ATPL or CPL?

[chrisbeckett2004]

What is the difference between these? Do you need both before you can fly for an airline?

[Olof]

CPL is the license you get from basic aviation training. Entitles you to fly in light commercial aviation as commander on aircraft not certified for multicrew operation or as co-pilot in a multicrew environment.
ATPL entitles you to act as commander in a multicrew environment and requires that you have at least 1500 total flight time (along with some other hour requirements).
The normal thing as that you get your CPL together with the ATPL theory and thus get a "frozen ATPL" . Once you are eligble for the ATPL it will become "unfrozen".

Cheers,
Olof

[chrisbeckett2004]

re

So it become unfrozen once you have completed the hours?

[Olof]

not automatically...it usually happens together with an OPC. At this stage you're already an employed airline pilot...

[Whopity]

So it become unfrozen once you have completed the hours?

NO! Nothing becomes unfrozen; you actually have to apply for a new licence when you meet all the requirements for an ATPL. The "frozen" ATPL is a myth! It simply means you have a CPL/IR and have passed the theoretical exams necessary for the issue of an ATPL.

[chrisbeckett2004]

re

So you technically could be rejected for an ATPL??

[cheesypeas]

So then, here's a question...once you've got 1,500 hours can you just apply for you ATPL provided you have a VALID LPC/OPC or do you have to wait until you sit an LPC after you have the hours????

[Whopity]

You have to meet all of the requirements listed in JAR-FCL 1.280

JAR–FCL 1.280 Experience and crediting
(See JAR–FCL 1.050(a)(3))
(a) An applicant for an ATPL(A) shall have
completed as a pilot of aeroplanes at least 1500
hours of flight time (see also JAR-FCL
1.050(a)(3)). [Of the 1 500 hours flight time, up
to 100 hours of flight time may have been
completed in FS and FNPT of which a maximum
of 25 hours may have been completed in FNPT,]
including at least:
(1) 500 hours in multi-pilot operations
on aeroplanes type certificated in accordance
with the JAR/FAR–25 Transport category or
the JAR/FAR–23 Commuter category, or
BCAR or AIR 2051;
(2) 250 hours either as pilot-incommand
or at least 100 hours as pilot-incommand
and 150 hours as co-pilot
performing, under the supervision of the pilotin-
command the duties and functions of a
pilot-in-command provided that the method of
supervision is acceptable to the Authority;
(3) 200 hours of cross-country flight
time of which at least 100 hours shall be as
pilot-in-command or as co-pilot performing
under the supervision of the pilot-in-command
the duties and functions of a pilot-incommand,
provided that the method of
supervision is acceptable to the Authority;
(4) 75 hours of instrument time of
which not more than 30 hours may be
instrument ground time; and
(5) 100 hours of night flight as pilot-incommand
or as co-pilot.
(b) (1) Holders of a pilot licence or
equivalent document for other categories of
aircraft will be credited with flight time in such
other categories of aircraft as set out in JAR–
FCL 1.155 except flight time in helicopters
which will be credited up to 50% of all the flight
time requirements of sub-paragraph (a).
(2) Holders of a flight engineer licence
will be credited with 50% of the flight engineer
time up to a maximum credit of 250 hours.
This 250 hours may be credited against the
1 500 hours requirement of sub-paragraph (a),
and the 500 hours requirement of subparagraph
(a)(1), provided that the total credit
given against any of these sub-paragraphs
does not exceed 250 hours.
(c) The experience required shall be
completed before the skill test given in JAR–FCL
1.295 is taken.
[Amdt. 1, 01.06.00; Amdt. 3, 01.07.03]

If you meet those requirements your application should not be rejected.

[abumaria]

ALTP Frozen

I am holding FAA CPL from Texas, now I am based in the UK. What should I do to become eligible to fly in this country as well I need to do ALTP Frozen, for future. Can anyone advice me where should I do it? And cheaper please.
Thank you.

[Stringfellow Dork]

Originally Posted by Whopity

The "frozen" ATPL is a myth!

Type "frozen" into the search function of a PFD copy of LASORS and you will see where perhaps the confusion has arisen from...

It seems that it is the credits for passing the ATPL examinations that are "frozen"...

[Spitfire78]

so this might be *slightly* OT.... but,
exactly to what extent would it be career limiting to only to ME CPL/IR , ie not the ATPL exams? Someone mentioned 'light commercial aviation', and that without the ATPL you could only ever be PIC for single crew aircraft, and F/O for multi-crew.
but if one had absolutely no intention of ever working for a commercial airline, which non-airline prospects would be on the other side of a burnt bridge if one only did the CPL exams?
Thanks
sf78

[BillieBob]

Entitles you to fly in light commercial aviation as commander on aircraft not certified for multicrew operation or as co-pilot in a multicrew environment.

Not quite - you need to have passed the ATPL exams to act as co-pilot of a multi-pilot aeroplane operating under JAR-OPS 1