Licence Conversion to JAA
Join Date: Oct 2004
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my two cents
tingtang
let me answer some of your questions and give my two cents.
-Authorized course in the UK, for Atpl exam in the UK: YES, unless you have a bunch of multi-pilot commercial time (1500), which is not the case!
-After the ATPL papers, 36 months to complete UK CPL AND Instrument, Yes
-You would need an Faa CPL not ATPL! big difference ( at least 1310 hours less)
-ATPL skill test
please buy or borrow a LASORS, you will get all the answers, once you passed the 14 ATPL papers, passed (whichever way you want) the UK CPL, multi engine rating and instrument rating skill test, you hold a UK JAA Frozen ATPL!!
Last but not least, you want a JAA first class medical!!
-you will need either an initial examination at Gatwick or a JAA first class medical transfered from a Jaa country, like France or Germany (the requirements are the same:JAA!!!) not a medical from the US, you were mislead or misunderstood.
If wannabee are advised to, first pass the first class medical before anything, it is because it is a mandatory stepping stone on your path to professional aviation.
On another hand, it is not unheard of, that high time experienced pilot sometime enjoy a little "favor" in view of their career.
Others before,(i have known a few), have been thought FAA licenses hoping to "arm-twist" the JAA regulation, only to find themselves either in big financial distress or flying in Africa or eastern Asia.
Do not misunderstand my words, i have nothing against flying in those place, to the contrary.
But your original goal is to fly in the UK, so you would be way off-route.
I hope you will get your first class medical ans that you will fulfill your dream.
Have a good flight and be safe.
P.S. how do i know? been there, done that.:
let me answer some of your questions and give my two cents.
-Authorized course in the UK, for Atpl exam in the UK: YES, unless you have a bunch of multi-pilot commercial time (1500), which is not the case!
-After the ATPL papers, 36 months to complete UK CPL AND Instrument, Yes
-You would need an Faa CPL not ATPL! big difference ( at least 1310 hours less)
-ATPL skill test
please buy or borrow a LASORS, you will get all the answers, once you passed the 14 ATPL papers, passed (whichever way you want) the UK CPL, multi engine rating and instrument rating skill test, you hold a UK JAA Frozen ATPL!!Last but not least, you want a JAA first class medical!!
-you will need either an initial examination at Gatwick or a JAA first class medical transfered from a Jaa country, like France or Germany (the requirements are the same:JAA!!!) not a medical from the US, you were mislead or misunderstood.
If wannabee are advised to, first pass the first class medical before anything, it is because it is a mandatory stepping stone on your path to professional aviation.
On another hand, it is not unheard of, that high time experienced pilot sometime enjoy a little "favor" in view of their career.
Others before,(i have known a few), have been thought FAA licenses hoping to "arm-twist" the JAA regulation, only to find themselves either in big financial distress or flying in Africa or eastern Asia.
Do not misunderstand my words, i have nothing against flying in those place, to the contrary.
But your original goal is to fly in the UK, so you would be way off-route.
I hope you will get your first class medical ans that you will fulfill your dream.
Have a good flight and be safe.
P.S. how do i know? been there, done that.:
Join Date: Aug 2002
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looking for school
hello vivaespain ,
well, a lot to say or to do to every, one....
let start somewhere.
i recently cleared the 14 exams as distant learning with CATS, happy with those guys...at cranfield.
actually in us as flight instructor helping the flight school.... it is so busy , that i jumped from almost nothing to 3000hours and 500 multi...now looking for a job worldwide........
As well as, i'm looking for a flight shool where i can train and pass at least my CPL and or IR......if you have any address i will be happy
my concern is well, guys you have to visualize the world convert is unappropriate now...we should say or use benefit of flight time...and let me explain...( let me know of course if i'm wrong...)
And this is not applying to pilot with a jet rating and appropriate experience..
ok the concept is you do not convert anything....you just have the benefit of flying less hours as you have previous experience form an other country.......
this was my case when the first time from france i went in us and "convert" my private license in FAA license....this is what i think...
and as matter fact it is still the same case when you come in us to fly.....
i know it is funny to say that....but make sure that if you come from another country than UK, you speak english, otherwise you might fail the medical exam...in the eyes tests... he he he ,, so it recently.....
enjoy the lecture......
well, a lot to say or to do to every, one....
let start somewhere.
i recently cleared the 14 exams as distant learning with CATS, happy with those guys...at cranfield.
actually in us as flight instructor helping the flight school.... it is so busy , that i jumped from almost nothing to 3000hours and 500 multi...now looking for a job worldwide........
As well as, i'm looking for a flight shool where i can train and pass at least my CPL and or IR......if you have any address i will be happy
my concern is well, guys you have to visualize the world convert is unappropriate now...we should say or use benefit of flight time...and let me explain...( let me know of course if i'm wrong...)
And this is not applying to pilot with a jet rating and appropriate experience..
ok the concept is you do not convert anything....you just have the benefit of flying less hours as you have previous experience form an other country.......
this was my case when the first time from france i went in us and "convert" my private license in FAA license....this is what i think...
and as matter fact it is still the same case when you come in us to fly.....
i know it is funny to say that....but make sure that if you come from another country than UK, you speak english, otherwise you might fail the medical exam...in the eyes tests... he he he ,, so it recently.....
enjoy the lecture......
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I would call or write to the CAA if I were you, just to make sure that you will be tested on their renewal limits off an FAA medical rather than the initial limits. It sounds like too much of a loophole for the CAA to allow this but I may be wrong.
Good luck!
Good luck!
It certainly used to be the case that you would be tested on the renewal standards with an FAA cpl/class one (a friend did just that) but I have a funny feeling that this loop hole has been closed by the Belgrano. Worth checking though.
Good luck
Good luck
Join Date: Jan 2006
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If you find out please please come back and say so, I'm in exactly the same position. I've tried asking this question in the medical forum and the North America forum with no luck.
If I wrote to Gatwick and asked if they would apply renewal limits to a JAR class 1 initial if the candidate already held a newly printed FAA CPL and FAA class 1 medical do you think they would give me a straight answer?
I can hear you all screaming "yes of course they would, stop asking medical questions on an internet site!", but I get the gut feeling they would send me a cut and paste style quick reply that evaded the question.
What say you?
If I wrote to Gatwick and asked if they would apply renewal limits to a JAR class 1 initial if the candidate already held a newly printed FAA CPL and FAA class 1 medical do you think they would give me a straight answer?
I can hear you all screaming "yes of course they would, stop asking medical questions on an internet site!", but I get the gut feeling they would send me a cut and paste style quick reply that evaded the question.
What say you?
Join Date: Jul 2004
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Hi
I doubt they will say this by letter. I think they will need to see you and go through the whole medical properly as it depends on how close to the limits you are.
If you really want to go for it, make an appointment and then you will be able to find out. PM me if you want. Sounds like we might be in the same position.
Will
I doubt they will say this by letter. I think they will need to see you and go through the whole medical properly as it depends on how close to the limits you are.
If you really want to go for it, make an appointment and then you will be able to find out. PM me if you want. Sounds like we might be in the same position.
Will
Join Date: May 2006
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There was (and still is altough it has recently been changed) a flow chart on the CAA website that showed the process of obtaining a Class 1 medical if you already held a medical from another state.
http://www.caa.co.uk/docs/49/SRG_MED_Non-UKCl1[2577].pdf
It was the case that if you held a class one from a non JAA state and a CPL then they would test you to renewal standards not the initial standards. They also did not need to do all the tests that they would normally do for the initial issue.
Went down this route last year and CAA were very helpful, they brought it to my attention, actually gave me a partial refund as they did less tests and issued the class 1 certificate to me that day before I left .
ps. I notice that the initial limits for allowable correction have been relaxed from -5/+5 to -6/+5 dioptres.
pps. speak to the CAA, they are very helpful and will explain the options that may be open to you if you do not meet the initial standards that will result in you obtaining an unrestricted class 1 medical.
http://www.caa.co.uk/docs/49/SRG_MED_Non-UKCl1[2577].pdf
It was the case that if you held a class one from a non JAA state and a CPL then they would test you to renewal standards not the initial standards. They also did not need to do all the tests that they would normally do for the initial issue.
Went down this route last year and CAA were very helpful, they brought it to my attention, actually gave me a partial refund as they did less tests and issued the class 1 certificate to me that day before I left .
ps. I notice that the initial limits for allowable correction have been relaxed from -5/+5 to -6/+5 dioptres.
pps. speak to the CAA, they are very helpful and will explain the options that may be open to you if you do not meet the initial standards that will result in you obtaining an unrestricted class 1 medical.
Join Date: Jan 2007
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The FAA class 1 with CPL to JAA class 1 medical at renewal standards seems to be a thing for much interest.
From a personal view point I am interested as I have passed the FAA colour vision tests, but failed our own UK tests, so cannot get an unrestricted JAA class 1.
The standards are a bit misleading as if you hold an FAA class 1 medical AND CPL you could until the end of last year get an "extended" renewal standards for a CAA class 1 issue.
From a personal view point I am interested as I have passed the FAA colour vision tests, but failed our own UK tests, so cannot get an unrestricted JAA class 1.
The standards are a bit misleading as if you hold an FAA class 1 medical AND CPL you could until the end of last year get an "extended" renewal standards for a CAA class 1 issue.
The "extended" is stated as
"A full initial JAR class 1 examination, less the EEG and the chest X-RAY. The examination will be to JAR revalidation/renewal standards"
This seems a bit odd as if you took my case, then renewal standards do not include colour vision tests, but if you take it as an initial minus the EEG and chest X-ray then it would include them??? The CAA have however now taken this from their website and as far as I'm aware do not give ANY creditation for an FAA medical or experience. (isn't the ICAO a great thing!)
Now from next year the EASA will have authority over medical issues and this will be built into Europen law. How this will affect pilots who have marginal medical problems we will need to see. However there are a group of us who wish to work WITH the CAA to present our case to the EASA so that sensible consideration can be taken for us. We will see if this ever happens of course. If anyone wants more info please PM me.
"A full initial JAR class 1 examination, less the EEG and the chest X-RAY. The examination will be to JAR revalidation/renewal standards"
This seems a bit odd as if you took my case, then renewal standards do not include colour vision tests, but if you take it as an initial minus the EEG and chest X-ray then it would include them??? The CAA have however now taken this from their website and as far as I'm aware do not give ANY creditation for an FAA medical or experience. (isn't the ICAO a great thing!)
Now from next year the EASA will have authority over medical issues and this will be built into Europen law. How this will affect pilots who have marginal medical problems we will need to see. However there are a group of us who wish to work WITH the CAA to present our case to the EASA so that sensible consideration can be taken for us. We will see if this ever happens of course. If anyone wants more info please PM me.
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FAA to JAA licence conversion
I am currently about to start my licence conversion from FAA CPL/IR to JAA CPL/IR and whilst looking around have heard a rumour about a loophole in Poland which makes it cheaper and less timely. I also heard there was similar loophole by doing it in Ireland a couple of years back in Ireland until the JAA shut that one down, can anyone please advise if they know anything about this or if they have found something similar. Regards
Join Date: Apr 2006
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FAA > JAA IR Conversion, only 5 hours in the aircraft
I'm about to undertake my FAA to JAA IR conversion, I have 150 hours experience of flying in the UK, nearly all VFR, the rest of my flight time has all been conducted in the US. The flight school I am doing my conversion with have allocated 10 hours in the sim and only 5 hours in the actual aircraft for the conversion plus the 2 hours for the test. I must confess I'm slightly concerned as to whether 5 hours in the UK airways will be enough for test despite the fact my actual instrument flying is absolutely fine?
Does anyone have any experience of doing the conversion and can it actually be done in such a small number of hours?
If this proves to be as worryingly difficult as I think it may be then I might change my plans, forget the whole one stop modular thing and come back to the UK for a full IR.
Does anyone have any experience of doing the conversion and can it actually be done in such a small number of hours?
If this proves to be as worryingly difficult as I think it may be then I might change my plans, forget the whole one stop modular thing and come back to the UK for a full IR.
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Ill be converting my CPL/IR to JAA next year, and the schools i have looked at all pretty much say the same...10hrs Sim. 5 hrs flying + test. In any case, they won't put you up for the test if you're not ready so if it takes a few more hours then at least your concerns will be resolved.
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Hi. I teach JAR ME/IR in the UK and have taught a number of FAA conversions. Most schools will quote the UK CAA minimums of 5 hours aircraft, 10 hours sim, as, to say more, would make them appear uncompetative. However, although it depends a lot on how good and how current you are, my experience is of 20 to 30 hours total to convert is more typical. This comes about mainly because, as I understand it (I have never flown in the land of the free) you do not fly NDB procedures on test in the US. In the UK you currently have to fly a single engine NDB hold and a single engine NDB approach, no quarter given! Hope this helps.
Educated Hillbilly
If you are low houred ie: have the bare minimum of an FAA CPL IR, then yes you will certainly need more than five hours in the aircraft. Realistically the individuals I have known to take this route seem to take anything from 20 to 30 hours to convert the FAA IR to the JAA IR.
However as I have mentioned in previous posts it is quite useful to have both FAA and JAA ratings, the FAA IR will allow you to work on N registered aircraft in the UK.
However as I have mentioned in previous posts it is quite useful to have both FAA and JAA ratings, the FAA IR will allow you to work on N registered aircraft in the UK.
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It depends what standard of training you have had in the US, most of the people who convert FAA IR to JAA at my local school are generally ready for the test in less than 5 hours aircraft and 10 hours sim, its plenty of time.
Just make sure you get high standard training in the states otherwise it'll take you longer to convert.
Just make sure you get high standard training in the states otherwise it'll take you longer to convert.
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FAA-JAA Conversion: What hours do count?
Hello
I'm about converting my FAA CPL into an JAA CPL. As I don't have more than 1500 hours...I wonder what hours do count for the license conversion. I did a search but couldn't find a satisfiing answer:
1) Theory: I have to do all the 14 exams. This can be done by distance learning, which takes some time...but shouldn't be a problem.
2) Practical: I need at least 200 hours...but what hours do count?
2.1 You can log solo flight time..of course
2.2 You can't log Safety Pilot time
2.3 Can you log PIC time, when you flew together with an instructor? As it seems it hast to be an accredited course. If it is FAA accredited (Part 141)...is it also OK for the JAA?
2.4 Can you log your PIC "under the hood" time when flying together with a safety pilot?
2.5 Can you log the PIC time as a flight instructor when instructing a new PPL FAA student? What is if this guy logs himself SPIC?
2.6. Can you log the PIC time as a flight instructor when instructing an IFR student "under the hood"
2.5 Can you log SIC time on a turbo-twin that is multi-crew required under JAA rules and will this count towards the 200 hours?
It would be great if somebody could answer my questions...or could tell me where to find the answer. I read LASORS...but don't know much more now.
Thanks in advance
George
I'm about converting my FAA CPL into an JAA CPL. As I don't have more than 1500 hours...I wonder what hours do count for the license conversion. I did a search but couldn't find a satisfiing answer:
1) Theory: I have to do all the 14 exams. This can be done by distance learning, which takes some time...but shouldn't be a problem.
2) Practical: I need at least 200 hours...but what hours do count?
2.1 You can log solo flight time..of course
2.2 You can't log Safety Pilot time
2.3 Can you log PIC time, when you flew together with an instructor? As it seems it hast to be an accredited course. If it is FAA accredited (Part 141)...is it also OK for the JAA?
2.4 Can you log your PIC "under the hood" time when flying together with a safety pilot?
2.5 Can you log the PIC time as a flight instructor when instructing a new PPL FAA student? What is if this guy logs himself SPIC?
2.6. Can you log the PIC time as a flight instructor when instructing an IFR student "under the hood"
2.5 Can you log SIC time on a turbo-twin that is multi-crew required under JAA rules and will this count towards the 200 hours?
It would be great if somebody could answer my questions...or could tell me where to find the answer. I read LASORS...but don't know much more now.
Thanks in advance
George
Last edited by CleverK1; 7th Aug 2007 at 22:54.