OAT (Oxford) - the thread, reborn (Part XXVII)!
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Oxford Threads:
http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthr...ghlight=oxford
http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthr...ghlight=oxford
This post is especially eye opening:
http://www.pprune.org/forums/showpos...1&postcount=95
http://www.pprune.org/forums/showpos...7&postcount=99
http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthr...ghlight=oxford
http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthr...ghlight=oxford
This post is especially eye opening:
http://www.pprune.org/forums/showpos...1&postcount=95
A few things you wont hear from Oxford but I wish I knew prior to going there. Their average course size is 25 people per month, that equates to 300 students a year. If you look at the “Employment Statistics” section on their website, graduate jobs for 2006 currently stands at 141 that equates to a successful graduate employment figure of 47%
From my experience Oxford career services should only be claiming that they have managed to gain employment for the following companies BA, BA Connect, Excel, FlyBe and Jet2, which is a grand total of 61 jobs (21%) according to their latest web site figures (2006) If you take into account the GECAT scheme where you have to pay ₤500.00 for an assessment and then fund your own type rating, then you have BMI, BMI Baby, Easyjet and Thomas Cook which totals 33 (11%) but this is more a GECAT success than Oxford career services. Combining these 2 figures together (being generous towards OAT) it comes to 32% graduate employment. A further 47 (16%) of graduates have managed to gain employment from their own initiatives. This leaves 159 (52%) students without jobs, zero help from Oxford careers services and a whopping debt yet you have paid over the odds for a careers service that is no where near as successful as it claims to be.
To be in this 32% there are some un-written rules that you will not be aware of when you start your APP course. To stand any chance of the selection board giving you a recommendation at the end of your training you need to have ground school first time passes with an average of 85+% you will need “3” or better in all flight tests and a first series IR. Any mistakes along the way during your training will rule you out of receiving any recommendation from OAT’s selection board. Even if you do achieve this standard your face needs to fit, they have to “decide” to like you and you have no control over this.
You need to also be aware of the EPST (European Pilot Selection & Training) Dutch contingent, they get preferential treatment especially when being put forward for jobs due to contractual obligations between then and Oxford, so any English student is immediately disadvantaged.
The 16% who find employment through their own imitative were binned by Oxford yet when Oxford hear of their success, they suddenly pull your name out of the bin and proudly put it on their “Graduate Jobs Board” and put you in as a statistic on their web site as if you are one of their success stories.
Overall you have a less than 1 in 3 chance of successfully being employed through OAT
The actual school and their training I have no problem with however I take issue with the misleading marketing spin they employ, you believe that you are paying a premium for the use of OAT’s many contacts in the airline industry, their careers service and the so called employment boom that is apparently about to happen in the next month or two (after 2 years of this it wears thin!!)
If I knew all these facts before going to OAT, I would have perhaps gone elsewhere and definitely have gone down the Modular route as the truth about the integrated course is just hype and does not deliver a job in the fashion they would have you believe. Taking the cheaper modular route will mean that you will still spend the ₤60,000+ but included in this cost will be a type rating that you will most probably have to pay for.
Other schools integrated courses may be similar, I don’t know, I can only comment on my own experience, This post is not intended to just slate Oxford, I feel it is important for any wannabe to know that before parting with a huge sum of money that you know precisely what you are going to get for that money and the fact that there is a very good chance that you will graduate and then be left to your own devices with a monumental debt. You very quickly become the forgotten Oxford student; there are many of us out there!
One final piece of advice: Read between the lines of all the marketing spin thrown at you! At the end of the day it’s your decision and you need to be able to live with that.
From my experience Oxford career services should only be claiming that they have managed to gain employment for the following companies BA, BA Connect, Excel, FlyBe and Jet2, which is a grand total of 61 jobs (21%) according to their latest web site figures (2006) If you take into account the GECAT scheme where you have to pay ₤500.00 for an assessment and then fund your own type rating, then you have BMI, BMI Baby, Easyjet and Thomas Cook which totals 33 (11%) but this is more a GECAT success than Oxford career services. Combining these 2 figures together (being generous towards OAT) it comes to 32% graduate employment. A further 47 (16%) of graduates have managed to gain employment from their own initiatives. This leaves 159 (52%) students without jobs, zero help from Oxford careers services and a whopping debt yet you have paid over the odds for a careers service that is no where near as successful as it claims to be.
To be in this 32% there are some un-written rules that you will not be aware of when you start your APP course. To stand any chance of the selection board giving you a recommendation at the end of your training you need to have ground school first time passes with an average of 85+% you will need “3” or better in all flight tests and a first series IR. Any mistakes along the way during your training will rule you out of receiving any recommendation from OAT’s selection board. Even if you do achieve this standard your face needs to fit, they have to “decide” to like you and you have no control over this.
You need to also be aware of the EPST (European Pilot Selection & Training) Dutch contingent, they get preferential treatment especially when being put forward for jobs due to contractual obligations between then and Oxford, so any English student is immediately disadvantaged.
The 16% who find employment through their own imitative were binned by Oxford yet when Oxford hear of their success, they suddenly pull your name out of the bin and proudly put it on their “Graduate Jobs Board” and put you in as a statistic on their web site as if you are one of their success stories.
Overall you have a less than 1 in 3 chance of successfully being employed through OAT
The actual school and their training I have no problem with however I take issue with the misleading marketing spin they employ, you believe that you are paying a premium for the use of OAT’s many contacts in the airline industry, their careers service and the so called employment boom that is apparently about to happen in the next month or two (after 2 years of this it wears thin!!)
If I knew all these facts before going to OAT, I would have perhaps gone elsewhere and definitely have gone down the Modular route as the truth about the integrated course is just hype and does not deliver a job in the fashion they would have you believe. Taking the cheaper modular route will mean that you will still spend the ₤60,000+ but included in this cost will be a type rating that you will most probably have to pay for.
Other schools integrated courses may be similar, I don’t know, I can only comment on my own experience, This post is not intended to just slate Oxford, I feel it is important for any wannabe to know that before parting with a huge sum of money that you know precisely what you are going to get for that money and the fact that there is a very good chance that you will graduate and then be left to your own devices with a monumental debt. You very quickly become the forgotten Oxford student; there are many of us out there!
One final piece of advice: Read between the lines of all the marketing spin thrown at you! At the end of the day it’s your decision and you need to be able to live with that.
http://www.pprune.org/forums/showpos...7&postcount=99
I am not going to be too specific… to protect my identity (just in case they ever do feel the need to give me one of their valued recommendations, I won’t hold my breath LOL!!!)
I consider my results at Oxford as more than reasonable.. I passed all ground school exams with and average between 80 to 85% (cant be too specific) had a couple of resits that were passed at the next try. On the flying side of things I passed all flight test's first time and have a 1st series IR. I thought my report from the school read quite well, I did not cause any trouble and got on with everyone both OAT staff and students. Even though my report reads quite well, it does not read well enough for the OAT graduate services to consider putting me forward to any airlines. So apart from a couple of % and resits at ground school, I was not that far away from the unwritten rules I mentioned previously.
When you first graduate you call the careers team weekly all upbeat but as time progresses you realise they are just fobbing you off and that you are just wasting your time and that if you didn’t call them, they certainly wouldn’t call you!!
To date I have still not had a single interview, having the Oxford APP name on my CV has counted for absolutely nothing. If you have to send out CV’s on your own it really is a total waste of time, even getting a rejection letter seems like an achievement! Around 2 years on (not being specific on time) I never once got a phone call from their careers team, I hope that some how some day I can achieve that break myself.
So what do I do in the mean time? Well you have to live and somehow pay back a mountain of debt so I now working in a office from 9-5 and 4 evenings through the week I work at my local tesco's stacking shelves. This is just so i can keep on top off my debt and trying so very hard to save some more money so that i can start a FIC to keep aviation experience current, its hard to spend another 6k on a job that will not pay, but what else can I do, Im on my own. I have spoken to local companies and they have basically said that once qualified they “may” be able to give me a few sunday afternoon students.
The only advice I can give you is make sure that you are meet or are well above their unwritten rules, otherwise you’ll be in a very similar boat as are a lot of APP graduates
Rob’d
I consider my results at Oxford as more than reasonable.. I passed all ground school exams with and average between 80 to 85% (cant be too specific) had a couple of resits that were passed at the next try. On the flying side of things I passed all flight test's first time and have a 1st series IR. I thought my report from the school read quite well, I did not cause any trouble and got on with everyone both OAT staff and students. Even though my report reads quite well, it does not read well enough for the OAT graduate services to consider putting me forward to any airlines. So apart from a couple of % and resits at ground school, I was not that far away from the unwritten rules I mentioned previously.
When you first graduate you call the careers team weekly all upbeat but as time progresses you realise they are just fobbing you off and that you are just wasting your time and that if you didn’t call them, they certainly wouldn’t call you!!
To date I have still not had a single interview, having the Oxford APP name on my CV has counted for absolutely nothing. If you have to send out CV’s on your own it really is a total waste of time, even getting a rejection letter seems like an achievement! Around 2 years on (not being specific on time) I never once got a phone call from their careers team, I hope that some how some day I can achieve that break myself.
So what do I do in the mean time? Well you have to live and somehow pay back a mountain of debt so I now working in a office from 9-5 and 4 evenings through the week I work at my local tesco's stacking shelves. This is just so i can keep on top off my debt and trying so very hard to save some more money so that i can start a FIC to keep aviation experience current, its hard to spend another 6k on a job that will not pay, but what else can I do, Im on my own. I have spoken to local companies and they have basically said that once qualified they “may” be able to give me a few sunday afternoon students.
The only advice I can give you is make sure that you are meet or are well above their unwritten rules, otherwise you’ll be in a very similar boat as are a lot of APP graduates
Rob’d
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skelly2005.
My advice - visit the school, and talk to the current students there. Visit the ask Oxford forums, there is mountains of information to be found there regarding the course etc.
By all means, wait for responses from people on this forum, but don't base your decisions purely on what you read, either on here, or any other forum.
Facilities in Goodyear:
On the whole, pretty good. There were some teething problems in the first few months of operation, however most, if not all, of these have now been sorted. The accommodation is comfortable, the food varies from day to day, but is usually ok and reasonably priced. Transport is probably the biggest problem, with the base being fairly remote. There are cars and minibuses provided for students, and the availability is improving. As for the local area, plenty to see, do, eat if you want.
The instruction in Goodyear is on the whole pretty good.
Ground School:
Couldn't have done it without the help and support of the staff - enough said.
You don't have to stay onsite in Oxford (unless you are on a sponsored course). A lot of people opt to stay in halls for a couple of weeks, and then seek alternate accommodation. Some arrange the alternate accommodation in advance and don't bother with halls. There are plenty of houses in the local area, cheaper than halls. The closer to the airport you live, the better.
My advice - visit the school, and talk to the current students there. Visit the ask Oxford forums, there is mountains of information to be found there regarding the course etc.
By all means, wait for responses from people on this forum, but don't base your decisions purely on what you read, either on here, or any other forum.
Facilities in Goodyear:
On the whole, pretty good. There were some teething problems in the first few months of operation, however most, if not all, of these have now been sorted. The accommodation is comfortable, the food varies from day to day, but is usually ok and reasonably priced. Transport is probably the biggest problem, with the base being fairly remote. There are cars and minibuses provided for students, and the availability is improving. As for the local area, plenty to see, do, eat if you want.
The instruction in Goodyear is on the whole pretty good.
Ground School:
Couldn't have done it without the help and support of the staff - enough said.
You don't have to stay onsite in Oxford (unless you are on a sponsored course). A lot of people opt to stay in halls for a couple of weeks, and then seek alternate accommodation. Some arrange the alternate accommodation in advance and don't bother with halls. There are plenty of houses in the local area, cheaper than halls. The closer to the airport you live, the better.
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I thought he did provide links ! Great post..
PlaneHomerS
Is it really necessary to quote complete posts??
Is it really necessary to quote complete posts??
Thank you.
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By all means, listen to what those who haven't got on with OAT say but remember how many people do well from them. The OAT Forums are going to be a better place to get objective advice about the place.
In terms of employment, OAT by no means advocate that they get 100% of graduates into employment...the statistic quoted by them is 90% within 12 months. That is into aviation and, as far as I can tell, into the RHS. 47% is rubbish. Apart from anything else, there 166 students employed in 2006. Maximum course size is 24, equating to 288 students IF every course was full. I know for a fact that they weren't. Thus, if you also include the 2% failure rate (makes little difference, but just remember it's there), their employment rate is FAR higher than 47%!
If you want accurate employment rates, ask the company itself. They ARE a business and, as such, there are things they can't lie about!
In terms of employment, OAT by no means advocate that they get 100% of graduates into employment...the statistic quoted by them is 90% within 12 months. That is into aviation and, as far as I can tell, into the RHS. 47% is rubbish. Apart from anything else, there 166 students employed in 2006. Maximum course size is 24, equating to 288 students IF every course was full. I know for a fact that they weren't. Thus, if you also include the 2% failure rate (makes little difference, but just remember it's there), their employment rate is FAR higher than 47%!
If you want accurate employment rates, ask the company itself. They ARE a business and, as such, there are things they can't lie about!
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Er.....I think GECAT place a hell of a lot of OAT grads! So none of it quite adds up. I ain't knocking OAT, I couldn't really give a monkeys! But I think they take a lot of credit where it isn't deserved.
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Well said Katherine, couldn't agree more!
SinBin: OAT don't hide that fact!! Yes, a lot of OAT grads get placed through GECAT, that's not OAT's fault, just the way the industry is. If all airlines paid for type-ratings, then this wouldn't be the case.
SinBin: OAT don't hide that fact!! Yes, a lot of OAT grads get placed through GECAT, that's not OAT's fault, just the way the industry is. If all airlines paid for type-ratings, then this wouldn't be the case.
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Yes, a lot of OAT grads get placed through GECAT, that's not OAT's fault, just the way the industry is.
I was offered a place @ Oxford as a APP student after passing the selection tests. Oxford is a fine institution and i felt they could get me from a to b with the minimal amount of time.
This was in the early days of me researching aviation. However after allot of questions to OAT i learn't about the above quoted fact. Now as i said to the OAT, "if i am going to have to pay for a type rating then why don't i go down the modular route, save thousands and have enough to pay for a couple of type ratings?"
Off course the team tried to justify why i should go integrated but after going through their arguments i logically came to the conclusion that i am going modular. I know i can pass GECAT's assessment (as they use the same assessment as OAT).
Off course i could have been one of the lucky ones that got into BA and not have to pay for the type rating but still 80k is a steep amount of money when i know i can get there for less.
Good luck to anyone going there.
rock on
+PHS
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Hi all
In answer to some of the previous posts...
I have finished my training at OAT. Finance wise - not many needed extra training - maybe the odd hour here or there as sqkvfr stated.
The costs i can think of would be - failing an exam so paying for a resit.
The the major cost would be is you fail or Partial your IR which would be the same at any training facility.
As regards total expenditure - i budgeted about 15k on top of the course costs and i have to say i managed to stick to that pretty well!
I have noticed quite a few people on here with a huge chip on their shoulder against OAT. Quoting employment statistics etc
The fact is - you can only find these things out from FTO's such as OAT.
What is the employment success of modular students?!?!
You can't give an answer to that question as the training is done in so many different places. Saying OAT has a low employment % may be one thing but i seriously doubt the Modular % will be any higher!!!
I honestly couldn't care less about Modular or Integrated personally.
I chose what was best for me and im happy with my choice so i suggest people choose what fits them and their budget best!
The only way a student is added to the employment statistics is by them notifying OAT of their job. How else can OAT know that 6 months down the line a graduate has a job as im sure the airline won't make the phone call to say!
Then there are those who either did badly on the groundschool phase or the flying phase!
My point is - People are far to critical when everything is laid out in black and white. I seriously wish i had a crystal ball to see how many people undertook training at other organisations and have sucessfully got an airline job - that would make interesting reading!
Fact of the matter is - IF you work hard and get the results - your readily employable with many airlines!
In answer to some of the previous posts...
I have finished my training at OAT. Finance wise - not many needed extra training - maybe the odd hour here or there as sqkvfr stated.
The costs i can think of would be - failing an exam so paying for a resit.
The the major cost would be is you fail or Partial your IR which would be the same at any training facility.
As regards total expenditure - i budgeted about 15k on top of the course costs and i have to say i managed to stick to that pretty well!
I have noticed quite a few people on here with a huge chip on their shoulder against OAT. Quoting employment statistics etc
The fact is - you can only find these things out from FTO's such as OAT.
What is the employment success of modular students?!?!
You can't give an answer to that question as the training is done in so many different places. Saying OAT has a low employment % may be one thing but i seriously doubt the Modular % will be any higher!!!
I honestly couldn't care less about Modular or Integrated personally.
I chose what was best for me and im happy with my choice so i suggest people choose what fits them and their budget best!
The only way a student is added to the employment statistics is by them notifying OAT of their job. How else can OAT know that 6 months down the line a graduate has a job as im sure the airline won't make the phone call to say!
Then there are those who either did badly on the groundschool phase or the flying phase!
My point is - People are far to critical when everything is laid out in black and white. I seriously wish i had a crystal ball to see how many people undertook training at other organisations and have sucessfully got an airline job - that would make interesting reading!
Fact of the matter is - IF you work hard and get the results - your readily employable with many airlines!
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Oxford Start
Hi people, im due to start at oxford in sept this year just wondering if anybody else is gunna be starting arounf this time. Im going to be doing the integrated course (please no comments on this as its the path i've chosen and dont care what you think), and yes I did get help from mammy and daddy, but yeah who is starting in sept time on there integrated course.
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Any Other Qualities!!
First things first, go easy on me - there are some rather aggressive comments on this forum and at the end of the day - my knowledge is very limited and I am looking for ADVICE!!
When I read through ALL of these replies, the arguments always seem to be either " Modular or Integrated " OR "this school or that school ", nothing ever seems to be mentioned with regards to the actual individual!
The point imp trying to make, based on what I have read is that it doesn't seem to matter how you do your training! - If you have the "overall package required” - then you WILL succeed!! If however you don’t have this natural ability - Then you WON’T SUCCEED (with odd exceptions!).
I’m not talking about the ability to just "fly a plane", but the personality to socialise, make important decisions, be a manager / Leader, have common sense, show authority when required, etc.
Also, nothing is ever mentioned with regards to "what else the individual has to offer " as an example for instance, surely having 8 years engineering experience, degrees, management experience, or showing determination in raising funds by property development etc. has to be a clear advantage over someone who was fortunate enough to have money given for training from there parents??
Using OAT as an example only!!! - What I am interested to know is out of all these people that don’t get jobs, or find it hard, after completing some of the "best training in the world" - could it be because they have very limited knowledge in other areas?? You wouldn’t go on a "two week management course" and expect to walk into a £50k senior management role! -
Please take this post light hearted!!! - I have to stress that I DO NOT KNOW WHAT IM TALKING ABOUT!! but I’m hoping that this will open up for some constructive discussion.
Thanks in advance
Tom
When I read through ALL of these replies, the arguments always seem to be either " Modular or Integrated " OR "this school or that school ", nothing ever seems to be mentioned with regards to the actual individual!
The point imp trying to make, based on what I have read is that it doesn't seem to matter how you do your training! - If you have the "overall package required” - then you WILL succeed!! If however you don’t have this natural ability - Then you WON’T SUCCEED (with odd exceptions!).
I’m not talking about the ability to just "fly a plane", but the personality to socialise, make important decisions, be a manager / Leader, have common sense, show authority when required, etc.
Also, nothing is ever mentioned with regards to "what else the individual has to offer " as an example for instance, surely having 8 years engineering experience, degrees, management experience, or showing determination in raising funds by property development etc. has to be a clear advantage over someone who was fortunate enough to have money given for training from there parents??
Using OAT as an example only!!! - What I am interested to know is out of all these people that don’t get jobs, or find it hard, after completing some of the "best training in the world" - could it be because they have very limited knowledge in other areas?? You wouldn’t go on a "two week management course" and expect to walk into a £50k senior management role! -
Please take this post light hearted!!! - I have to stress that I DO NOT KNOW WHAT IM TALKING ABOUT!! but I’m hoping that this will open up for some constructive discussion.
Thanks in advance
Tom
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Well said Tom. Although I don't know what I'm talking about either, a well known airline was recentley quoted as saying that "there is no shortage of pilots, just a shortage of the right kind of pilots". Says it all really.
Doing a fATP - ground exams, flying, IR practical tests etc seems daugnting and a real acheavment, but when applying for that job - who are you talking to? Think about it. Also when you get that job that is when your learning will START.
I could write loads, but but won't bore you. Just step back, put yourself in there shoes and look at the whole picture.
Doing a fATP - ground exams, flying, IR practical tests etc seems daugnting and a real acheavment, but when applying for that job - who are you talking to? Think about it. Also when you get that job that is when your learning will START.
I could write loads, but but won't bore you. Just step back, put yourself in there shoes and look at the whole picture.
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Hi all
In answer to some of the previous posts...
I have finished my training at OAT. Finance wise - not many needed extra training - maybe the odd hour here or there as sqkvfr stated.
The costs i can think of would be - failing an exam so paying for a resit.
The the major cost would be is you fail or Partial your IR which would be the same at any training facility.
As regards total expenditure - i budgeted about 15k on top of the course costs and i have to say i managed to stick to that pretty well!
I have noticed quite a few people on here with a huge chip on their shoulder against OAT. Quoting employment statistics etc
The fact is - you can only find these things out from FTO's such as OAT.
What is the employment success of modular students?!?!
You can't give an answer to that question as the training is done in so many different places. Saying OAT has a low employment % may be one thing but i seriously doubt the Modular % will be any higher!!!
I honestly couldn't care less about Modular or Integrated personally.
I chose what was best for me and im happy with my choice so i suggest people choose what fits them and their budget best!
The only way a student is added to the employment statistics is by them notifying OAT of their job. How else can OAT know that 6 months down the line a graduate has a job as im sure the airline won't make the phone call to say!
Then there are those who either did badly on the groundschool phase or the flying phase!
My point is - People are far to critical when everything is laid out in black and white. I seriously wish i had a crystal ball to see how many people undertook training at other organisations and have sucessfully got an airline job - that would make interesting reading!
Fact of the matter is - IF you work hard and get the results - your readily employable with many airlines!
In answer to some of the previous posts...
I have finished my training at OAT. Finance wise - not many needed extra training - maybe the odd hour here or there as sqkvfr stated.
The costs i can think of would be - failing an exam so paying for a resit.
The the major cost would be is you fail or Partial your IR which would be the same at any training facility.
As regards total expenditure - i budgeted about 15k on top of the course costs and i have to say i managed to stick to that pretty well!
I have noticed quite a few people on here with a huge chip on their shoulder against OAT. Quoting employment statistics etc
The fact is - you can only find these things out from FTO's such as OAT.
What is the employment success of modular students?!?!
You can't give an answer to that question as the training is done in so many different places. Saying OAT has a low employment % may be one thing but i seriously doubt the Modular % will be any higher!!!
I honestly couldn't care less about Modular or Integrated personally.
I chose what was best for me and im happy with my choice so i suggest people choose what fits them and their budget best!
The only way a student is added to the employment statistics is by them notifying OAT of their job. How else can OAT know that 6 months down the line a graduate has a job as im sure the airline won't make the phone call to say!
Then there are those who either did badly on the groundschool phase or the flying phase!
My point is - People are far to critical when everything is laid out in black and white. I seriously wish i had a crystal ball to see how many people undertook training at other organisations and have sucessfully got an airline job - that would make interesting reading!
Fact of the matter is - IF you work hard and get the results - your readily employable with many airlines!
good luck...
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"The Right Stuff" (according to OAT)
Does anyone have an idea what this airline recommendation board (or whatever it is) at OAT actually regard as being recommendable?
Very high theory grades, exceptional flying ability, jolly good chap, commitment, dedication etc etc, all of the above...or is it something a little more subtle and subjective???? (perhaps looking/sounding like their stereotype OAT branded graduate???)
Does anyone who has been recommended, and since when straight into a job, have an idea why they were recommended??
Am very curious about this...
Very high theory grades, exceptional flying ability, jolly good chap, commitment, dedication etc etc, all of the above...or is it something a little more subtle and subjective???? (perhaps looking/sounding like their stereotype OAT branded graduate???)
Does anyone who has been recommended, and since when straight into a job, have an idea why they were recommended??
Am very curious about this...
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Hi
I think the total cost is around the 75k mark as the course was cheaper when i started nearly 2 years ago now - i would budget about 80k though to be on the safe side so you have access to a bit extra cash if neeeded.
As regards employment, i have been to an Interview and passed a sim check so awaiting my start date at present.
The Oat recommendation board is a team of OAT staff that meet to review graduates for recommendation to the airlines. These borads so im told only occur when an airline comes to OAT after grads. Firstly the Airline will state their requirements to OAT in terms of Groundschool average required and flying results. OAT then compile a shortlist of possible candiadates that meet these requirements. Those that OAT think best suit this partcicular airline (eg. could be someone who lives very close to the airport the airline is based at) ar then recommended to the airline. OAT will only recommend people they think will do the airline well and pass their training without problems. Its on OAT's head that their grads they recommend do well as thats what keeps the airlines coming back to get more and more grads agin and again.
adj
I think the total cost is around the 75k mark as the course was cheaper when i started nearly 2 years ago now - i would budget about 80k though to be on the safe side so you have access to a bit extra cash if neeeded.
As regards employment, i have been to an Interview and passed a sim check so awaiting my start date at present.
The Oat recommendation board is a team of OAT staff that meet to review graduates for recommendation to the airlines. These borads so im told only occur when an airline comes to OAT after grads. Firstly the Airline will state their requirements to OAT in terms of Groundschool average required and flying results. OAT then compile a shortlist of possible candiadates that meet these requirements. Those that OAT think best suit this partcicular airline (eg. could be someone who lives very close to the airport the airline is based at) ar then recommended to the airline. OAT will only recommend people they think will do the airline well and pass their training without problems. Its on OAT's head that their grads they recommend do well as thats what keeps the airlines coming back to get more and more grads agin and again.
adj
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: oxford
Age: 41
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"The fact is - you can only find these things out from FTO's such as OAT."
WHAT A LOAD OF CRAP, do you really think that phoning a FTO they are gonna say "yeah our stats are not that good out of 300 people a year passing thorugh the school we are placing less than 50%" I DONT THINK SO, they will distort and big up their stats as best they can. OAT were quick to get rid of their 2005 stats from their web site when they realised that their 2006 stats were WORSE and the job market is supposed to be BETTER
"The only way a student is added to the employment statistics is by them notifying OAT of their job."
AGAIN WHAT TOTAL CRAP, you clearly know nothing, I cant believe that you went there, the second OAT find out you have a job they boast about you like they placed you, fact is loads of ex-OAT grads get their own job but dont notify OAT as they felt totally let down by OAT and got no recoginition or help from OAT despite having very acceptable results. What ACTUALLY happens is that when a graduate gets a job, The airline employing them has to do a 5 year security check which means calling OAT and checking that the student did indeed go there, so then OAT go CA-CHING theres a student who has gained a job, lets stick them up on our graduate success job and claim them as one of our success stories even though OAT gave the student zero help and binned them.
"Fact of the matter is - IF you work hard and get the results - your readily employable with many airlines!"
TOTAL B*****ks sorry mate but your really talking out your arse, I cant quite believe that you went to OAT for you really are talking crap, I know many graduates from the APP program "what the airlines want" who have had to give up on their dream over a year on where they have had ZERO help from OAT, and I can tell you that those to whom I am referring all a first series IR, and no more than 2 resits in the ground school. They have had to give up on the dream and enter another industry with a colossal OAT debt on their shoulders.
I myself got over 80% GS avg, first time pass in ALL flying tests and yet got NO help, not one recommendation from OAT, I managed to get myself a job, completely no thanks to OAT, and because of the security checks OAT found out about my success and subsequently put me up on their OAT Graduate success success board for all to see, yet had I not succeeded myself I would be a piece of sh1t in their bin whith no chance of employment through them.
FACT is they tell you one thing when signing up but deliver (or should I say dont deliver) something completely different. FACT is I know may ex-OAT graduates who all did pretty well throughout the course yet upon completion received f*** all help from OAT Graduate services. I have read previous posts and there is one from Robbed60grand who offers a very honest read, one that reads true to many.
Also in terms of the numbers of OAT grads who go to BA, for 2007 they placed 27 students, whoo hoo, considering their average course is 25+ per month, approximately 2 people per course meet the OAT BA requirement.
Does that entice you to go to OAT????? Yes I went there and paid top money for APP believing that they would get me the job, I performed well through out but reality is that they did nothing for me and now a year on from leaving OAT, I have met loads of other grads who have had NO help and cannot get a job, having OAT on your CV counts for bugger all and even though i have found a job through my own efforts, I truly wish I had gone modular not at OAT, saved a small fortune and still got the job under my own merits, what really annoys me is the fact that I believed them, spent soo much going to OAT, got ZERO help, got a job on my own and then they put me on their graduates job like they got me the job, b*****ds, am I bitter? absolutely, and rightly so.
Whoopeydoo
WHAT A LOAD OF CRAP, do you really think that phoning a FTO they are gonna say "yeah our stats are not that good out of 300 people a year passing thorugh the school we are placing less than 50%" I DONT THINK SO, they will distort and big up their stats as best they can. OAT were quick to get rid of their 2005 stats from their web site when they realised that their 2006 stats were WORSE and the job market is supposed to be BETTER
"The only way a student is added to the employment statistics is by them notifying OAT of their job."
AGAIN WHAT TOTAL CRAP, you clearly know nothing, I cant believe that you went there, the second OAT find out you have a job they boast about you like they placed you, fact is loads of ex-OAT grads get their own job but dont notify OAT as they felt totally let down by OAT and got no recoginition or help from OAT despite having very acceptable results. What ACTUALLY happens is that when a graduate gets a job, The airline employing them has to do a 5 year security check which means calling OAT and checking that the student did indeed go there, so then OAT go CA-CHING theres a student who has gained a job, lets stick them up on our graduate success job and claim them as one of our success stories even though OAT gave the student zero help and binned them.
"Fact of the matter is - IF you work hard and get the results - your readily employable with many airlines!"
TOTAL B*****ks sorry mate but your really talking out your arse, I cant quite believe that you went to OAT for you really are talking crap, I know many graduates from the APP program "what the airlines want" who have had to give up on their dream over a year on where they have had ZERO help from OAT, and I can tell you that those to whom I am referring all a first series IR, and no more than 2 resits in the ground school. They have had to give up on the dream and enter another industry with a colossal OAT debt on their shoulders.
I myself got over 80% GS avg, first time pass in ALL flying tests and yet got NO help, not one recommendation from OAT, I managed to get myself a job, completely no thanks to OAT, and because of the security checks OAT found out about my success and subsequently put me up on their OAT Graduate success success board for all to see, yet had I not succeeded myself I would be a piece of sh1t in their bin whith no chance of employment through them.
FACT is they tell you one thing when signing up but deliver (or should I say dont deliver) something completely different. FACT is I know may ex-OAT graduates who all did pretty well throughout the course yet upon completion received f*** all help from OAT Graduate services. I have read previous posts and there is one from Robbed60grand who offers a very honest read, one that reads true to many.
Also in terms of the numbers of OAT grads who go to BA, for 2007 they placed 27 students, whoo hoo, considering their average course is 25+ per month, approximately 2 people per course meet the OAT BA requirement.
Does that entice you to go to OAT????? Yes I went there and paid top money for APP believing that they would get me the job, I performed well through out but reality is that they did nothing for me and now a year on from leaving OAT, I have met loads of other grads who have had NO help and cannot get a job, having OAT on your CV counts for bugger all and even though i have found a job through my own efforts, I truly wish I had gone modular not at OAT, saved a small fortune and still got the job under my own merits, what really annoys me is the fact that I believed them, spent soo much going to OAT, got ZERO help, got a job on my own and then they put me on their graduates job like they got me the job, b*****ds, am I bitter? absolutely, and rightly so.
Whoopeydoo