Can I log it as P1.
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Can I log it as P1.
I've just returned from a hour building trip to the US. I have a JAA PPL. Whilst their I gained my FAA PPL. My question is, can I log the hours I flew with an instructor whilst training for the FAA PPL as P1 (supervised). The JAA guy at Naples Air Center (excellent school by the way) thought yes but wasn't able to clarify it.
Anybody know the answer ??
ps, I am I right in saying that the CAA charge £70 ish to endorse your license with a night rating ?? What a rip off !!
Anybody know the answer ??
ps, I am I right in saying that the CAA charge £70 ish to endorse your license with a night rating ?? What a rip off !!
I say there boy
Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 1,065
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From: Somewhere
Not according to the JARs.
Only one pilot can log P1 at any time. If the instructor was the nominated commander (which is likely during a course of instruction for a licence), you must log P.U/T.
The only exception to this rule in Single Pilot Aircraft is a successful skills test for a licence or rating: you log P1S, the examiner P1.
Beware there are many urban myths even amongst instructors about what you can and can't log, however the above is black and white in the JARs.
btw you're right the Night Qualification fee is a complete rip off. Don't bother with it if you are going to get your CPL soon: you need the night hours from the course, not the qualification itself to get a CPL.
Only one pilot can log P1 at any time. If the instructor was the nominated commander (which is likely during a course of instruction for a licence), you must log P.U/T.
The only exception to this rule in Single Pilot Aircraft is a successful skills test for a licence or rating: you log P1S, the examiner P1.
Beware there are many urban myths even amongst instructors about what you can and can't log, however the above is black and white in the JARs.
btw you're right the Night Qualification fee is a complete rip off. Don't bother with it if you are going to get your CPL soon: you need the night hours from the course, not the qualification itself to get a CPL.
Last edited by foghorn; 24th October 2002 at 08:10.
Why do it if it's not fun?
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 4,782
Likes: 12
From: Bournemouth
Foggy is right - there are a lot of myths about logging time, particularly P1S, which isn't clear even after reading the relevant documents.
But there is no doubt at all that, under JAR, only one person is P1 in these cases. If your instructor logged P1, you can't. If he didn't, you can. This should have been agreed between you before the flight.
Personally, I always assume an instructor is going to log P1 and I log P1T unless the instructor tells me otherwise, and I often confirm this by asking "you're the captain, right?" It means that if there are any decisions to be made, e.g. in an emergency, the instructor's decision overrides mine. Which makes sense.
FFF
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But there is no doubt at all that, under JAR, only one person is P1 in these cases. If your instructor logged P1, you can't. If he didn't, you can. This should have been agreed between you before the flight.
Personally, I always assume an instructor is going to log P1 and I log P1T unless the instructor tells me otherwise, and I often confirm this by asking "you're the captain, right?" It means that if there are any decisions to be made, e.g. in an emergency, the instructor's decision overrides mine. Which makes sense.
FFF
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Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 366
Likes: 0
From: Horsham UK
To add a twist, In my day job from time to time I do flight test reports for the Rimmer News (the best bit by far!) the vexed question is what do I log it as? - so far I've logged it as P2 on the basis that if you don't have a type rating in the a/c you can't log P1 but I suppose ther could be an arguement for logging it as P1 U/T dunno it seems to vary In Canada it's treated as a training misson (in fact my Temp Canadian licence says vaild for training in Dash 8s and CRJs operated by Bombardier only) and it's me and a company pilot on the flight. Whereas over here the deal seems to be me in the left, company guy in the right, and second (obviously type rated) guy on the jump.
And then again as P2 does it count towards maintaining multi-currency? Hmm that's an interesting one (fiscally if nothing else).
And then again as P2 does it count towards maintaining multi-currency? Hmm that's an interesting one (fiscally if nothing else).
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 181
Likes: 1
From: UK
The night 'qualification' as it is for a JAR licence is a one liner saying "this licence is also valid at night" tagged onto the end of an existing paragraph.
A bargain at £64 I don't think.. even the guy in FCL seemed embarassed when he handed the bit of paper back
A bargain at £64 I don't think.. even the guy in FCL seemed embarassed when he handed the bit of paper back
