Hour building - UK PPL holder in EASA-land?

[hegemon88]

Hello,

Is anyone currently in a situation similar to this one:

• UK PPL(A) held
• enrolled on a CPL+ME+IR combo in Poland (Bartolini Air/Smart Aviation/other)
• with 150 hours TT required to start CPL but still short of required PIC minimum for licence issue
• facing a problem now as ideally would like to fly remaining hours without returning from Poland to the UK just for that purpose, but no G-reg aircraft around?

/h88

[rudestuff]

Why not fly a Polish one?

[hegemon88]

Originally Posted by rudestuff

Why not fly a Polish one?

Good question. And the answer is: due to not being adequately licenced.

Some people take advantage (quite rightly so) of point E.2 of the Appendix 3 to Part-FCL, which only requires an ICAO-compliant PPL(A) licence at start of the modular CPL(A), and come to EASA-land with a UK Part-FCL PPL(A). That licence no longer allows you to fly EASA-registered aircraft.

Yes, there is a 28-day validation route provided by Commission Delegated Regulation (EU) 2020/723, but here's a catch: if it's Poland we're talking about, any non-standard issue, topic, application etc. will puzzle ULC (Polish NAA) so badly, that it will take months for them to respond and approve. It may be simpler and quicker for the UK PPL(A) holder to fly home and finish off the 20-30 PIC hours there.

I am talking about a "lacking 20-30 PIC hours, nearly finished training, skill test booked in three weeks' time, need a G-reg plane somewhere in Poland, and quickly" scenario.

[Contact Approach]

Originally Posted by hegemon88

Good question. And the answer is: due to not being adequately licenced.

Some people take advantage (quite rightly so) of point E.2 of the Appendix 3 to Part-FCL, which only requires an ICAO-compliant PPL(A) licence at start of the modular CPL(A), and come to EASA-land with a UK Part-FCL PPL(A). That licence no longer allows you to fly EASA-registered aircraft.

Yes, there is a 28-day validation route provided by Commission Delegated Regulation (EU) 2020/723, but here's a catch: if it's Poland we're talking about, any non-standard issue, topic, application etc. will puzzle ULC (Polish NAA) so badly, that it will take months for them to respond and approve. It may be simpler and quicker for the UK PPL(A) holder to fly home and finish off the 20-30 PIC hours there.

I am talking about a "lacking 20-30 PIC hours, nearly finished training, skill test booked in three weeks' time, need a G-reg plane somewhere in Poland, and quickly" scenario.

This really begs the question as to why you started the course without the required hours!?

[cacho22]

Hey, let me understand.
You got a ppl from the uk and then went to fly EASA planes in Europe without an EASA license?

[hegemon88]

What made you keyboard warriors think that this is about me? I simply asked "Is anyone currently in a situation similar to this one", RTFQ!

I run a flying club and DTO in Poznań (EPPO) and we get inquiries from pilots in the situation I described. We happen to have PA28s which haven't been moved from G- to SP- yet and I am currently considering my next steps. Moving to SP- can be done as planned, or I could leave one PA28 on G- in case such inquiries become regular. We have already saved a few UK PPL(A) holders in that scenario. All I wanted to achieve here was to get a feel if further demand is likely.

You can laugh and joke all you want, but I for one can see added value for commercial students coming to Poland in being able to start the training sooner and completing the hour building in the meantime while bashing the sim in the "big school".

This is the PA28 whose fate is to be decided:


G-BPDT at EPPO apron #1

[cacho22]

Thanks for your answer, and..first, I would never dare to laugh at you, nor to anyone else. I'm here to get advice and to learn.

I was just trying to understand what your situation was because I thought I was in a similar one.

I currently hold a PPL from the UK and when making my finances right, I'm afraid that I will never get to the 150 Hours to start my CPL UK training.

At a rate of £170 per hour in a C152 (fuel and other costs included) I will need around £25,500 to get those hours in the air, which at today's exchange rate is EUR30,000.

Therefore, I was thinking to make most of the hours in a cheaper place, like Poland. In this case there would be two possible escenarios:

a. I convert my UK PPL license into an EASA polish license. One "hour builder" provider from Poland told me that this costs EUR1000 and takes around 48 hours. (is it credible?)
b. I would need to fly an UK registered plane which should be maintained to UK CAA standars (Mechanics, anual, and so), so again I'm not sure how feasible, and cheap, is that in a country that is miles away from the UK.

Going back to your query, if you comply with b. then I might be very interested in what you have to offer

Thanks

p.s: check hour-building in Spain on google. (apparently I'm not allowed to post urls)

[hegemon88]

Originally Posted by cacho22

Thanks for your answer, and..first, I would never dare to laugh at you, nor to anyone else. I'm here to get advice and to learn.

I was just trying to understand what your situation was because I thought I was in a similar one.

So the joke is on me! I misunderstood what you have written and why, my apologies

Originally Posted by cacho22

I currently hold a PPL from the UK and when making my finances right, I'm afraid that I will never get to the 150 Hours to start my CPL UK training.

You seem to have budgeted for the whole 150 hours, but remember that you already have at least 47 hours from your PPL training and skill test. Roughly speaking, you are probably 100ish hours short of your CPL start requirement.

Originally Posted by cacho22

I would need to fly an UK registered plane which should be maintained to UK CAA standars (Mechanics, anual, and so), so again I'm not sure how feasible, and cheap, is that in a country that is miles away from the UK.

I am not only a dual-licenced pilot, but also a dual-licenced mechanic and I certify the work carried out on our G-reg aircraft, so it's all in hand.

Please stay in touch, perhaps we will be able to help.

/h88

[rudestuff]

Originally Posted by cacho22

Thanks for your answer, and..first, I would never dare to laugh at you, nor to anyone else. I'm here to get advice and to learn.

I was just trying to understand what your situation was because I thought I was in a similar one.

I currently hold a PPL from the UK and when making my finances right, I'm afraid that I will never get to the 150 Hours to start my CPL UK training.

At a rate of £170 per hour in a C152 (fuel and other costs included) I will need around £25,500 to get those hours in the air, which at today's exchange rate is EUR30,000.

Therefore, I was thinking to make most of the hours in a cheaper place, like Poland. In this case there would be two possible escenarios:

a. I convert my UK PPL license into an EASA polish license. One "hour builder" provider from Poland told me that this costs EUR1000 and takes around 48 hours. (is it credible?)
b. I would need to fly an UK registered plane which should be maintained to UK CAA standars (Mechanics, anual, and so), so again I'm not sure how feasible, and cheap, is that in a country that is miles away from the UK.

Going back to your query, if you comply with b. then I might be very interested in what you have to offer

Thanks

p.s: check hour-building in Spain on google. (apparently I'm not allowed to post urls)

1. No one should be paying much more than £100 per hour to hour build. For that money you can join a non-equity group in the UK or buy a block of 100+ hours in the US including flights and accommodation.
2. Your next target should not be the CPL - it should be 50 hours cross country then the IR - assuming you're intending on flying commercially.

[Contact Approach]

Originally Posted by hegemon88

So the joke is on me! I misunderstood what you have written and why, my apologies



You seem to have budgeted for the whole 150 hours, but remember that you already have at least 47 hours from your PPL training and skill test. Roughly speaking, you are probably 100ish hours short of your CPL start requirement.



I am not only a dual-licenced pilot, but also a dual-licenced mechanic and I certify the work carried out on our G-reg aircraft, so it's all in hand.

Please stay in touch, perhaps we will be able to help.

/h88

You come across as fairly hostile, might help your cause if you tweak it somewhat.