The Road to ATP-Hell
Thread Starter
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Surbiton, Surrey
Posts: 3
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
The Road to ATP-Hell
Greetings
I am in the throes of applying for ATPL training and have learnt that one has to either go through the FTO's pre-selection or take the Guild fo Air Pilots and Air Navigators Pilot Aptitude Assessment test as an alternative. I am booked into to take the test at RAF Cranwell next Thursday. Is there anyone out there who has taken the test and could share with me what I am to expect... Also, I have heard that one can not prepare for this as it sniffs out those inate abilities, but are there in fact preliminary preparations one can do eg. better eye-hand co-ordination by spending a few hours with a Playstation/arithmetic exercises?!
Lastly, I have selected BAE in Jerez for the training after much scoping out of the other FTOs and what they offer, and would appreciate any thoughts and feedback to the below questions from those fellow aviators who have gone before:
1) Has anyone gone through BAE and could tell me how you rate them, the training/instruction, their key selling points, facilitiesadvantages and disadvantages, and do they have credible Airline Recognition in the industry
2) At age 31, am I already becoming 'old' for the airlines, given that if I commence a 60 week course in Sep '03, I will qualify at the end of 2004 at age 33?
3) BAEs simulated training appears to take place on a Hawker 800 Simulator. Oxford for example do this in a 737-400 Simulator, as well as the MCC + JOT, and say the reason for this is to recreate the most realistic environment that one would experince in the airlines. As most of the airlines of today's fleet is made up of 737 aircraft, is one not hindered by the fact that you are receiving simulated training in a simulator that pertains to an 8 seater jet? Or does this achieve the same outcome?
Any thoughts and feedback would be most appreciated.
Regards,
The Rookie
I am in the throes of applying for ATPL training and have learnt that one has to either go through the FTO's pre-selection or take the Guild fo Air Pilots and Air Navigators Pilot Aptitude Assessment test as an alternative. I am booked into to take the test at RAF Cranwell next Thursday. Is there anyone out there who has taken the test and could share with me what I am to expect... Also, I have heard that one can not prepare for this as it sniffs out those inate abilities, but are there in fact preliminary preparations one can do eg. better eye-hand co-ordination by spending a few hours with a Playstation/arithmetic exercises?!
Lastly, I have selected BAE in Jerez for the training after much scoping out of the other FTOs and what they offer, and would appreciate any thoughts and feedback to the below questions from those fellow aviators who have gone before:
1) Has anyone gone through BAE and could tell me how you rate them, the training/instruction, their key selling points, facilitiesadvantages and disadvantages, and do they have credible Airline Recognition in the industry
2) At age 31, am I already becoming 'old' for the airlines, given that if I commence a 60 week course in Sep '03, I will qualify at the end of 2004 at age 33?
3) BAEs simulated training appears to take place on a Hawker 800 Simulator. Oxford for example do this in a 737-400 Simulator, as well as the MCC + JOT, and say the reason for this is to recreate the most realistic environment that one would experince in the airlines. As most of the airlines of today's fleet is made up of 737 aircraft, is one not hindered by the fact that you are receiving simulated training in a simulator that pertains to an 8 seater jet? Or does this achieve the same outcome?
Any thoughts and feedback would be most appreciated.
Regards,
The Rookie
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: ex-DXB
Posts: 927
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
The GAPN tests are well worth it if you are unsure of your aptitude. They have been developed over the past 50 years, originally from RAF selection (and are still used..)
It's not a, 'who knows the most maths' test (as you can learn all that), but more an inate abilities test. Either you have good co-ordination or not. You can either multi-task efficiently or not, either you are vigilant or not, either you can see shapes relating to instruments or not.
I took it and received a score that set my mind at rest. To back this up, Cabair, Oxford (in their soon to launch APP program) and BAe all use modified versions of it and they all informed that if I had the GAPN test under my belt with a good score, then I would not need to complete their version as it would suffice for that particuliar entry purpose.
I'm not sure if there is anything you can do to 'prepare'... that wouldn't really be the point of the test. You just want to turn up and get a good score. It will mean far more about your inate abilities that way as you have never done it before. You will not be bluffing your abilities when push comes to shove later on.
Personally, I just went along and did it from scratch.
Cheers,
Craggenmore
It's not a, 'who knows the most maths' test (as you can learn all that), but more an inate abilities test. Either you have good co-ordination or not. You can either multi-task efficiently or not, either you are vigilant or not, either you can see shapes relating to instruments or not.
I took it and received a score that set my mind at rest. To back this up, Cabair, Oxford (in their soon to launch APP program) and BAe all use modified versions of it and they all informed that if I had the GAPN test under my belt with a good score, then I would not need to complete their version as it would suffice for that particuliar entry purpose.
I'm not sure if there is anything you can do to 'prepare'... that wouldn't really be the point of the test. You just want to turn up and get a good score. It will mean far more about your inate abilities that way as you have never done it before. You will not be bluffing your abilities when push comes to shove later on.
Personally, I just went along and did it from scratch.
Cheers,
Craggenmore
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Glasgow
Posts: 36
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I've done the tests at Cranfield with a view to military flying and I would agree that there isn't much in the way of preparation you can do. Unlike written aptitude tests you can't skip over questions you don't like and, as far as I recall, you can't go backwards either so you have to be spot on first time.
People do these tests at their own pace (when there isn't a time restriction placed, such as reading the instructions etc) so don't get flustered if you see people getting up for a break and you aren’t anywhere near that stage. From my experience some people who rush through don't do so well, but others like to get it over with ASAP while they can still concentrate, as it can be a long couple of hours! Eat a fair bit of energy food mate, cos you need to stay sharp, and get a good nights sleep before hand. I found a few pints helped on that score.
One thing I would say is that I found the hand-eye stuff to be ok, the one where you keep the dot in the middle of the screen was easier with fluid movements as opposed to sharp ones. In that test I found that the dot requires increasing rudder to keep it centred until at some point it flies off in the other direction, but all in all there wasn't much in the way of vertical control needed (very slight). The one where you have to track the dots uses a kind of aircraft control, in that the dot will not self-centre (like a car steering wheel would). If you take the dot over to the right of the screen then you'll need to push the stick to the left to take it back again. It'll all make sense when you do it!
Stay calm, read the instructions and keep up the concentration. You'll be fine!
Cam
People do these tests at their own pace (when there isn't a time restriction placed, such as reading the instructions etc) so don't get flustered if you see people getting up for a break and you aren’t anywhere near that stage. From my experience some people who rush through don't do so well, but others like to get it over with ASAP while they can still concentrate, as it can be a long couple of hours! Eat a fair bit of energy food mate, cos you need to stay sharp, and get a good nights sleep before hand. I found a few pints helped on that score.
One thing I would say is that I found the hand-eye stuff to be ok, the one where you keep the dot in the middle of the screen was easier with fluid movements as opposed to sharp ones. In that test I found that the dot requires increasing rudder to keep it centred until at some point it flies off in the other direction, but all in all there wasn't much in the way of vertical control needed (very slight). The one where you have to track the dots uses a kind of aircraft control, in that the dot will not self-centre (like a car steering wheel would). If you take the dot over to the right of the screen then you'll need to push the stick to the left to take it back again. It'll all make sense when you do it!
Stay calm, read the instructions and keep up the concentration. You'll be fine!
Cam
Why do it if it's not fun?
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Bournemouth
Posts: 4,779
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
...learnt that one has to either go through the FTO's pre-selection or take the Guild fo Air Pilots and Air Navigators Pilot Aptitude Assessment test as an alternative
Good luck, anyway!
FFF
--------------
Jet Blast Rat
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Sarfend-on-Sea
Age: 50
Posts: 2,081
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
If you are not being put through these by a potential sponsor I would not even try to fool the test: they are for your benefit only. If you do very badly, seriously consider another career, and discuss the results with the provider. The only reason I can see for taking them in this case is for your own peace of mind. If schools insist on you passing before taking their course I would suspect them of a desire to create a "sausage factory" of narrowly-defined individuals in one end pilots out of the other (many people who have not passed the tests have perfectly adequately taken an ATPL course and carried on to be successful pilots, so I do not see it as your FTO's job to select who can be a pilot). This does not suggest you will get much personal attention!
