IR Training Software
Thread Starter
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Hampshire
Posts: 35
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
IR Training Software
Hey everyone,
Just wanted to ask what is the IR computer training software of choice these days. I've done a bit of searching and seem to get mixed reviews of the various software. I'm running a Macbook Pro so something compatible is the obvious choice, I just wondered if there was a current "industry standard".
I'm currently doing the ATPL(A) theory, but want to get ahead of the game in my spare time.
Just wanted to ask what is the IR computer training software of choice these days. I've done a bit of searching and seem to get mixed reviews of the various software. I'm running a Macbook Pro so something compatible is the obvious choice, I just wondered if there was a current "industry standard".
I'm currently doing the ATPL(A) theory, but want to get ahead of the game in my spare time.
Join Date: May 2005
Location: UK
Age: 47
Posts: 71
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Hi Dragonlight,
People rave about RANT. I've only used it briefly, but I believe it's the only affordable sim to simulate ADF dip (a characteristic of the ADF causing the needle to "dip" when turning towards the beacon, for example).
I mainly used MS Flight Sim X at home. I found the handling aspect rubbish, but you can stick the autopilot on and then place yourself in "random" positions around an NDB hold and then figure out the best way to enter and subsequently remain in the hold. You can pick it up (a new copy) for less than £20 these days. Defo worth it IMHO. I'm not sure if you can get one that is compatible with Mac.
Good luck!
People rave about RANT. I've only used it briefly, but I believe it's the only affordable sim to simulate ADF dip (a characteristic of the ADF causing the needle to "dip" when turning towards the beacon, for example).
I mainly used MS Flight Sim X at home. I found the handling aspect rubbish, but you can stick the autopilot on and then place yourself in "random" positions around an NDB hold and then figure out the best way to enter and subsequently remain in the hold. You can pick it up (a new copy) for less than £20 these days. Defo worth it IMHO. I'm not sure if you can get one that is compatible with Mac.
Good luck!
Join Date: May 2001
Posts: 10,815
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Its called Rant XL by oddsoft.
Almost all the simulator proffessional stuff is windows. Rant you can run it under an emulator on a Mac and it seems to work fine.
Oddsoft Ltd
And look under news for a mac statment.
Almost all the simulator proffessional stuff is windows. Rant you can run it under an emulator on a Mac and it seems to work fine.
Oddsoft Ltd
And look under news for a mac statment.
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: -
Posts: 1,175
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I myself think that a normal simulator for PC may help you in the instrumental stage of your training. As somebody pointed out default aircraft suck when it comes down to handling, so try to get every kind of addon made by Carenado, that's the only thing I can tell you.
How many schools do actually use Microsoft Flight Simulator/Prepar3d or X-Plane for training purposes? I've already come across some.
How many schools do actually use Microsoft Flight Simulator/Prepar3d or X-Plane for training purposes? I've already come across some.
Join Date: Sep 1999
Location: on this planet
Posts: 102
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
For your IR course.
It is either RANT (excellent) or Luiz Monteiro.
MS FlightSim - did not help and you will waste time tbh.
With RANT and Luiz Monteiro software you will understand the raw data and get your head around the basics without faffing around trying to fly the aircraft.
My experience was that once you have nailed the concepts and know what the needles are doing and what they tell you. You will have additional capacity to then concentrate and build on handling and fitting in all the procedures etc....
Using RANT and practising will in turn save additional IR hours and loads of cash......
Best of Luck
It is either RANT (excellent) or Luiz Monteiro.
MS FlightSim - did not help and you will waste time tbh.
With RANT and Luiz Monteiro software you will understand the raw data and get your head around the basics without faffing around trying to fly the aircraft.
My experience was that once you have nailed the concepts and know what the needles are doing and what they tell you. You will have additional capacity to then concentrate and build on handling and fitting in all the procedures etc....
Using RANT and practising will in turn save additional IR hours and loads of cash......
Best of Luck
Last edited by AMS; 21st Jan 2013 at 16:57.
Join Date: May 2005
Location: UK
Age: 47
Posts: 71
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I agree with AMS that Rant is probably the preferred option, but at £80-90 quid....
I have to disagree with AMS about MS FSX. It is not a toy if used correctly with an understanding of its limitations. I found it very useful (during my IR) to plan before a training flight and to debrief what went well or not so well after a flight. From my point of view it helped my situational awareness. You can go through a flight and carry out checks and briefs as you would during the real ME/IR flight.
Get the flows right on the ground. Be self critical and keep practising until smooth. Especially if you get an add-on for the plane you will be flying. You could even spend a bit of time getting the panel to look exactly like your training aircraft (I didn't get too far with that though).
Now that MS FSX is at 20 quid I think it's a bargain!
I have to disagree with AMS about MS FSX. It is not a toy if used correctly with an understanding of its limitations. I found it very useful (during my IR) to plan before a training flight and to debrief what went well or not so well after a flight. From my point of view it helped my situational awareness. You can go through a flight and carry out checks and briefs as you would during the real ME/IR flight.
Get the flows right on the ground. Be self critical and keep practising until smooth. Especially if you get an add-on for the plane you will be flying. You could even spend a bit of time getting the panel to look exactly like your training aircraft (I didn't get too far with that though).
Now that MS FSX is at 20 quid I think it's a bargain!
Last edited by Darth_Bovine; 22nd Jan 2013 at 08:38. Reason: Mixed up who I was agreeing/disagreeing with!
Join Date: May 2005
Location: UK
Age: 47
Posts: 71
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
How many minutes is £20!? 
I see your point but for the cost of a few pints FSX is a good tool. Most schools have Rant installed somewhere so you can use away at that. I just used FSX and it worked out for me. YMMV.
I see your point but for the cost of a few pints FSX is a good tool. Most schools have Rant installed somewhere so you can use away at that. I just used FSX and it worked out for me. YMMV.
Last edited by Darth_Bovine; 22nd Jan 2013 at 08:54.
Join Date: May 2001
Posts: 10,815
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Ones a pro bit of training software as you say used by most IR training schools the RAF etc.
And the other one is a mass market game with a dodgy flight simulation engine.
One is designed to lead you through instrument flying in a logical manner to build situational awarness with realistic instrument responses and lesson plans
And the other one lets you loose with no plan and allows you to develope bad habits.
One costs 80 quid.
The other one costs 20 quid which for flight training is proberly more than its worth. Added in the hardware required to get it to function in any sort of meaning full way. So Joystick needs to be added to the cost. And actually the older 32 bit versions are better for instrument training if you can get them to work on your operating system. You should be able to get that for a fiver which is realistically is its worth.
In the grand scope of keeping costs down RANT will save you far in excess of its cost so is good economics.
MSFX for a quick wazz round a procedure once you know what you are doing before you do it for the first time it is good enough. Actually learning about instrument flying it is useless and developes bad habits.
And the other one is a mass market game with a dodgy flight simulation engine.
One is designed to lead you through instrument flying in a logical manner to build situational awarness with realistic instrument responses and lesson plans
And the other one lets you loose with no plan and allows you to develope bad habits.
One costs 80 quid.
The other one costs 20 quid which for flight training is proberly more than its worth. Added in the hardware required to get it to function in any sort of meaning full way. So Joystick needs to be added to the cost. And actually the older 32 bit versions are better for instrument training if you can get them to work on your operating system. You should be able to get that for a fiver which is realistically is its worth.
In the grand scope of keeping costs down RANT will save you far in excess of its cost so is good economics.
MSFX for a quick wazz round a procedure once you know what you are doing before you do it for the first time it is good enough. Actually learning about instrument flying it is useless and developes bad habits.
Join Date: May 2005
Location: UK
Age: 47
Posts: 71
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
MSFX for a quick wazz round a procedure once you know what you are doing before you do it for the first time it is good enough. Actually learning about instrument flying it is useless and developes bad habits.
As for hardware: you can fly it with a mouse and autopilot - it is not about the flying dynamics but more about the procedures and situational awareness. Like I said: I found it useful for IR training for what it was. Take what you learn in the FNPT2 or real a/c and practise in MSFS. Rant does not allow you to practice the full procedures and checks with a realistic control panel which you can customise to look exactly like your training a/c (although it's been a while since I used Rant). Each software has pros and cons but to dismiss FSX as
a mass market game
I'm not saying don't use Rant. Use all the tools you have to keep practised.
I suspect we will have to agree to disagree on the usefulness of of FSX.
(PS: I've not used 'X-Plane' but I suspect it would be equally as useful - or not from Mad Jock's point of view - as MS FSX)
Join Date: May 2001
Posts: 10,815
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Mate I am a 5000 hour plus line training Captain and also 1000 hour Instructor at PPL level. The flight simulation engine is a pile of rubbish.
Maybe I have a little more exposure to instrument flying (3000 hours manual flying in a old heap of a TP) and teaching than you have hence I think RANT is pretty good and worth 80 quid and MSFX a pile of poo for most instruction outside having a wazz around to get the flow of a procedure with radio setting nav aids and stepdowns, turns and speed reductions. But if the basic skills arn't there to begin with or they are just maturing it can do more harm than good.
And I get enough flying daily so as such I don't have a copy of either. Skyrim gets a good hammering though.
RANT is not a simulator it is a radio navigation tutor. It is a stuctured course to understand the instruments, the information they are giving you and how to interprete it.
As this is what the OP wants. Rant fits the bill exactly. MSFX would just be a game with potential to give issues when real instrument training starts.
If during the proper instrument training they think that MSFX may be of help they can spend a fiver and crack on and use it in a strutured manner.
But the FO's I line train usually start off with that theory but quite quickly stop using it because it just ain't an aircraft doing 210knts with ATC blaring in your ear and some moaning line training Captain in the LHS seat telling you to keep the speed up. Usually because you have a heavy up your arse and ATC will blow a fuse if you come back to 140knts at 12 miles or 160 knts on the downwind.
So may be thats the reason why we will have to agree to disagree well until you get a load of teaching hours and operation hours under your belt then you might agree with me.
Maybe I have a little more exposure to instrument flying (3000 hours manual flying in a old heap of a TP) and teaching than you have hence I think RANT is pretty good and worth 80 quid and MSFX a pile of poo for most instruction outside having a wazz around to get the flow of a procedure with radio setting nav aids and stepdowns, turns and speed reductions. But if the basic skills arn't there to begin with or they are just maturing it can do more harm than good.
And I get enough flying daily so as such I don't have a copy of either. Skyrim gets a good hammering though.
RANT is not a simulator it is a radio navigation tutor. It is a stuctured course to understand the instruments, the information they are giving you and how to interprete it.
I'm currently doing the ATPL(A) theory, but want to get ahead of the game in my spare time.
If during the proper instrument training they think that MSFX may be of help they can spend a fiver and crack on and use it in a strutured manner.
But the FO's I line train usually start off with that theory but quite quickly stop using it because it just ain't an aircraft doing 210knts with ATC blaring in your ear and some moaning line training Captain in the LHS seat telling you to keep the speed up. Usually because you have a heavy up your arse and ATC will blow a fuse if you come back to 140knts at 12 miles or 160 knts on the downwind.
So may be thats the reason why we will have to agree to disagree well until you get a load of teaching hours and operation hours under your belt then you might agree with me.
Join Date: May 2005
Location: UK
Age: 47
Posts: 71
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I never said Rant wasn't any good (in my OP I actually recommended it 1st). I was disagreeing with your total dismissal of FSX. I wouldn't use it for any more than it is. But IMHO I found it useful during the IR. And again from my original post I said the flight engine was rubbish so I'm not arguing over that (although you keep mentioning it).
For the OP I'll concede that Rant may be better as he hasn't started the flying part yet (but that's what I said in my original reply). In fact he might be safer just concentrating on the books at his stage...
I'm not going to get into a pissing contest with you about who has more hours or the bigger wang/watch/car. I'll tell you for free that you have more hours and experience in flying than me for sure. But we all start from somewhere. There's always a bigger fish.
For the OP I'll concede that Rant may be better as he hasn't started the flying part yet (but that's what I said in my original reply). In fact he might be safer just concentrating on the books at his stage...
I'm not going to get into a pissing contest with you about who has more hours or the bigger wang/watch/car. I'll tell you for free that you have more hours and experience in flying than me for sure. But we all start from somewhere. There's always a bigger fish.
Join Date: May 2001
Posts: 10,815
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
In my experence MSFX is a game and mostly a complete pile of poo for training.
I am sure you have a bigger watch as I have a 90 quid eco drive zulu hand plain one, and I don't own a car. As its -30 outside where I am now the toddger competion will have to wait even if I have my M&S long pants on.
I am sure you have a bigger watch as I have a 90 quid eco drive zulu hand plain one, and I don't own a car. As its -30 outside where I am now the toddger competion will have to wait even if I have my M&S long pants on.
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: UK
Posts: 226
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Dragonlight,
Some time ago I saw an add about ifr training software online, written by the same chaps who sell the interview stuff. If I'm allowed to mention it it's cockpitweb. If the mods don't want it mentioned they can delete at will.
Never tried the software as I used Rant a lot for my IR. But i have been looking for something to "fly" IFR as well (other than MSFS)and reading the website it looks like a simple joystick will suffice as the program auto trims the aircraft for you so you can concentrate on flying, timing,tracking etc. Also comes with a structured syllabus with lessons and an ifr book. Don't know if the authors are UK pilots or not.
Good luck and enjoy the course.
Some time ago I saw an add about ifr training software online, written by the same chaps who sell the interview stuff. If I'm allowed to mention it it's cockpitweb. If the mods don't want it mentioned they can delete at will.
Never tried the software as I used Rant a lot for my IR. But i have been looking for something to "fly" IFR as well (other than MSFS)and reading the website it looks like a simple joystick will suffice as the program auto trims the aircraft for you so you can concentrate on flying, timing,tracking etc. Also comes with a structured syllabus with lessons and an ifr book. Don't know if the authors are UK pilots or not.
Good luck and enjoy the course.
Join Date: May 2001
Posts: 10,815
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Oh I can recommend M&S long pants when it gets cold and your flying. So if your doing your IR in some auld heap of a dutchess in the middle of winter I would recommend them along with a pair of thinsulate gortex magnum boots.