To find the "right" FTO in the US is kinda....

[INNflight]

......hard!

I've spent the past three months probably surfing the net, searching on google, pprune threads etc....

I'd want to gain my PPL CPL and fATPL ab-initio in the US, mainly because the costs for the same training are close to double in Austria.

I feel like I've seen 200 FTO websites in the past week, and they all claim to be highly professional and "the best" in the industry.

I've had a good search on pprune (not too easy as "US" is not a qualified search term... ) for similar threads, but didn't really find one suiting my needs.

Here's the question.......
How do / (did?) you decide for a FTO in the US if you do not have any license so far? What should make the difference as they all seem to be "the same"?

Btw,
would you recommend training at a school doing JAA training already or should I get the conversion course after completion? What makes more sense for a European?

Thanks a lot in advance

[AlphaMale]

There are 4 schools in Florida that offer JAA CPL.

OBA, OFT, EFT and Naples.

All seem to have people praising them and cursing them. For me it's very difficult to work out the good ones from the bad ones, it's taken me 2 or 3 years so research and I'm still none the wiser.

Getting both FAA CPL and FAA IR is anther option and then converting them back here at a highly recommended UK FTO. By doing an FAA CPL/IR you have far more schools to choose from than just the 4 above.

Keep researching and don't dive into the first one you see, between the hidden costs and nightmare FTO's you need to be careful.

Good luck

[cirruscrystal]

I would suggest EAA to get faa cpl - an excellent outfit i can vouch first hand. One other piece of advice - DO NOT go anywhere near Naples Air Centre for flight training, you will regret it

[INNflight]

Thanks for all your inputs!

I'm quite unsure whether FAA + conversion or JAA from the beginning would be the best way. Several pilots I know flying bizjets, light props and in the military tell me to get the JAA done from the beginning, people here consider converting as a better option

So far, lots of comments about Florida, thx for that. How about the other lower states? Any JAA training approved FTO with a good reputation?

I don't really care going for the cheapest school, but I want to have a quality one where people treat you not just as their business, but somehow really try to be your mentor whatever hehe.

I've heard about Rainbow Aviation and Group3 Aviation in SoCal. Heard they're quite good.

A friend of mine did his training at Prairie Air Service in near Wichita, Kansas. Anyone heard of those? He said it's by no means anything fancy and a very small school, but that chief instructor has like 23k total time and more than 18k in instructing

Thanks!

[INNflight]

I'd very much prefer JAA from the beginning of course

[INNflight]

Then read alpha male above..........

Decided to ask again because his reply was about Florida schools only.

Didn't know these are supposed to be the only ones, but I will definitely have another look through the web.

Thanks for your help.

[Dane-Ger]

Here is a list of all the UK CAA approved training organisations

http://www.caa.co.uk/docs/33/Approve...20Doc%2031.pdf

As far as I know at present there are only the four Florida schools that are CAA approved for CPL, although many other British schools have partnerships with American FTO's (for PPL and hour building as you only need an ICAO PPL to start ATPL theory and CPL flight training).

regards D-G

[Finnur]

OBA

I was at the OBA in november 2007. Great fun and hard work and a lot of very nice students. Not OBAs fault that one of the runways was closed the whole period and we had some days on the ground, irritating but thats life. Most of the instructors are ok and you get what you pay for and not for a cent more. I´m a fairly old guy 60 summers old, and I got my PPL in 4 weeks with 12 days on the ground, so I am sure you can do it on 3 weeks if the wex is ok. But don´t go overthere unprepaired thinking that is pure holiday!! Read the books before you go. Good luck and have a nice time.

[velj]

Rainbow

Steer well clear of this cowboy outfit - they will take all your money and not give you much in return !

Lots of complaints over the years - have personal knowledge ! Never a student but spoke with many who were and totally dissatisfied.

[BHenderson]

Why do people rave so much about Florida? The weather is for half the time and it's completely flat! California wins hands down IMHO. From Los Angeles we have sea level to 10,000ft+ mountains about 15 minutes. The weather is also far more conducive to training. But you are always careful of the Santa Ana winds, which makes you very good at reading weather charts.

I agree completely with velj - stay clear of Rainbow. They have had two accidents in the 7 weeks that I've been out here, not counting the number of near misses I've witnessed. I was disappointed with Group 3 Aviation when I visited the other week. It felt too much like a pilot factory.

If you want my advice, do your ATPLs first and then come across the pond. I would recommend Angel City Flyers at Long Beach. I cannot fault them in any way for the training I received (FAA ME CPL/IR). Everybody is dedicated to the training. (e.g. We arrived back from my qualifying cross country at midnight and started next day at 8am.) My training came in significantly under budget, which is I believe is testament to the training. This is a fairly small school, but they have a very good working relationship with the FAA. The management is British/Irish and they are receiving the D-Jet aircraft and simulator when they are released. You wouldn't be the only European there either. If you want any more information on anything let me know.

Bobby

[civil aviation]

Why Are These Rubbish Attacks Allowed?

Amused to see that after the correct comment (and prediction !) from Alphamale, it took little time for the attacks to commence. Criticising training and competitors is a sadly endemic and typically English trait so.....
Cirruscrystal comes out to knock Naples with neither evidence nor explanation- were you ever there !?
velj then poses with (unspecified) 'personal knowledge' to pop at OBA but 'never a student' !
It might be OK to post critical details which can be checked by the FTO, e.g. I did an ABC at XYZ in 2007 and it was unsatisfactory because: with list of specific details of defined problems.
However, cannot understand why moderator allows anonymous, infantile and unsupported rubbishing which wouldn't be accepted by any tabloid editor let alone a court.
Anyone agree with me?

[B2N2]

D-Jet aircraft and simulator in the next few months.

Mmmm...I doubt that.
The D-jet is not scheduled for delivery until 2nd Q 2009.

[The Red Knight]

I have had experience at the afore mentioned school. I went there to hour build and managed all of it in 3 weeks. From what I seen it was ok for hour building and PPL. Some guys doing there PPL were going over the promised 3 weeks due to weather etc. But thats the nature of Flight Training.

However the guys doing the CPL were fairly unhappy. Nothing to do with the instructors, who were top notch! Mostly to do with a certain CAA examiner who seems to be taking quite alot to do with that school, a rather unsavoury character with a bit of a history.

[Silent Witness]

I was a student at OBA, and it was poor. Our accomodation was disgraceful, we were plagued by instructor shortages and aircraft shortages. The instructors were great chaps, just not enough of them. After spending 5 minutes with the delightful owner, one wishes one had taken a sawn off on holiday with them . . . .

[AlphaMale]

Amused to see that after the correct comment (and prediction !) from Alphamale, it took little time for the attacks to commence.

However, cannot understand why moderator allows anonymous, infantile and unsupported rubbishing which wouldn't be accepted by any tabloid editor let alone a court.
Anyone agree with me?

Well I'd agree, there are far too many posts on here with no proof/back up of why they think the school didn't give a good service or give the student what they expected.

But after 3 years of researching this forum I have found evidence that all 4 schools seem to have bad press. My original choice of doing the EFT Multi APP course went in the bin after a few PM's and I decided to research the other 3. After reading the current EFT thread about people not getting their refund I'm glad I didn't waste any more time than I did in planning when I could get there.

I have found very little bad press about certain US FAA flight schools such as EAA and UK JAA schools such as Airways / Aeros etc.

I'll be getting in contact with EAA soon for prices / required time for FAA PPL / FI : student ratio etc. Unless of course I find some really bad press .... (Nothing so far).

As for the moderators moderating the 'attacks' on the schools, I wouldn't want that job! They'd have their hands full for sure.

[civil aviation]

Numbers Game

'Well I'd agree, there are far too many posts on here with no proof/back up of why they think the school didn't give a good service or give the student what they expected. But after 3 years of researching this forum I have found evidence that all 4 schools seem to have bad press'.

After 3 years, that should be no surprise but the proportion of 'bad press' relates to the number of customers and people on this forum- some of whom are either barmy or malicious mischief-makers (see above examples of their rubbish).
On the numbers, a busy FTO will have much more 'bad press' than any quiet FTO in the US or UK. You will always hear and read more negatives about the big and well-known JAA FTO's e.g. OBA and OFT but they may well be better, as well as cheaper, than all the others in bothe US and UK. EFT seems to have some... er... unusual issues at present (see another thread) so the jury is out on them. Also, this is not an American site so don't assume that any FAA FTO is 'better' than a JAA FTO in the US.

[Greg2041]

a busy FTO will have much more 'bad press' than any quiet FTO in the US or UK.

Yes but the good press should outweigh the bad press. I decided against learning to fly in the US based on reports, one from a close family member who was shocked at the dangerous antics that were performed. I've heard this more than once. I'm sure it is instructor dependent and there will be some good ones out there but it does appear to be a bit of lottery.

Good luck!

Greg

[AlphaMale]

On the numbers, a busy FTO will have much more 'bad press' than any quiet FTO in the US or UK.
Also, this is not an American site so don't assume that any FAA FTO is 'better' than a JAA FTO in the US.

As the post says above, a big school should have a lot of happy students too. I know people shout louder when they have had a bad experience but there is simply too much bad press most with evidence of these big JAA FTO's. I can't make any comment as I've not visited any (yet).

I'm not only looking on here for feedback on the schools, many schools like EAA have been talked about on other forums such as the American version of pprune ... and dare I say it, nobody has a bad thing to say about a handful of FAA flight schools in the US.

Same goes for a handful of UK schools, I've yet to come across any ex-students saying they were unhappy with CTC or Airways to name but a few.