothing major. Adrian is grand. You don't really meet him until your checkride. I thought he was sound enough. The instructors there at the minute all seem to be good and interested in what they are doing. How long they stay and teach is another question.
Stephen Fisher is there as head instructor and also does the checkrides for CPL. Again didn't have many dealings with him but he seems to be a bit of a spoon to be honest. He only come in for a feww days and then heads off again and you won't see him for a week or two. Things run alot smoother when he is not there.

Overall though I found it quite good. At the end of the day I went over to get my PPL and to get it done quicker and cheaper than at home.

Misssion Acomplished.

Cool mate. How much did you end up paying for absolutly everything.
And how many hours did you do?

Regards
Eikido

Is Ken and Bill still at the school?

Ken's gone.
I'm at OBA at the moment for hour-building. Availability of the Warriors is actually very good now. Hope it lasts...

Where did Ken go?

Steve is alright....you could do a lot worse than listen to him....a spoon?? hmmmm, not sure I agree with that!

Thanks ogie, do you get a night rating at oba and if so how did you find it.

Listen to steve????
 

frankly it's something I would be wary of. Steve tried to ntroduce a new thing for the instructors to teach us students. He tried to say that we should have both hands on the controls when landing. I know that I am only new to this but to me but that seems silly. I mean what if something happens and you need an immediate input of power. To me that second or two where you reach for the power could be crucial especially for the student who may panic and miss the power or something. For a professional this seems to me a bad way to go about it and all the instructors that i spoke to about it agreed.

As for the night rating it was included in the price. They give you 3 hours dual night then 2 hours solo. I took the three hours dual and decided to give the 2 hours solo a miss. I wasn't comfortable on my own so I figured I would concentrate on the ppl and could always get the night rating again.

Ken is gone from the school. Bill is there alright. He is good craic. When you meet him first you think whats up his a** but infact he is really good. He gives you a good kick if you need it.

The price all in was around 5-6 grand. I haven't quite gotten round to doing my maths on the money yet ;)

Again I had no problems with the school and am only offering my opinions. You can take them or leave them.

Ahhh, this is so good to hear. With under 4 weeks before I get to OBA it's nice to read some positive experiences and hear from freshly passed students who are happy with their time there.

Congrats on the pass Ogie and good luck with the rest of it vlieger.

Matt

Been there done that
 

I finished my PPL at OBA on 18th Sept. I got my PPL and night rating in 3 weeks and all for under £5k. It's tough going getting all the written exams and flight training finished in that time especially as I didn't get a chance to study before I went out there.
Overall I was very satisfied with my training and felt I got good value for money. I went there to get a PPL at minimum cost and in minimum time and that's what I got. I trained on the Piper PA-28 which I really enjoyed flying and there was no problem regarding availability. The instructors
are helpful and they make every effort to get you through your training within your timescale.
My advice to prospective students would be study before you go, be prepared to work hard when you are there and know exactly what you are paying for when you make the up front payment. Other pointers would be keep an eye on your dual time as you'll get charged should you exceed the dual hours specified in your package and don't pay for a transfer back to the airport - it's just not worth it!
It is an intensive course which will not suit everyone as different people learn at different rates but like Ogie, my experience of OBA is a positive one.

Cool guys.

However, where did you guys take your medical 2?
Also, where can i get my hands on the reading material to study before i go? I'm thinking of going somewhere in January.

Regards
Eikido

I am actually very interested in training at OBA, but I need a serious and honest opinion because finance for me is not the concern, the level of tution and time frame is what I'm looking for. Will I recieve the same level of high instruction UK schools provide and will I be able to adapt myself in UK airspace when I have completed the PPL in the states? Will they also accept my JAA PPL exam passes I already have?

This is a serious question for me and a true and accurate overlook of OBA instruction will be appareciated.

Many thanks,

G-XO

If finance is tight, then don't waste money on a JAA PPL in the US. You can get an FAA certificate from any of hundreds of schools for thousands of dollars less.

Do you mean we should convert? Or?
Because as you know, we need JAA to be able to fly in europe.

Eikido

G CEXO,

Check your PM

My comment was directed toward people from the UK, where you can fly with an FAA PPL.

I would avoid Ormond Beach Aviation at all costs!!!!!

If you are are on any time or financial budget, forget it. Very few students pass the PPL course within 21 days - even those that are not lazy! The first day I arrived there was no instructor available and from then on I was only scheduled for 1 or 2 hours per day. I also lost time because of the weather - between August and December it's hurricane season, so if you are going for 3 or more weeks, you have a really good chance of bad weather interrupting your flying.

I regretted going to OBA soon after my arrival. I realised that there was almost no chance of getting the PPL in 21 days and was disappointed by the accommodation - it's more economical to stay in a nearby hotel and to hire a car. The price did not include everything as is promised. However, after having travelled 4000 miles and done all the visa paperwork, your more or less stuck - at best, you are going to be seriously out of pocket. If you choose to cancel, OBA will take a 25% cut of the total fee paid - even if you stay for the full 21 days and haven't finished the course.

The management is apalling - the place is really run like a factory production line. The management seem to show very little interest in the welfare of the students. The instructors are good, but they are generally discontent as their conditions of employment are pretty bad. Needless to say, instructor turnover at OBA is very high.

The Cessna's are ropey as suggested by the alarming number of technical failures at OBA lately - they are just old and haven't aged well. The Warriors are better, but you'll pay more and when I was there there supply didn't meet demand.

In the end I had to leave without completing the course as I couldn't get enough time off work. I think I would have had to stay around an extra two weeks to finish the course which would have cost me considerably.

When I add everything up and take into consideration the problems I encountered at the school and the hassle of the visa application process I really don't think it's worth going to OBA. The cost of flights to Florida, accommodation and visa make the savings on UK training marginal when all is said and done.

I would be very interested to know where you found in the Ormond/Daytona area to rent a hotel and car for 7 nights for $200.

I would agree with virtually everything you said. In this present climate with the current exchange rates I would advise anyone going out there to do their calculations carefully. You can probably get just as good a deal in the UK.

As you say the biggest pain was sorting out the visas, I had to keep ringing up the FAA in Oklahoma and there was no help from the school whatsoever.

All do yourselves a favour do your ppl in the UK. You will have more time to study and refine you flying skills and will probably be a safer pilot.

Zippi when were you out at OBA? Recently?

The current situation with the dollar does make the financial side of things less appealing though I think all in all the dollar rate of flying still has it which just leaves the weather as an advantage.

Think I will still be doing my PPL in the USA as I prefer learning in intense blocks but not all of my hours building. Going to do about 50% in the USA and then come back and spend some time in UK airspace with a local flying club.

The two recent positive posts from genuine students from Ireland seem to contrast almost totally with the negative stories from London. They're so different someone must be lying.

Unless it's changed, OBA always quoted fixed prices and were paid in pounds or euros so no-one need be concerned about the $ exchange rate or the hidden surcharges which make their competitors a lot more expensive.

Accommodation was quiet/spacious/convenient/acceptable for training purposes (and probably better than most students' homes !). If you are shy, you could pay a small supp. for en-suite double as single occupancy. Get real -you aren't on honeymoon or holiday and, also, what do you reasonably expect to be included in a course price which is excellent value?

The notion that you can get just as good a deal in UK is rubbish, if you compare the cost of all that OBA include but which are usually hidden extras in the UK i.e. not included in the course price estimates.

met Fischer last year hour building, has he got a bad record? Just finshed at OAA and was considering popping out there for some more hours. What are the police files in question?
Regards
CR

BTW.

Does it matter if one does the PPL in min hours (45h)?
I don't see why one couldn't do the PPL in, for example, 80-90h to be extra safe for the flyup. Because shouldn't you be able to count in all the hours from the PPL schooling torwards the CPL if you meet the min requirements (100h pic...)?

Eikido