Jabiru hour building for CPL
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Auckland
Posts: 61
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Jabiru hour building for CPL
I am hoping for some clarity on what restrictions there are for PPL holders hour building before starting the CPL. Basically I am looking at the possibility of hiring a 4 seater Jabiru aircraft in the US for a block of 50 hrs, however I hear different stories regarding the validation of the hours towards my P1 time.
With the CAA now closed for the weekend, please can someone help?
With the CAA now closed for the weekend, please can someone help?
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: London, Berlin, Bucharest
Posts: 284
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
providing you have the relevant ratings inorder to fly the aircrat, there is no reason why you cant fly it within the privilages of your licence.
eg: you have an SEP rating on your PPL. you cant fly a Sennica or at night unless you have a night rating.
eg: you have an SEP rating on your PPL. you cant fly a Sennica or at night unless you have a night rating.
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Auckland
Posts: 61
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Thanks for your post. The answer is no, no Ultra/microlight aircraft and no light sport category full stop - CAA couldn't understand either but rules are rules despite the fact that most other countries allow it on Light sports.
C172 it is then!!
C172 it is then!!
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: York
Age: 53
Posts: 797
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Which is a bit silly isn't it when any modern 3-axis microlights have far better performance than a C150.
I also think this stance is hitting PPL (a) training pretty hard. As all the costs such as the requirement for licensed aerodromes, can't use petrol station mogas, but the microlight school based the same aerodrome (even flying the same aircraft!) can and when the fire crew (is there really a safety case for them anyway?) go home then PPL(a) training has to stop but the mirolight school can continue to fly.
It's amazing with the current regulations that there is as much PPL(a) flying as there is.
Final rant - Why did I bother doing PPL, ATPL exams, FI course when I could have simply done PPL(m) and then a microlight instructor course and be on loads more money.
I also think this stance is hitting PPL (a) training pretty hard. As all the costs such as the requirement for licensed aerodromes, can't use petrol station mogas, but the microlight school based the same aerodrome (even flying the same aircraft!) can and when the fire crew (is there really a safety case for them anyway?) go home then PPL(a) training has to stop but the mirolight school can continue to fly.
It's amazing with the current regulations that there is as much PPL(a) flying as there is.
Final rant - Why did I bother doing PPL, ATPL exams, FI course when I could have simply done PPL(m) and then a microlight instructor course and be on loads more money.
Last edited by Mickey Kaye; 27th Sep 2008 at 21:11.
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: South Wales
Age: 42
Posts: 829
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
What about an A/C like MiniMax, CH701 or a Quickie Q200?
Are they also exempt from hour building on? I hear you can fly some of the above for around £25ph, I'm sure more can be read on the PFA/LAA website but picking up one of these planes and flying in VFR on quiet weekends would be awesome! ... and relatively cheap.
Are they also exempt from hour building on? I hear you can fly some of the above for around £25ph, I'm sure more can be read on the PFA/LAA website but picking up one of these planes and flying in VFR on quiet weekends would be awesome! ... and relatively cheap.
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Basingstoke
Age: 48
Posts: 159
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I agree the rules here seem bizarre. I originally got an NPPL SEP, flying PA38 and PA28. Then switched to microlights - the Icarus C42 and the Eurostar. Both of the microlights easily outperform a PA38, and aren't far behind a PA28 in terms of climb performance and cruise. Also, there are Group A versions of both of these planes. I've sinced upgraded to the JAR PPL.
Yet, it would seem that these 'microlight' hours don't count. Doesn't bother me - I'm not aiming at an ATPL. The rules made sense 20 years ago when microlights meant flexwings and dangerous looking bits of scaffoldpole with a 2 stroke bolted to it. But today, the gap between a modern microlight and your average basic trainer is fag paper thin TBH.
The previous poster made an interesting point about instructing. No CPL groundschool being required for microlight instructors. Having experienced both 'types' of instructor I can honestly say, at PPL level, there isn't much to choose between them - I've seen differing standards of instruction in both camps. I did hear a rumour than microlight instuctors may be allowed to instruct SEPs for the NPPL syllabus but I guess there's no truth in that?
Yet, it would seem that these 'microlight' hours don't count. Doesn't bother me - I'm not aiming at an ATPL. The rules made sense 20 years ago when microlights meant flexwings and dangerous looking bits of scaffoldpole with a 2 stroke bolted to it. But today, the gap between a modern microlight and your average basic trainer is fag paper thin TBH.
The previous poster made an interesting point about instructing. No CPL groundschool being required for microlight instructors. Having experienced both 'types' of instructor I can honestly say, at PPL level, there isn't much to choose between them - I've seen differing standards of instruction in both camps. I did hear a rumour than microlight instuctors may be allowed to instruct SEPs for the NPPL syllabus but I guess there's no truth in that?
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: South Wales
Age: 42
Posts: 829
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
After reading this post I guessed the minimax and the like could be used for hour building? ... Now I am not so sure?
Paying £100 to fly a 152/172 for an hour will soon make a huge dent in my bank account, but flying a smaller 'craft with low running costs seems like more smiles to the pound.
There seems to be plenty of smaller planes for sale with realistic running costs ... Evans VP1 is another.
Paying £100 to fly a 152/172 for an hour will soon make a huge dent in my bank account, but flying a smaller 'craft with low running costs seems like more smiles to the pound.
There seems to be plenty of smaller planes for sale with realistic running costs ... Evans VP1 is another.
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: York
Age: 53
Posts: 797
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
And the Evans VP-1 is a great example. Those hours can count towards a PPL(a), CPL, ATPL etc. Yet hours in an Icarus C42 don't. What muppet thinks up these regulations.
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Basingstoke
Age: 48
Posts: 159
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I thought the MiniMax was a microlight? They are certainly flown by people with just a NPPL (M).
I'd offer a word of caution with such a plan. I've previously been advised that airlines like to see some structure to hours building. A plane such as the MiniMax flies at c60kts and has a 1.5 hour range. Getting anywhere fast could become tedious. Although it would be great fun.
I'd offer a word of caution with such a plan. I've previously been advised that airlines like to see some structure to hours building. A plane such as the MiniMax flies at c60kts and has a 1.5 hour range. Getting anywhere fast could become tedious. Although it would be great fun.
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: South Wales
Age: 42
Posts: 829
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Dont think I'll plan on getting a minimax quite yet then 
Gross weight 700 lbs.
Top speed 80mph
Cruise speed 75mph
Design load factors +4.0 -2.0
Cheap on fuel ... And removable wings for easy hangarage.
Shame as they looked like pretty good fun on calm summer evenings
A 152 will cruise at 115mph ... so it's not like you're comparing a Eurofighter with a Sopwith Camel, but I guess you just can't argue with the regulations.
Gross weight 700 lbs.
Top speed 80mph
Cruise speed 75mph
Design load factors +4.0 -2.0
Cheap on fuel ... And removable wings for easy hangarage.
Shame as they looked like pretty good fun on calm summer evenings
A 152 will cruise at 115mph ... so it's not like you're comparing a Eurofighter with a Sopwith Camel, but I guess you just can't argue with the regulations.
