How much comfort can you take from a PPL?

[Peter O'C]

Hello Everybody,

Maybe those of you who have achieved the transition from PPL to ATPL (or ATP in the USA) could provide some insight here.

I refer to the ground school exams and theoretical knowledge required.

Clearly ATPL level theory is much larger in scope and more detailed in content than PPL theory, but the basic principles must be the same?

My question is this; Upon gaining your PPL, how much confidence can you take from the PPL exam successes, that you will go on to succeed at the ATPL exams?

Or put another way: The knowledge you learn at PPL level, represents what percentage (10%?, 20%?) of the knowledge you need at ATPL level?

Thanks for any info!

[Superpilot]

If you want stats then I would say that around 66% of things are covered within the PPL syllabus but only to maybe a detail level of 50%

[Sam Rutherford]

Working on Superpilot's figures, the ppl ground school is a third of the ATPL ground school!

I suspect it's a MUCH smaller fraction than that!

For the original question - it's not a question of passing or not (anyone can pass any exam) - it's how long you need to study it. How dedicated to the study are you, etc...?

Sam.

[Mikehotel152]

I'll be perfectly frank about this if you like?

At the time of doing my PPL I thought there was a lot of content but a fair amount of that content was common-sense or touched on subjects I am already familar with. I probably did 2-3 weeks of relaxed study in total and passed very comfortably.

The ATPL I am now doing requires a complete gear change. You have to take it seriously as the amount is massive in comparison and in far more detail. To give you an idea, I've done a third of the course in 2 months moderately intensive study and reckon I've easily exceeded the amount of effort I had to put into the PPL. Of course, it would help if I hadn't moved house twice in those 2 months, had all those days off flying, faffing, sleeping, hung over, more sleeping, more faffing...you get the picture.

Mind you, I am taking the ATPL far more seriously and studying more meticulously because the detail is complicated and because the exams are so far off I really need to bed-in the information. It sometimes also takes me a lot of pondering to work out what is going on! I suppose that's the disadvantage of studying by correspondence.




Edited to point out that it's 9:11 and I was supposed to start studying at 9:00...

[AlphaMale]

Alex from BGS said it was at least 30% in this post:

http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthread.php?t=302578

[TomCat50]

I agree, about 30% sounds correct. Get studying!

Tom

[roll_over]

Wow, that is very comforting, I have had good marks without taking my ppl exams too seriously and balancing it with school. Doing the ATPL course full time at Oxford should be ok then

[Mercenary Pilot]

I have had good marks without taking my ppl exams too seriously and balancing it with school.

That won't get you through the ATPL's unless you are good at remembering questions, and if that's going to be the case then you will be totally unprepared for the real world of commercial aviation. Study hard, the more you put in now, the easier it gets later.

Good luck

[Whirlygig]

It's the PPL stuff though that is actually any use!

Cheers

Whirls

[captain_rossco]

Oxford Full Time and Bristol Ground School are sure fire way to get yourself through. In depth PPL knowledge will constitute the skinny side of 30% towards your ATPL exams, although other subjects are not even covered!
Learn your whizz wheel (CRP-5 not the -1) until you can use it so quickly an efficiently that smoke bellows from it! I'm still learning!

Best of Luck!


CR

[bajadj]

there is a fair amount of superfluous crap involved in full time groundschool though, which some may find interesting, but in the end is not exammable.

[Peter O'C]

Thanks for the info guys, it sounds like PPL ground school represents a significant third of ATPL g/s - that's more than I first thought.
Good news!


Regards

[118.50]

I found the PPL books quite easy to understand, and only required me to go through it without major problems, and when it came to the exams, the question asked, by looking at the choices of exams it sort of jogged your memory, which made it easy to select the correct answer.

Now ATPL JAA, well that as mentioned above requires a high understanding, because even when you are asked a question it is so ambiguous, you think to yourself, "What the hell are they asking", the turn the most simple question into something that appears really hard, and to make matters worst, the answers they give you can really confuse, they also might give a statement and just change one word to catch you out, for example a statement may mention "AND" and the other mentions "OR" because you are under pressure, you can easily go off track.

It sad, but true that sometimes these subjects don't try to test your understanding but rather to catch you out.

For example in Performace or Flight Planning, reading off those horrible unclear graphs you could come out with an accurate answer of lets say for eg: 12.5M

Answers available are;

A) 12.3M
B) 12.6M
C) 12.4M
D) 13.0M

Now your answer appears in between 12.4 and 12.6M, the question is what is the correct answer.

Also be aware of the units aswell, as that can sometimes catch you out.

I don't mean to sound negative, but just to make you try and appreciate the jump between PPL to ATPL.

Good Luck.

[BA_Baracus]

I think "RJ" and "118.50" are closer to the mark. It is hard work whatever way you look at it. The content isn't so tough, but the volume of work seems unreal at the time. Work hard, study hard as it worth remember as much as you can for a type rating. Sadly you've also got to learn the system as mentioned above.

Very best of luck

[Port Strobe]

118.50

Answers available are;
A) 12.3M
B) 12.6M
C) 12.4M
D) 13.0M
Now your answer appears in between 12.4 and 12.6M, the question is what is the correct answer

Easy, the answer is C, everyone knows that

[EIDW RJ85]

In relation to what RJ said....

I have just recently completed all the ATPL exams and am working on my CPL. How difficult do people find the type rating?? I studied my ass off in a full time course to get the ATPL's done. Has anyone ever passed all the exams then struggled with the TR theory??

What has peoples experiances been??

[Turkish777]

TR Theory v's ATPL

Well I just did a B737 Rating. I didn't find the TR theory more difficult, infact it was easier to understand, I just felt the volume of work was more for a shorter time scale.

A major difference this time round is you can't just hammer Bristol online questions and then tick all the right boxes, you have to understand the material as there is no question bank. (Well not at my TRO)

[EIDW RJ85]

Good Reply,

Thanks for the Info. I have been wondering if its very difficult. Although i have never heard of anyone failing a TR, I guess the ATPL's prepare you for the hard work!!

[Mercenary Pilot]

Although i have never heard of anyone failing a TR

There are many people who fail TR's but usually on the flying not the theory.

[supramkiv]

I found the type rating ground school didn't require the level of commitment and hard work that the ATPL's did not to say it was easy, but I found a good foundation of knowledge gained from the ATPL's were definately an advantage for the TR g/s.

However like any aviation training a certain degree of the success of its students depends on the quality of the TR provider.