Accident @ Orlando flight Training
Thread Starter
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 29
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From: UK
Accident @ Orlando flight Training
Hi all.
....the pilot was apparently on his second solo...VERY lucky to have survived this...
Check out this for a pic of the plane - http://www.wesh.com/news/2466121/detail.html
NTSB Identification: MIA03LA179
14 CFR Part 91: General Aviation
Accident occurred Tuesday, September 09, 2003 in Kissimmee, FL
Aircraft: Cessna 152, registration: N5172B
Injuries: 1 Minor.
This is preliminary information, subject to change, and may contain errors. Any errors in this report will be corrected when the final report has been completed.
On September 9, 2003, about 0905 eastern daylight time, a Cessna 152, N5172B, owned and operated by Orlando Flight Training Inc., lost engine power and impacted with trees during a forced landing, at the Kissimmee Airport, Kissimmee, Florida. Visual meteorological conditions prevailed at the time, and no flight plan was filed. The local instructional flight was conducted under 14 CFR Part 91. The airplane was substantially damaged. The student pilot reported minor injuries. The flight was originating at the time.
According to the student pilot, after taking off, and at an altitude of about 200 to 300 feet mean sea level, the airplane's engine lost power. The pilot made a 180-degree turn back to the airport, but was unable to reach the runway, and impacted with trees on the northwest corner of the airport.
....the pilot was apparently on his second solo...VERY lucky to have survived this...
Check out this for a pic of the plane - http://www.wesh.com/news/2466121/detail.html
NTSB Identification: MIA03LA179
14 CFR Part 91: General Aviation
Accident occurred Tuesday, September 09, 2003 in Kissimmee, FL
Aircraft: Cessna 152, registration: N5172B
Injuries: 1 Minor.
This is preliminary information, subject to change, and may contain errors. Any errors in this report will be corrected when the final report has been completed.
On September 9, 2003, about 0905 eastern daylight time, a Cessna 152, N5172B, owned and operated by Orlando Flight Training Inc., lost engine power and impacted with trees during a forced landing, at the Kissimmee Airport, Kissimmee, Florida. Visual meteorological conditions prevailed at the time, and no flight plan was filed. The local instructional flight was conducted under 14 CFR Part 91. The airplane was substantially damaged. The student pilot reported minor injuries. The flight was originating at the time.
According to the student pilot, after taking off, and at an altitude of about 200 to 300 feet mean sea level, the airplane's engine lost power. The pilot made a 180-degree turn back to the airport, but was unable to reach the runway, and impacted with trees on the northwest corner of the airport.
Why do it if it's not fun?
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 4,782
Likes: 12
From: Bournemouth
Obviously can't comment on any particular case without knowing all the facts.
But, in general, students should not be going solo unless they are proficient at EFATO techniques. That includes landing straight ahead, or if that's not possible, a turn of up to 30 degrees. I know my PPL instructor wouldn't have sent me solo unless he was confident that I knew how to do this. And, when my PPL instructor was off sick and another instructor signed me off for solo circuits, this instructor also had me do an EFATO whilst checking me out.
Glad to hear that the injuries were only minor, and I wish the pilot a speedy recovery.
FFF
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But, in general, students should not be going solo unless they are proficient at EFATO techniques. That includes landing straight ahead, or if that's not possible, a turn of up to 30 degrees. I know my PPL instructor wouldn't have sent me solo unless he was confident that I knew how to do this. And, when my PPL instructor was off sick and another instructor signed me off for solo circuits, this instructor also had me do an EFATO whilst checking me out.
Glad to hear that the injuries were only minor, and I wish the pilot a speedy recovery.
FFF
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Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 1,430
Likes: 44
From: FL390
all other things aside... thank god the pilot only received minor injuries.. could have been much worse.
I did my PPL training and the airport is surrounded by tree and houses.. not many options with a dead engine at that height
I did my PPL training and the airport is surrounded by tree and houses.. not many options with a dead engine at that height
Last edited by spitfire747; 12th September 2003 at 16:29.
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 1,040
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From: Yorkshire
There is another thread running at the mo on 180s, Genghis played with them and reckons he lost between 400-600ft in the turn (if I remember rightly), so would also explain why he hit the trees.
If Orlando is anything like LGB then landing ahead is certainly not an option, just about every square inch has been built on so a 180 may the lesser of two evils!
If Orlando is anything like LGB then landing ahead is certainly not an option, just about every square inch has been built on so a 180 may the lesser of two evils!
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 1,178
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From: BFS
If thats the case must have been a tough choice! I was the same, constantly being checked on EFATO's whenever sent solo by new instructor and always the same message drummed in - don't turn back! If this guy had no choice must have been a scary experience!!
Thread Starter
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 29
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From: UK
hmm
difficult choice indeed...I have just returned from OFT after an IMC rating...I heard he was on 33...if so then straight ahead was the highway 192 and a big clump of trees...and lots of buildings...
Although agreed that turning back was not the correct procedure, he may well , with his limited experience have felt that he had no option....
It will be interesting to see what the cause of the engine out was though ........
difficult choice indeed...I have just returned from OFT after an IMC rating...I heard he was on 33...if so then straight ahead was the highway 192 and a big clump of trees...and lots of buildings...
Although agreed that turning back was not the correct procedure, he may well , with his limited experience have felt that he had no option....
It will be interesting to see what the cause of the engine out was though ........
Thread Starter
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 29
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From: UK
Well..
I was told ...EFATO with not sufficient runway...land straight ahead or max 30 degree turns....though the options for landing are limited, at around 2-300 ft , a 180 turn would be practically impossible.... It does raise an interesting dilemma for airfields where straight ahead is in fact NOT an option!
I was told ...EFATO with not sufficient runway...land straight ahead or max 30 degree turns....though the options for landing are limited, at around 2-300 ft , a 180 turn would be practically impossible.... It does raise an interesting dilemma for airfields where straight ahead is in fact NOT an option!
Jet Blast Rat
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 2,081
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From: Sarfend-on-Sea
Lucky man.
For future reference in the discussion, even if there is no decent landing ground ahead, turning back should not be tried in these circumstances. A controlled crash ahead is better than an uncontrolled crash. The only reason to turn away by choice that low (I agree that this student was too inexperienced to be expected not to try) is to sacrifice yourself for the lives of people on the ground.
For future reference in the discussion, even if there is no decent landing ground ahead, turning back should not be tried in these circumstances. A controlled crash ahead is better than an uncontrolled crash. The only reason to turn away by choice that low (I agree that this student was too inexperienced to be expected not to try) is to sacrifice yourself for the lives of people on the ground.
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 437
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From: UK
This guy is actually a 'buddy' of mine..... he is part of my C150 syndicate at Shoreham. I won't give out his name but I can confirm he's OK...... a few bumps and bruises. BUT, you'll be very pleased to know as soon as he was discharged from hospital he was back up flying. Good man !!
Of course, he'll have to put up with all the stick from the rest of the group now..... D.R, the man with more take offs than landings.
Best of luck to him.
Of course, he'll have to put up with all the stick from the rest of the group now..... D.R, the man with more take offs than landings.
Best of luck to him.
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 305
Likes: 0
From: Manchester, UK
Nooooooooooo!
This was the aircraft i first flew when i got to OFT, and the one i first soloed in. It holds a very special place in my heart.
While i was there, the EFATO proceadures were drilled into my head, but that was because i had an excellent instructor.
A very very sad day for me.
I considered that plane to be my plane when i was flying over there. It will be sadly missed.
Glad to hear the guy is ok though.
At 200ft, you are pretty much right over the main road into Kissimmee, and to be honest there are not too many places to land. THere is a Wallmart on the left and loads of apartments and restaurants all around. Im sure it was a tough call.
Regards
Alex
RIP N5172B
This was the aircraft i first flew when i got to OFT, and the one i first soloed in. It holds a very special place in my heart.
While i was there, the EFATO proceadures were drilled into my head, but that was because i had an excellent instructor.
A very very sad day for me.
I considered that plane to be my plane when i was flying over there. It will be sadly missed.
Glad to hear the guy is ok though.
At 200ft, you are pretty much right over the main road into Kissimmee, and to be honest there are not too many places to land. THere is a Wallmart on the left and loads of apartments and restaurants all around. Im sure it was a tough call.
Regards
Alex
RIP N5172B
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 6
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From: uk
Buzzc - Hi its Dave here.
Yes, I was faced with a tough choice, ahead, houses, trees, some roads with cars on them. I checked the roads some time afterwards actually, they have telegraph poles carrying mains power over the roads, poles down the sides too. There were quite a few people in cars, it was just gone 9.00am.
I know never to turn back to the same runway - I knew the procedure, It all happend soooo fast, I didnt even get a chance to get a call out to tower..
Ive done over 40 hrs passenger in C150 (we counted before I left for the US) and I know whats written, but the options were limited, as far as I could see at the time I saw a clearing and headed for it.
Needless to say I got an expensive chopper ride and hospital bill for the checkout. (2KGBP). And I couldnt see out of the window on the chopper either!
Some bruses, but Im fine. I reckon my luck was well and truly in that morning. And - yep Im continuing. Im not going to be an ATPL or nothing, just pleasure flights in the 150 I have a share in, if all goes well with the PPL.
Stay safe everyone... the guys Im learning with here reckon I should take up tree collecting as a new hobby.
edited - forgot to mention, sorry about knackering your fave plane, it really was a nice one that flew nice that was for sure
Yes, I was faced with a tough choice, ahead, houses, trees, some roads with cars on them. I checked the roads some time afterwards actually, they have telegraph poles carrying mains power over the roads, poles down the sides too. There were quite a few people in cars, it was just gone 9.00am.
I know never to turn back to the same runway - I knew the procedure, It all happend soooo fast, I didnt even get a chance to get a call out to tower..
Ive done over 40 hrs passenger in C150 (we counted before I left for the US) and I know whats written, but the options were limited, as far as I could see at the time I saw a clearing and headed for it.
Needless to say I got an expensive chopper ride and hospital bill for the checkout. (2KGBP). And I couldnt see out of the window on the chopper either!
Some bruses, but Im fine. I reckon my luck was well and truly in that morning. And - yep Im continuing. Im not going to be an ATPL or nothing, just pleasure flights in the 150 I have a share in, if all goes well with the PPL.
Stay safe everyone... the guys Im learning with here reckon I should take up tree collecting as a new hobby.
edited - forgot to mention, sorry about knackering your fave plane, it really was a nice one that flew nice that was for sure
Last edited by the_ridders; 22nd September 2003 at 02:07.
Why do it if it's not fun?
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 4,782
Likes: 12
From: Bournemouth
I can only echo what ChrisVJ says. I don't know the field, but it doesn't sound like an easy choice. Glad you lived to tell the tale, and that you're back up again.
FFF
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FFF
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