European Flyers at Blackbushe have gone bust
Dir. PPRuNe Line Service
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European Flyers at Blackbushe have gone bust
The subject says it all. The source is an ex-instructor now looking for a job 
European Flyers were a flying club/school at Blackbushe, cheaper than Cabair and with a pretty good share ownership scheme.
---Mik
European Flyers were a flying club/school at Blackbushe, cheaper than Cabair and with a pretty good share ownership scheme.
---Mik
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I feel especially sorry for all those that have £5000 in their EuroGold scheme, to allow the renting of club aircraft, no doubt they will not get their money back. I was always dubious of that scheme. The monies should be held in some sort of escrow account !
GV
GV
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I hate to bitch when they are down, but so many customers prefered to drive out of London past EGLK and onto much friendlier and customer service focused flying clubs.
I lived locally to EGLK and never once hired a/c or worked for them. Very funny attitude to the customers. I thought there was a lot of money behind that lot or was it all egos?
Feel sorry for the instructors. No airline jobs to go to either.
I lived locally to EGLK and never once hired a/c or worked for them. Very funny attitude to the customers. I thought there was a lot of money behind that lot or was it all egos?
Feel sorry for the instructors. No airline jobs to go to either.
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I can definitely confirm it. I am / was one of the instructors at EF. Business had been slow for a while but I didn't realise it was that bad until today.
Anyway, does anybody know of a flying school with a vacancy for an instructor?
Please send me a me a message if you do
[ 05 October 2001: Message edited by: Cruise Alt ]
Anyway, does anybody know of a flying school with a vacancy for an instructor?
Please send me a me a message if you do
[ 05 October 2001: Message edited by: Cruise Alt ]
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I am/was doing my PPL there. I had 34 hours done and was about to head on down there today to do the MET exam and then some air work with a view to doing my qualifier cross country tomorrow. I'm not really mad with the situation as I thought it might happen. I know awhile ago the school got rid of some 152s etc because it was'nt economically feasible to keep them. The weather has not been great so it has not been a very successful summer from a trading point of view. I reckon there was'nt enough in the kitty to keep the school afloat over the lean winter months. On a personal note I must say that I really enjoyed training at the school. The training was great and the instructors were always top rate. Best of luck James and Richard. I now wonder if there will be any money left to hand me back the £1600 which was left in my training account since I paid for the PPL up front. I'm not holdig my breath. if anybody hears any info on the situation please post it here. I'm off to call Cabair at EGLK and see if I can do my MET there today. All the best. MS.
[ 06 October 2001: Message edited by: trustno1 ]
[ 06 October 2001: Message edited by: trustno1 ]
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Sad news but no great surprise. Sad for those who have lost money &/or jobs through this.
Opportunity now I guess, particularly when NPPL is here, for someone to buy the building / lease, smarten it up and make it look professional, run a small customer friendly and efficient club and restore Margaret to her rightful position behind the food counter.....
A2
Opportunity now I guess, particularly when NPPL is here, for someone to buy the building / lease, smarten it up and make it look professional, run a small customer friendly and efficient club and restore Margaret to her rightful position behind the food counter.....
A2
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Does anybody know what the relationship was between European Flyers and the Holden's other business interests? Presumably they've ring fenced the others. Anybody seen a set of General Aviation ltd accounts? Where are the Euroshare planes now? Where are their other planes? Anybody interested in getting a list of pilots who are owed money by them?
[ 07 October 2001: Message edited by: Foxy 1979 ]
[ 07 October 2001: Message edited by: Foxy 1979 ]
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WITHOUT PREDJUDICE
Foxy 1979
Holden and 'the crew' were allegedly down at Popham yesterday with some of the Euroshare aircraft... apparantly on-route to Bournemouth to the Piper dealer... are they really allowed to dispose of EF company assets without a formal creditors' meeting, especially considering the funding issues of teh euroshare scheme??
Capt AirProx - you are so right, yesterday when they were at Popham, there were two of their ex-members in the clubhouse, Holden et al never even said hello, that bunch of idiots have the customer interfacing skills of a two toed sloth. i know they have used JAR and the (lack of) NPPL as excuses but I'm sure the reason they have not been successful is because they haven't a clue how to run a business and retain clients.
I really hope they don't start frequenting Popham, it's such a nice place.
My advice to anyone left being owed money by EF, would be to check the company accounts and make sure that no funds have been transferred to his other companies and (hint) check that no EF funds have been used to fund his Dakota interests.
With the Euroshare and Euroshare Gold fund members, I guess there should be approx £100K £ 150K ++ in the euroshare accounts. If he has used this for running EF or for financing other business interests you could have him over a barrel legally?
If a few of the euroshare members club together and employ a good lawyer, you may win some money.
As well as current euroshare members, my thoughts go out to the instructors who worked there, they were a great bunch of guys.
Holden folded a video prod business a few years ago owing money - history repeats itself I guess.
Foxy 1979
Holden and 'the crew' were allegedly down at Popham yesterday with some of the Euroshare aircraft... apparantly on-route to Bournemouth to the Piper dealer... are they really allowed to dispose of EF company assets without a formal creditors' meeting, especially considering the funding issues of teh euroshare scheme??
Capt AirProx - you are so right, yesterday when they were at Popham, there were two of their ex-members in the clubhouse, Holden et al never even said hello, that bunch of idiots have the customer interfacing skills of a two toed sloth. i know they have used JAR and the (lack of) NPPL as excuses but I'm sure the reason they have not been successful is because they haven't a clue how to run a business and retain clients.
I really hope they don't start frequenting Popham, it's such a nice place.
My advice to anyone left being owed money by EF, would be to check the company accounts and make sure that no funds have been transferred to his other companies and (hint) check that no EF funds have been used to fund his Dakota interests.
With the Euroshare and Euroshare Gold fund members, I guess there should be approx £100K £ 150K ++ in the euroshare accounts. If he has used this for running EF or for financing other business interests you could have him over a barrel legally?
If a few of the euroshare members club together and employ a good lawyer, you may win some money.
As well as current euroshare members, my thoughts go out to the instructors who worked there, they were a great bunch of guys.
Holden folded a video prod business a few years ago owing money - history repeats itself I guess.
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Sad news,
EF was a good (sometimes great, years ago) place to fly, always marred by an embarrassing lack of business acumen and inter-personal skills on the part of those 'at the top'. Oh, and the fact that a certain individual was a liability anytime he went within fifty feet of an aircraft (in my personal opinion).
Some very good people passed through there, but the management was always suspect.
I heard a rumour of impending demise about eight weeks ago, but had assumed all was well since. Sadly, not.
To those stuck without jobs, my sincerest condolences. I hope you have other skills which will see you in employment. I fear that the market must dictate that flying jobs are almost out of the question.
To those in Euroshare, I suggest you ponder the fact that it was always a 'scheme', and consult a dictionary... the Oxford Compact gives a definition as 'an artful or deceitful plot' and it always seemed that way to me.... caveat emptor.
To those who have lost money on PPL courses, I suggest you ponder the way flying is going, and take up a genuinely enjoyable hobby. Golf is OK, boating better.....
As usual, best wishes to all in this trying time....
[ 08 October 2001: Message edited by: NorthernSky ]
EF was a good (sometimes great, years ago) place to fly, always marred by an embarrassing lack of business acumen and inter-personal skills on the part of those 'at the top'. Oh, and the fact that a certain individual was a liability anytime he went within fifty feet of an aircraft (in my personal opinion).
Some very good people passed through there, but the management was always suspect.
I heard a rumour of impending demise about eight weeks ago, but had assumed all was well since. Sadly, not.
To those stuck without jobs, my sincerest condolences. I hope you have other skills which will see you in employment. I fear that the market must dictate that flying jobs are almost out of the question.
To those in Euroshare, I suggest you ponder the fact that it was always a 'scheme', and consult a dictionary... the Oxford Compact gives a definition as 'an artful or deceitful plot' and it always seemed that way to me.... caveat emptor.
To those who have lost money on PPL courses, I suggest you ponder the way flying is going, and take up a genuinely enjoyable hobby. Golf is OK, boating better.....
As usual, best wishes to all in this trying time....
[ 08 October 2001: Message edited by: NorthernSky ]
Dir. PPRuNe Line Service
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NorthernSky - I find learning to fly a hugely enjoyable, expensive and at times very frustrating hobby.
I believe (but I'm not a lawyer) that as I pay for training with my credit card, if the club I'm with goes bust then my credit card company take the hit, not me.
---Mik
I believe (but I'm not a lawyer) that as I pay for training with my credit card, if the club I'm with goes bust then my credit card company take the hit, not me.
---Mik
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This is on the www.eurofly.co.uk website:
-------------------------------
"General Airline Ltd t/a European Flyers
"It is with enormous regret that European Flyers has suspended trading today. 04/10/2001
"We have, in the past, overcome many setbacks but the realisation of the spiralling costs, in more than just financial terms, which are coming into play since the terror attack in the States - sharply rising insurance premiums, security regulations, safety perceptions - has beaten us.
"In the past 18 months not only, along with other FTOs, have we been badly affected by the appalling weather, the costs of implementing giant rafts of JAR rules and regulations, and the Inland Revenue demanding NVQ subsidies back but also the utter confusion in the marketplace, the overzealous implementation of JAR regulations by the CAA, including the Authority awarding JAR approvals to the US where the training is cheaper, the lack of movement on the NPPL and the "ten-a-day" miles of red tape the Government has heaped upon us and the major problems in instructor/ examiner/ training costs - the list is endless.
"The high cost of fuel (78% excise duty), the high cost of aircraft maintenance, and relate problems, along with rising airport costs - all these things have helped to place the cost of learning to fly outside the average person's pocket - all this has joined hands with a massive downturn in business across the board in General Aviation and we can no longer, personally, carry on subsidising a business which appears to have absolutely no light at the end of the tunnel and a black hole when it comes to costs.
"After discussions with our bankers we have been told to suspend operations and restructure the company. Further discussions will clarify the way this restructuring will happen and any correspondence should be sent to our registered office c/o Messrs Porter Garland, Portland House, Park Street, Bagshot GU19 5PG."
[ 07 October 2001: Message edited by: Simon W ]
-------------------------------
"General Airline Ltd t/a European Flyers
"It is with enormous regret that European Flyers has suspended trading today. 04/10/2001
"We have, in the past, overcome many setbacks but the realisation of the spiralling costs, in more than just financial terms, which are coming into play since the terror attack in the States - sharply rising insurance premiums, security regulations, safety perceptions - has beaten us.
"In the past 18 months not only, along with other FTOs, have we been badly affected by the appalling weather, the costs of implementing giant rafts of JAR rules and regulations, and the Inland Revenue demanding NVQ subsidies back but also the utter confusion in the marketplace, the overzealous implementation of JAR regulations by the CAA, including the Authority awarding JAR approvals to the US where the training is cheaper, the lack of movement on the NPPL and the "ten-a-day" miles of red tape the Government has heaped upon us and the major problems in instructor/ examiner/ training costs - the list is endless.
"The high cost of fuel (78% excise duty), the high cost of aircraft maintenance, and relate problems, along with rising airport costs - all these things have helped to place the cost of learning to fly outside the average person's pocket - all this has joined hands with a massive downturn in business across the board in General Aviation and we can no longer, personally, carry on subsidising a business which appears to have absolutely no light at the end of the tunnel and a black hole when it comes to costs.
"After discussions with our bankers we have been told to suspend operations and restructure the company. Further discussions will clarify the way this restructuring will happen and any correspondence should be sent to our registered office c/o Messrs Porter Garland, Portland House, Park Street, Bagshot GU19 5PG."
[ 07 October 2001: Message edited by: Simon W ]
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I called Porter Garland this morning and spoke to Peter Peele, a partner with the firm. He told me that Porter Garland are not Insolvency Practitioners and that his firm has not been instructed by General Airline Ltd trading as European Flyers to act in any way on their behalf.
If anybody hears any news please post it here.
If anybody hears any news please post it here.
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Peter Peele of Porter Garland phoned me back and gave me Tony Holden's contact number. Tony's number is 01189 832459. I phoned and I spoke to Felicity Holden. She said as follows;
She would like all creditors to submit claims to Porter Garland for the attention of "General Airline Ltd". Peter Peele has confirmed that his firm are happy with this arrangement.
The intention of General Airline Ltd is not to put the company into liquidation. Instead they intend to sell the aircraft and the school in the open market and to use the proceeds to settle creditors claims.
As regards training records, Julie Bradd is in the process of sending these records to each of the students in the post.
I was at EGLK over the weekend and to judge the feeling of some of the people left out of pocket (myself included) I dont think General Airline Ltd will be saved from liquidation. People spoke of serving a winding up order on the company.
[ 08 October 2001: Message edited by: trustno1 ]
She would like all creditors to submit claims to Porter Garland for the attention of "General Airline Ltd". Peter Peele has confirmed that his firm are happy with this arrangement.
The intention of General Airline Ltd is not to put the company into liquidation. Instead they intend to sell the aircraft and the school in the open market and to use the proceeds to settle creditors claims.
As regards training records, Julie Bradd is in the process of sending these records to each of the students in the post.
I was at EGLK over the weekend and to judge the feeling of some of the people left out of pocket (myself included) I dont think General Airline Ltd will be saved from liquidation. People spoke of serving a winding up order on the company.
[ 08 October 2001: Message edited by: trustno1 ]