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UK Issued EASA PPL and now moving to Germany - Now what?!

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UK Issued EASA PPL and now moving to Germany - Now what?!

Old 18th Oct 2020, 14:08
  #1 (permalink)  
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Join Date: Oct 2020
Location: United Kingdom
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UK Issued EASA PPL and moving to Germany - Now what?!

Hello!

I have just passed obtained my brand new, UK Issued EASA PPL. However, i am just about to move to Germany in a couple of weeks...

In Germany, i have found a local flying club running both N Reg and a D Reg plane. I plan to join this club in order to do hour building whilst I am based there. Of course, like many others, I now have the worries surrounding Brexit and the UK leaving EASA, and to top it off I have my Class 1 medical booked at Birmingham tomorrow, which i wanted to get done before I go, so i don't start chucking money at hour building unnecessarily (I still feel it is worth getting the class one on Monday, but realise that it will maybe not mean anything outside the UK post 31 Dec, unless i transfer it).

I think there are two parts to my problem:
1. I need a way of actually being able to fly whilst I am there. I think my options are:
  • Convert my license to Germany, along with my new Class one in order to remain with EASA and therefore fly the D Reg planes there
  • Validate my license in Germany
  • Keep the UK PPL, Obtain a standalone FAA license, obtainable with a written exam undertaken there and a flight with an FAA examiner.
2. The question many are asking, of whether an EASA ATPL is more valuable than a UK one, this decision partly drives the last one.
I like many others truly hope they come up with some bilateral agreement, so this all goes away. I also believe that they will still action license requests after 31 Dec, as the UK PPL will still be ICAO compliant and therefore still transferable?

Does anyone have any advice? Pretty new to all this, I basically just want to fly in Germany for three years whilst studying for ATPLs somewhere!!


Last edited by ben5560; 19th Oct 2020 at 11:31.
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Old 18th Oct 2020, 20:14
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Join Date: Feb 2000
Location: UK
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I would suggest that you ask UK CAA to issue a separate UK-FCL PPL, and immediately you have that, SOLI your UK issued EASA PPL to Germany. Waste absolutely no time doing this, as the clock stops on December 31st and some authorities are already saying it's too late.

Also look into getting an FAA 61.75 PPL on the back of one of them, probably the German EASA Licence so you can fly N-reg aeroplanes that are available to you. That you don't need to hurry about.

Genghis the Engineer is offline  
Old 19th Oct 2020, 11:30
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Emailed the German LBA over the weekend, already got a reply this morning! Good sign.

However they are asking if I have an instrument rating (I don't). If I did, I just submit a form, if I don't then I need to see them at a regional office.

Unsure why this is, have asked the question. If I can transfer it, that would be ideal. I'll ask the CAA about getting a UK license as well, but I imagine that will obviously cost, and take alot of time. I don't need to fly G Reg aircraft for three years, so not sure if that's truly worth it?
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Old 19th Oct 2020, 23:02
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Join Date: Feb 2000
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The IR represents a high internationally-standardised level of flying skill, hence they're presumably happy to do that quickly and easily.

The separate UK PPL will cost you somewhere around £40-£50 and will ensure you have a UK licence when you return, as none of us have a clue how things will progress over the next three years for UK/EASA co-operation, I'd strongly recommend getting that done, even if you have to revalidate it with a proficiency check when you return to Britain.
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Old 20th Oct 2020, 06:33
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Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Germany
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Private licenses are indeed issued by a local office (Luftamt). You will probably also need a reliability check (ZÜP) to make sure you do not have a criminal record, drink driving convictions etc. This can take six weeks plus . So presuming you fly on your UK PPL till the end of the year I would start the process soon if you want to continue flying in the new year. You do need to allow for the fact that you will be a trailblazer and the local office is unlikely to have had much experience in converting UK PPLs.

It is obviously sensible to make sure you can get a class one medical before doing any hour building or further training. However whether a UK medical is acceptable to the Luftamt after the end of this year is by no means certain. I remember decades ago having a surreal discussion with my local Luftamt that my class 1 (German) medical met the requirement for a class 2 to issue a gliding PPL. Obviously it did, but it took a call from the doctor to persuade them. I tell this story not to make fun of anyone but to illustrate that there is a deep seated bureaucratic thoroughness when dealing with stuff outside their comfort zone.
lederhosen is offline  
Old 20th Oct 2020, 07:09
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Join Date: Apr 2019
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sound advice.

Everything PPL w/o IR is handled locally. Get in touch with them now on what they require.
Consider moving the license to Austria - as some Germans have done. More expensive but no ZÜP bullshit.
BDAttitude is offline  
Old 20th Oct 2020, 07:52
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Join Date: Feb 2000
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I've heard good things about Malta as a state to transfer EASA licences to. Austro Control have a good reputation, but I think that they've already put the shutters up and aren't accepting any new transfers from the UK. Personally I'm just transferring to Ireland, as I have reasons to visit the country anyhow, and they work in English: however they're not cheap.

I've also heard issues getting the Germans, because of their strict medical confidentiality rules, to transfer medical records back out - which may be another reason to pick an EU country other than Germany.
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Old 20th Oct 2020, 09:06
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Join Date: Apr 2019
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The process was changed 2016 - no longer valid for transfers or initial examinations after that date.
Before that date, medical data was transfered anonymously (until 2014) and pseudonomyously (2014-2016) from the surgeon to LBA (CAA) and therefore could not be made available to the receiving country of a license transfer ... as I said, no longer an issue now.
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Old 20th Oct 2020, 19:28
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All great advice thank you. The LBA gave the details for one of their local offices, who I have contacted just in case they can do it. Otherwise, I believe I am too late for Ireland, but did have a brief look at Malta. Austria is probably a no go as mentioned.

I will ring the CAA tomorrow and ask about a separate UK license issue, surprised its only £40-50 though? Do they just base it on the existing EASA license they've issued, hence less work?

I passed my Class 1 yesterday at Birmingham, was told it will be valid under EASA regardless and that they will be able to renew it next year as well, which is good. I am hoping once this all calms down, license transfers from a UK license to EASA will be possible if a bilateral agreement hasn't already been put in place. Failing all that, I have my FAA backup option for hour building.
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Old 20th Oct 2020, 19:40
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lederhosen

Makes sense thank you - this was the contact details the LBA gave me for a local office, have emailed them and will see what they say:

Niedersächsische Landesbehörde für Straßenbau und Verkehr
Zentraler Geschäftsbereich 3
Dezernat 33 -Luftverkehr-
Göttinger Chaussee 76A
30453 Hannover
Telefon + 49 511 3034-01
Fax + 49 511 3034-2099
E-Mail: [email protected]
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Old 21st Oct 2020, 17:17
  #11 (permalink)  
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Join Date: Oct 2020
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CAA said i can't apply for a UK separate license until after 31 Dec, and it looks like I have passed all the deadlines for a transfer to an EASA country.

So on the EASA front, i think I will just have to hope it can still be used in Germany in the new year... the CAA woman on the phone seemed to think an announcement would be made at the end of the month...but who knows.

On the FAA front, I found a way to get an FAA 61.75 license based on my EASA license, with a Designated Pilot Examiner (DPE) based in Le Touquet for $350 all in (excluding the £46 for the CAA authority to verify license info form).. This would at least allow me to hour build on the N Reg Cessna aircraft at the club in Germany.
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