MPL vs Modular full time (vs part time)

[Fiskardo]

Hello,

I'm a 30 year old political adviser and am currently saving to make the switch to aviation. I have about £40k so far and can save around £1500 a month. I'm weighing up what route to pursue - integrated is out due to the cost and so it's either modular or the EasyJet MPL in my mind. My plan is to save approx. £100k before starting training so that I can afford either the MPL, or modular plus a type rating. I have good credit and so can probably borrow £10-20k to start sooner, but I'd be nervous about the repayments in the event I don't get a job soon after finishing training.

The MPL has been my preference because as far as I can tell the cost is roughly the same when factoring in the type rating (MPL is £90k and includes type rating, modular is ~£60k and type rating is ~£30k so £90k total) but also comes with additional job security. I know that the job isn't guaranteed and EasyJet pulled offers during Covid, but from what I've read on this forum EasyJet has since offered seats to those who lost out.

It seems like the main risk of the MPL is that I'd be at the mercy of EasyJet and CAE. If things are delayed or something goes wrong, my training is delayed and there's not much I can do about it. Since the course is full time this would be a problem as I would have to cover the living costs for longer while not being employed. Modular doesn't have this risk, but there is a higher risk of being unemployed once I finish my training. I don't have any family I can stay with or can support me.

And if I did go modular, should I do it full time or part time? I like the idea of full time so that I can fully dedicate myself to it and get it done in a couple of years. My job can be all-consuming at times and it would be difficult to consistently train outside of work.

I would appreciate your thoughts and advice.

Thank you

[VariablePitchP]

Originally Posted by Fiskardo

Hello,

I'm a 30 year old political adviser and am currently saving to make the switch to aviation. I have about £40k so far and can save around £1500 a month. I'm weighing up what route to pursue - integrated is out due to the cost and so it's either modular or the EasyJet MPL in my mind. My plan is to save approx. £100k before starting training so that I can afford either the MPL, or modular plus a type rating. I have good credit and so can probably borrow £10-20k to start sooner, but I'd be nervous about the repayments in the event I don't get a job soon after finishing training.

The MPL has been my preference because as far as I can tell the cost is roughly the same when factoring in the type rating (MPL is £90k and includes type rating, modular is ~£60k and type rating is ~£30k so £90k total) but also comes with additional job security. I know that the job isn't guaranteed and EasyJet pulled offers during Covid, but from what I've read on this forum EasyJet has since offered seats to those who lost out.

It seems like the main risk of the MPL is that I'd be at the mercy of EasyJet and CAE. If things are delayed or something goes wrong, my training is delayed and there's not much I can do about it. Since the course is full time this would be a problem as I would have to cover the living costs for longer while not being employed. Modular doesn't have this risk, but there is a higher risk of being unemployed once I finish my training. I don't have any family I can stay with or can support me.

And if I did go modular, should I do it full time or part time? I like the idea of full time so that I can fully dedicate myself to it and get it done in a couple of years. My job can be all-consuming at times and it would be difficult to consistently train outside of work.

I would appreciate your thoughts and advice.

Thank you

Main benefit of Modular, alongside being cheaper, is that you can pay as you go to allow you to keep working. It doesn’t sound like you’d actually need to do this. If you can save the cash for the MPL within a couple of years and just borrow a bit, I’d do that. Gets you the job, presumably you want to fly an Airbus. That’s what the MPL is for.

Definitely borrow some cash. If you need to repay it then you’ll just be repaying the money you’d have otherwise been saving, but you’ll start a year earlier.

Alongside this I trust your carpet bombing BA/Aer Lingus/TUI sponsored schemes as well? Take any, hardest bit is getting the first job!

[rudestuff]

If you're a political advisor you should be shrewd enough and sneaky enough to land yourself an interview which is the hardedt part. Follow the route that will get you into the RHS as quickly a possible. Spending an extra year saving £18k is going to cost you £180k in career earnings.

[Chris the Robot]

I'm in a broadly similar position to the OP, looking into the industry from the outside.

Firstly, make sure you can get a Class 1 medical, you won't be able to fly commercially without one.

As has been said, apply for any fully sponsored schemes which come up. An important part of these is that the airline has skin in the game, so to speak. It's not in their interest to terminate the programme mid-way through due to an industry downturn or similar. If it's a self-funded "tagged" programme, the airline doesn't have the same investment in making sure you have a job at the end.

As for the self-funded full-time/part-time debate, how easily can you return to your current career after a break? If you can pick up contractual ad-hoc work, full-time training might be worth a bet, however if it's tough to get back in then you might be better going part-time. Commercial aviation is very cyclical when it comes to employment and it can change very quickly. The job market may be strong now but will it be in two years' time? No-one really knows. I'm a bit risk-averse and tend to plan around the worst outcome and work from there but that's just me.

You haven't said how much flying you've done so far, it may be worth taking up gliding or getting a PPL to see if you enjoy it. The only thing to watch out for is that TUI won't take you on their sponsored scheme if you have over 100 hours.

[rudestuff]

Also, MPL or integrated is very much all or nothing.
By going Modular you can effectively stop and assess at each stage. Your PPL and first hundred hours are about having fun. Once you have passed the ATPL exams you have a 3 year clock ticking and your next 100 hours will be more professionally focused: CBIR, MEP, MEIR and CPL. If the market takes a downturn you have the option to finish everything single engine (for about what you have saved) Then you can just sit on it and let everything expire. When the market recovers you can get your MEIR and MCC

[RichardH]

A no brainer Fiskardo. Modular every time be it part-time for flexibility and financial safety due change in world events or full-time (known it done in 15 months). You could mix & match say PPL at weekends (after class 1 medical first), then hour building as required. The ATPLs are the most tricky & demotivating part and you might want to consider doing them full-time 6-8 months (that's what I did over 30 years ago). Some of the flying CPL & IR will require almost full-time attendance for consistency.

Remember the MPL is airline specific assuming you can actually get a place on one of the schemes, great if it works but could be left with nothing if it doesn't. You also can't go and fly a light aircraft for fun without further training. With a Frozen ATPL (CPL/IR) preferably both UK & EASA rated you can then apply to any operator and YOU not the 'sponsoring' airline are more in control of your dreams.

Strongly recommend you follow rudesuff's & others of a certain vintage advice as we are not trying to sell you something.

[Comet22]

I would recommend modular as the others have said. It is usually cheaper while also allowing you to work at the same time.

I can't remember the exact requirements, but take a look at the airlines recruiting to see what they want. I think BA want no more than 3 training providers or something.

As Chris said, TUI and BA both do the sponsored schemes, so they could be worth looking at. TUI is open next January I think.

[TheYorkshirePilot]

I’d definitely advise a modular route. If I was doing it again, I’d go modular and do my PPL and Hour building whilst continuing to work and saving up to then do ATPLS right the way through to MCC and UPRT as full time as possible.

[CAVOKpilot]

I would advise modular, gives the flexibility fraction of the price. And allows you to start sooner rather than later while still saving. The market is good at the moment, though always hard to predict what it will look like in 18-24 months. At the moment, there are airlines out there recruiting who will fund your type rating with no up front cost. If you delayed a year or so to save the money for the type rating to find you didn't need it then that could be time wasted that you could have otherwise been flying (but nice to have that money laying around!)

I went modular with no funds set aside for type rating and secured a role with a bonded type rating. Though I wouldn't have predicted that 12 months ago. It's worth the risk though, and if you get to the end and do need to pay for the type rating - borrow the money then would be my opinion.

[Fiskardo]

Thanks everyone, I'm leaning more towards modular now and doing at least the first bit part time. I want to be strategic with how I use my annual leave and when to take a sabbatical or quit and go full time. I've drawn up a rough plan:

1. Class 1 Medical
2. While working full time, study for the PPL exams on evenings and weekends and get these all done before flying. Then take a few weeks of annual leave during a summer and start flying. Then night rating.
3. Take an 8-10 month sabbatical from work to study ATPL theory full time (is it worth doing both CAA and EASA? I only have the right to live and work in the UK but I think RyanAir requires EASA too)
4. Return to work and hour build on weekends and during annual leave (e.g. go to Florida/Arizona for a few weeks)
5. Go part time at work (e.g. 3 days a week) and do IMC->CBIR->MEP->MEIR->CPL in that order to save costs as suggested. I'd quit my job at some point in this process as it sounds like IR and CPL are better done full-time.

Does this make sense? Appreciate any suggestions on how to improve this, like if I should hour build before the ATPLs, or skip going part time and just go straight into the IMC full time after hour building etc.

[CAVOKpilot]

I would say on point 2 - don't expect to complete PPL in a few weeks, especially not in UK. Book every available day you have, and expect 50% to be cancelled. Also, book early. I once had a lesson and once landed I went to book in for the next lesson, and I had to wait 7 weeks. With instructors thin on the ground now due to the market buoyancy and everybody wanting to train, I expect this wait would be longer. Plan very early and ahead if you can.

On the CPL and IR - I did both over the course of 5 months while working a full-time night job (Tues-Fri 1900-0530) - its very doable around work if you have the capacity. I flew Saturday PM, available all Sunday and Monday, and Tuesday AM. On a given week I may have only flown twice. May not need to quit the job, can earn and do your training at same time with a reputable modular school!

[SolentPilot]

Originally Posted by CAVOKpilot

I would say on point 2 - don't expect to complete PPL in a few weeks, especially not in UK. Book every available day you have, and expect 50% to be cancelled. Also, book early. I once had a lesson and once landed I went to book in for the next lesson, and I had to wait 7 weeks.

Lesson hard learned. Took me 12 months and I was booking in every week.

[Iflyplainplanes]

I’ve met more MPL/integrated pilots from EZY than modular.

If you choose the modular route be prepared to be a flight instructor, it could be months it could be years. If thats not what you want to do then consider another field.

[CAVOKpilot]

Originally Posted by Iflyplainplanes

I’ve met more MPL/integrated pilots from EZY than modular.

If you choose the modular route be prepared to be a flight instructor, it could be months it could be years. If thats not what you want to do then consider another field.

Not strictly true. EasyJet are the only operator in UK still discriminating against the modular route. That policy will catch up with them and haunt them one day soon when the low hour demographic choose elsewhere. At present Jet2, TUI, BA, Aurigny, Blue island, Loganair all quite happily accepting modular. A big factor is that there aren’t enough low hour pilots arriving to the market from the integrated schools to meet the demand. Many on here say that isn’t the case but having just gone the recruitment process as a modular student, there is exceptional demand and not the numbers or talent there to meet it.

I sat an assessment recently and there were 13 integrated students there. Some had flown only 3 times in the past 3 months, another had been sent to the USA and didn’t fly at all and was brought back to the UK by their school and was sent to a third party school to finish their training…not good. Integrated pathway isn’t working efficiently at the moment. Perhaps because those modular pilots, now FIs (as this reply suggests they are) have been hoovered up by the airlines.

In October I sat my APS MCC. The 6 of us are now all employed by a mixture of the above. Have worked in the airlines for the past 6 years and there has been a positive shift in attitude towards the modular route.

[Speed_Trim_Fail]

Originally Posted by CAVOKpilot

Not strictly true. EasyJet are the only operator in UK still discriminating against the modular route. That policy will catch up with them and haunt them one day soon when the low hour demographic choose elsewhere. At present Jet2, TUI, BA, Aurigny, Blue island, Loganair all quite happily accepting modular. A big factor is that there aren’t enough low hour pilots arriving to the market from the integrated schools to meet the demand. Many on here say that isn’t the case but having just gone the recruitment process as a modular student, there is exceptional demand and not the numbers or talent there to meet it.

I sat an assessment recently and there were 13 integrated students there. Some had flown only 3 times in the past 3 months, another had been sent to the USA and didn’t fly at all and was brought back to the UK by their school and was sent to a third party school to finish their training…not good. Integrated pathway isn’t working efficiently at the moment. Perhaps because those modular pilots, now FIs (as this reply suggests they are) have been hoovered up by the airlines.

In October I sat my APS MCC. The 6 of us are now all employed by a mixture of the above. Have worked in the airlines for the past 6 years and there has been a positive shift in attitude towards the modular route.

For what it’s worth a good number of BA DEPs seem to come from the modular route at the moment - some really interesting flying backgrounds. I’ve no idea what the integrated vs modular split is of course. At the moment of course there is demand for crew…

[TheYorkshirePilot]

Originally Posted by Iflyplainplanes

I’ve met more MPL/integrated pilots from EZY than modular.

If you choose the modular route be prepared to be a flight instructor, it could be months it could be years. If thats not what you want to do then consider another field.

Im really sorry but this is extremely wide of the mark. I know of 6 modular cadets in just the last few months that have got a job at BA. It’s a lot less about the route you take and a lot more about the person you are + results you get.

[Iflyplainplanes]

Originally Posted by TheYorkshirePilot

Im really sorry but this is extremely wide of the mark. I know of 6 modular cadets in just the last few months that have got a job at BA. It’s a lot less about the route you take and a lot more about the person you are + results you get.

I am not sure how it’s wide of the mark. I have in my experience met more integrated and MPL FOs that work for easyjet. YMMV with BA thanks for sharing.

Also I don’t think it’s irresponsible to set expectations here. Rather than assuming you’ll get your 200 odd hours modular and get in the right hand seat. Assume you’ll need to instruct or similar for a long time before you do. Thats not a bad expectation to set. We should not be telling people looking to get into it that it’s a sure thing because it really isn’t.

[CAVOKpilot]

Originally Posted by Iflyplainplanes

I am not sure how it’s wide of the mark. I have in my experience met more integrated and MPL FOs that work for easyjet. YMMV with BA thanks for sharing.

Also I don’t think it’s irresponsible to set expectations here. Rather than assuming you’ll get your 200 odd hours modular and get in the right hand seat. Assume you’ll need to instruct or similar for a long time before you do. Thats not a bad expectation to set. We should not be telling people looking to get into it that it’s a sure thing because it really isn’t.

It’s not a sure thing either if you’ve gone integrated. Your chances are better if you’re airline associated of course but in the past 10 years I’ve known of integrated guys not find work years. You’re right regarding timing in one of your other posts. Though I would challenge that modular students arriving to the market now are not having to find work as FIs and wait longer. I agree that easyJet won’t touch modular but all the modular people I trained alongside are now all employed by other non-orange airlines. In 2 years from now who knows, but right now is a good time to be a modular pilot. Cheaper than integrated and access to the same opportunities. Modular pilots are laughing!

[605carsten]

Yup, MPL is not a real license… you are at mercy of the Airline and you are taught to read checklists and swing gear only. Modular gets you where you want to be quicker. The pilot factories prefer you to go intergrated as they then have your money and time is not of the essence any more… you will be twiddling thumbs alot and will listen to threats by the school saying you must acheive 99% average on the ATPL subjects as otherwise you wont get the job.

Ultimately, there is no surefire way into aviation.. if you cant get a successful interview, then you wont get much further if indeed airlines are the dream

[Iflyplainplanes]

Originally Posted by 605carsten

.

Ultimately, there is no surefire way into aviation.. if you cant get a successful interview, then you wont get much further if indeed airlines are the dream

and this is where I think the cost greatly outweighs the benefits. You could spend the same money and get multiple different qualifications. There are those who don’t make it for one reason or another and theres not enough of those voices.

Fly because you truly enjoy it if you can make a career out of it then great but it’s probably best to have very flexible and lower expectations than what often gets spoken about. This is where modular has it’s strengths in my opinion. You can truly see if you can make it work. Get your PPL and find yourself constantly renting the plane and using all your free time to fly for fun? Great consider more ratings and CPL. Able to make a bit of money out of it and can still stand it? Awesome keep going with more ratings, perhaps instruct. Find that the airlines have a window? Go for it. But it should be incidental to the costs/time you are putting in.

It’s great that the market is on an upswing right now but that should not mean putting 100k on the bet thats going to stay. Fully expect to be finishing on a downturn and having to maintain for years potentially. If you are happy with that then keep going.