Gapan - Pilot Aptitude Assessment
Supercharged PPRuNer
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Here’s an idea. Try going to an airline interview and telling them that “. . .£150 to be told your crap by a cruddy compter is inaccurate in my view. . .” Let us know how you get on.
But enough of the joke. The compter in question is owned and operated by the RAF, and is widely acknowledged to be the standard in aptitude tests. Airlines take them very seriously, and so should anyone who aspires to commercial flying - as important as a class 1 medical IMHO.
Not only do you get an objective (and well respected) assessment of your potential, you’ll also get a debrief from a senior training captain. You can – and should – treat this as a mock job interview. You’ll also get to meet lots of like minded people.
Compared to some of the things you’ll be spending money on during your training, £150 for all that seems a bit of a bargain.
But enough of the joke. The compter in question is owned and operated by the RAF, and is widely acknowledged to be the standard in aptitude tests. Airlines take them very seriously, and so should anyone who aspires to commercial flying - as important as a class 1 medical IMHO.
Not only do you get an objective (and well respected) assessment of your potential, you’ll also get a debrief from a senior training captain. You can – and should – treat this as a mock job interview. You’ll also get to meet lots of like minded people.
Compared to some of the things you’ll be spending money on during your training, £150 for all that seems a bit of a bargain.
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The train driving test is hideous, so much so that you must get 100%. The three questions are:
- What does a red light indicate - a) Women of ill-repute; b) You need to stop; c) Don't know
- What do you do if you are tired in the morning - a) Ignore the alarm clock, and lay in bed; b)drag yourself out of bed, there are people depending on you; c) Take a sickie
- What would you do if it is raining - a)Do not step into the train cab. Rain and train tracks are a lethal combination b) So what? c)What is rain
As you can see, even the best minds have to be tested. (Answers are at the back of this evenings timetable from Liverpool Street)
- What does a red light indicate - a) Women of ill-repute; b) You need to stop; c) Don't know
- What do you do if you are tired in the morning - a) Ignore the alarm clock, and lay in bed; b)drag yourself out of bed, there are people depending on you; c) Take a sickie
- What would you do if it is raining - a)Do not step into the train cab. Rain and train tracks are a lethal combination b) So what? c)What is rain
As you can see, even the best minds have to be tested. (Answers are at the back of this evenings timetable from Liverpool Street)
So let's just put things in perspecitve!
I am a 48 year old Boeing 767 Captain with 17600 hours. I was a flying instructor at 19, a CAA TRE at 26 and at 29 I was a 737 Captain.
I left school at 15 with no academic qualifications whatsoever. I was absolutely useless at maths, I found my old school reports the other day, my highest ever maths score was 8/100!
My career was built on the old 'self improver' route, sadly no longer available to all of you thanks to not so nice men in grey suits driving Belgian registered Mercs.
But to answer the question. The GAPAN (I have been an Upper Freeman) tests were invented to provide some form of 'self assessment' for those who wanted to see if it was worthwhile spending the money involved. I applaud the idea but it is not to be taken too seriously.
Frankly, if you find your abilities to study adequately served by your motivation to learn, and it is motivation that will make you succeed, then you will get there in the end.
Above all stay flexible, if there is a job at the other end of the country that might give you what you want, then you quit your girlfriend, tell you mother that your'e leaving home, and you pack your bags and go.
Above all keep flying and keep current, given the choice of going to that factory to earn enough to afford that Instrument rating, or struggle as flying instructor, then keep struggling. You'll be in the right place to hear of the best opportunities to get the rating that bit cheaper and the jobs to follow.
At the end of the day you will be looked at for who your are, and what type rating you have. How well you fly is totally irrelevant in today's airline market. Once experienced you are only as good as your type rating.
The GAPAN tests will help you decide, but if your heart says you can do it, and you seem to be told that your progress is at least average, then given the motivation.......you'll make it.
Good Luck.
I am a 48 year old Boeing 767 Captain with 17600 hours. I was a flying instructor at 19, a CAA TRE at 26 and at 29 I was a 737 Captain.
I left school at 15 with no academic qualifications whatsoever. I was absolutely useless at maths, I found my old school reports the other day, my highest ever maths score was 8/100!
My career was built on the old 'self improver' route, sadly no longer available to all of you thanks to not so nice men in grey suits driving Belgian registered Mercs.
But to answer the question. The GAPAN (I have been an Upper Freeman) tests were invented to provide some form of 'self assessment' for those who wanted to see if it was worthwhile spending the money involved. I applaud the idea but it is not to be taken too seriously.
Frankly, if you find your abilities to study adequately served by your motivation to learn, and it is motivation that will make you succeed, then you will get there in the end.
Above all stay flexible, if there is a job at the other end of the country that might give you what you want, then you quit your girlfriend, tell you mother that your'e leaving home, and you pack your bags and go.
Above all keep flying and keep current, given the choice of going to that factory to earn enough to afford that Instrument rating, or struggle as flying instructor, then keep struggling. You'll be in the right place to hear of the best opportunities to get the rating that bit cheaper and the jobs to follow.
At the end of the day you will be looked at for who your are, and what type rating you have. How well you fly is totally irrelevant in today's airline market. Once experienced you are only as good as your type rating.
The GAPAN tests will help you decide, but if your heart says you can do it, and you seem to be told that your progress is at least average, then given the motivation.......you'll make it.
Good Luck.
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GAPAN Testing??
I have been toying with the idea of doing a GAPAN test after a mate told me that it looks good on your flying CV!!
After making enquiries I have been advised that it is not really worth me doing it. I have clocked 140 hours and hold an IMC rating. An advisor reckoned they may not have me as the cut off limit is 150 hours for pilots.
So, I have decided not to bother!!
What I wonder though is this:-
The test is designed to establish a candidates suitability as a pilot by getting them to undertake certain tasks.
I have flown in cloud, IMC, alone... The multi-tasking involved here should more than cover any doubts anyone may have regarding suitability for doing an ATPL. (When I say anyone I mean me!!).
Who has done this test and whats it all about????
I am interested.
Soggy
After making enquiries I have been advised that it is not really worth me doing it. I have clocked 140 hours and hold an IMC rating. An advisor reckoned they may not have me as the cut off limit is 150 hours for pilots.
So, I have decided not to bother!!
What I wonder though is this:-
The test is designed to establish a candidates suitability as a pilot by getting them to undertake certain tasks.
I have flown in cloud, IMC, alone... The multi-tasking involved here should more than cover any doubts anyone may have regarding suitability for doing an ATPL. (When I say anyone I mean me!!).
Who has done this test and whats it all about????
I am interested.
Soggy
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I did it and got the high score (just thought I would drop that in). I had to question if they just gave the high score to everybody as I had my doubts, born of the surprise of doing well as I was convinced I would be a disaster!
The test is only for inexperienced wannabes. The test is actually corrupted if you have experience, as established pilots don't neccessarily do well on it. The reason being the controls in the test do not behave like real controls. The test's primary purpose is to perform a few checks on how your brain is wired up and if that wiring puts you in a category of people who would respond well to flight training. The test has been built on empirical evidence amassed by the RAF and is used by the RAF as part of its candidate selection process.
Hope that helps.
The test is only for inexperienced wannabes. The test is actually corrupted if you have experience, as established pilots don't neccessarily do well on it. The reason being the controls in the test do not behave like real controls. The test's primary purpose is to perform a few checks on how your brain is wired up and if that wiring puts you in a category of people who would respond well to flight training. The test has been built on empirical evidence amassed by the RAF and is used by the RAF as part of its candidate selection process.
Hope that helps.
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I did it last year and got the high score too (may as well squeeze that in too!!).
I would agree that it is to show the chances of you being able to pass flight training, though has little or no bearing on the theoretical ability of a candidate.
Tests include hand/eye/foot coordination, interpretation and numerical memory tests.
Not sure how valuable it is on your CV, though told it may help at a later stage when the begging bowl goes out to the bank manager!! However it does help to convince oneself that there is some "natural" ability in there somewhere
I would agree that it is to show the chances of you being able to pass flight training, though has little or no bearing on the theoretical ability of a candidate.
Tests include hand/eye/foot coordination, interpretation and numerical memory tests.
Not sure how valuable it is on your CV, though told it may help at a later stage when the begging bowl goes out to the bank manager!! However it does help to convince oneself that there is some "natural" ability in there somewhere
Supercharged PPRuNer
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Try having a look at this:
http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthr...ferrerid=23370
http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthr...ferrerid=23370
Join Date: Dec 1997
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I would have thought that it's pretty obvious that any kind of testing to establish aptitude (or lack of it) for any occupation can only have any accuracy if the tests are carried out before any professional training is undertaken! This is one of the reasons why some employers want candidates who have little or no experience at the time of selection.
Aptitude tests are not trophies to boast on CVs, they are protection for your (or an employer's) money. There's little point in investing £50k plus in ATPL training if your aptitude is poor. That's not to say you couldn't pass an ATPL; anyone can, with enough time and money thrown at them. Unfortunately, employers need pilots who can be trained on complex aircraft within a very limited time, and who can be trusted with that equipment after their training. We all know people we wouldn't let out of our sight on a child's bike, and they're the ones that aptitude testing is designed to filter out.
Soggy, you may be God's gift to aviation. You may not, and an aptitude test before your training would have given you a clue which description fits you. It doesn't follow that because you have done a CPL, you are a good pilot.....
Aptitude tests are not trophies to boast on CVs, they are protection for your (or an employer's) money. There's little point in investing £50k plus in ATPL training if your aptitude is poor. That's not to say you couldn't pass an ATPL; anyone can, with enough time and money thrown at them. Unfortunately, employers need pilots who can be trained on complex aircraft within a very limited time, and who can be trusted with that equipment after their training. We all know people we wouldn't let out of our sight on a child's bike, and they're the ones that aptitude testing is designed to filter out.
Soggy, you may be God's gift to aviation. You may not, and an aptitude test before your training would have given you a clue which description fits you. It doesn't follow that because you have done a CPL, you are a good pilot.....
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The GAPAN tests are purely to test your ability to grasp concepts quickly and correctly.
When I did them at RAF Cranwell you had to pass them just to get through to the next part of the interviews
When I did them at RAF Cranwell you had to pass them just to get through to the next part of the interviews
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Aptitude tests are not trophies to boast on CVs, they are protection for your (or an employer's) money. There's little point in investing £50k plus in ATPL training if your aptitude is poor.
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GAPAN aptitude test - a good indicator?
I sat these tests at RAF Cranwell last Thursday along with about 20 other wannabes. Much to my amazement, I scored 'high' suitability for flight training.
I've read other posts on pprune and a lot of people also seem to score 'high'. My initial elation at the test result is now being tempered with the realisation that perhaps a 'high' is nothing special - perhaps a lot of those sitting get this result.
So to my question. Does a 'high' result from the GAPAN test mean anything? Would it be a waste of any aptitude I may have if I choose not to pursue this career?
I'm not naive - I know the state of the market and understand plenty about the downsides of this industry. But I told myself I'd decide whether to go further once I had my Class 1 Medical (obtained in Jan 2003) and a reasonable result from GAPAN, so now it's crunch time.
I've read other posts on pprune and a lot of people also seem to score 'high'. My initial elation at the test result is now being tempered with the realisation that perhaps a 'high' is nothing special - perhaps a lot of those sitting get this result.
So to my question. Does a 'high' result from the GAPAN test mean anything? Would it be a waste of any aptitude I may have if I choose not to pursue this career?
I'm not naive - I know the state of the market and understand plenty about the downsides of this industry. But I told myself I'd decide whether to go further once I had my Class 1 Medical (obtained in Jan 2003) and a reasonable result from GAPAN, so now it's crunch time.
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The GAPAN aptitude tests are a good - but not foolproof - indicator of your ability to untertake and pass flying training to a professional level within the normal timescale. Of course a 'high' aptitude result is nothing to get too excited about, because all the work is still ahead of you, but if you had a 'low' aptitude score perhaps you might think carefully before investing upwards of £50,000 on training that may well not lead to a job.
Think of these tests as a kind of reassurance that, if you put the work in, you have every chance of succeeding in qualifying for an airliner's flight deck. Just hope the jobs are there when you're ready!
As a last point, remember the RAF underwrites its entire aircrew recruiting policy with these tests, and they have found the correlation to be very significant.
Scroggs
Virgin/Wannabes Operator
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Think of these tests as a kind of reassurance that, if you put the work in, you have every chance of succeeding in qualifying for an airliner's flight deck. Just hope the jobs are there when you're ready!
As a last point, remember the RAF underwrites its entire aircrew recruiting policy with these tests, and they have found the correlation to be very significant.
Scroggs
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As a last point, remember the RAF underwrites its entire aircrew recruiting policy with these tests, and they have found the correlation to be very significant.
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I think that if the RAF have a good correlation between the GAPAN tests and a persons ability to complete flying training, we should not believe it any different for those taking the tests outside the RAF selection.
In addition, although stated that most candidates perform well, we must ask the question of who is taking the tests. If we took a small town or village and made everyone take the test then I don't believe all would be graded "high" or "average." With the tests exceeding 100 quid a go, most people paying for the tests out of their own pocket would probably have deem themselves to have a pretty good chance of passing therefore probably skewing the results indicating the tests are easy.
AF
In addition, although stated that most candidates perform well, we must ask the question of who is taking the tests. If we took a small town or village and made everyone take the test then I don't believe all would be graded "high" or "average." With the tests exceeding 100 quid a go, most people paying for the tests out of their own pocket would probably have deem themselves to have a pretty good chance of passing therefore probably skewing the results indicating the tests are easy.
AF
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My thoughts exactly Autofly.
Some of the joystick tests would be pretty familiar to anyone who has played with windy ILS approches in MS Flight Sim - precisely what a lot of wannabes would have been doing for years.
Indeed you could argue that by showing the initiative to seek out the GAPAN tests, and parting with £150 for the experience, candidates have already demonstrated above-average aptitude for training.
And I got 'high' too. Gissajob.
Some of the joystick tests would be pretty familiar to anyone who has played with windy ILS approches in MS Flight Sim - precisely what a lot of wannabes would have been doing for years.
Indeed you could argue that by showing the initiative to seek out the GAPAN tests, and parting with £150 for the experience, candidates have already demonstrated above-average aptitude for training.
And I got 'high' too. Gissajob.
Why do it if it's not fun?
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Maybe the people who don't score "high" decide that they'd be better off studying for some alternative career - so they don't hang around on PPRuNe, or in other pilots' circles, and we don't hear about them???
Just a thought.... I'll go back into my corner now.
FFF
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Just a thought.... I'll go back into my corner now.
FFF
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Has anybody sat the BA aptitude as well as the GAPAN, the comparrison would be interesting to know.
I have sat the BA aptitude twice but did not get any further. Past the computer part, and maths part, but the verbal reasoning....well I guess I did not reason correctly.
Im still confident and time will only tell
Mint
I have sat the BA aptitude twice but did not get any further. Past the computer part, and maths part, but the verbal reasoning....well I guess I did not reason correctly.
Im still confident and time will only tell
Mint