Goodwood rip-off!!!
 

Hi All

My daughter's partner is participating in the Festival of Speed at Goodwood over the weekend of July 11th - 13th.

Due to my daughter having to attend a family wedding on the Saturday, I offered to fly her down to Goodwood on the Sunday morning.

I just called Goodwood Ops to book an arrival slot for the Sunday morning, as they only started accepting bookings on Monday.

Well, the good news was that they have plenty of arrival slots available, the BAD news is that they are imposing a whopping landing fee of £50.00 per SEAT !!! :eek:

Now, according to the Goodwood aerodrome web site, the visitor landing fee for our aircraft (a Jodel) is £16.38, but as technically our aircraft is a 2 + 2 seater, we would be charged £200.00 landing fee !!

The official explanation is that 'they are encouraging aircraft to fill all their seats......'

Yeah right...........!

The words 'off' and 'rip' spring to mind. :rolleyes:

I flew in a year or two back and the standard landing fee for a PA28 included a car to take us to the event:D

About a year later they seemed to discover that the market would stand a great deal more :*

Curiously enough I haven't been to the event since then.

Sadly, Johnm has hit it on the head, they've discovered people will pay much more so they'll charge it! That's not just L/fee but gate price too.

It is a real shame as the FoS is an excellent event, I went to the first few in the mid-90's and it was good value, after a break of some years I went again '03-'05 as an engineer/camera op on the television OB so got in free but was shocked at the extent the prices had skyrocketed.
Like I say, it's a great pity as it's one of the only events of it's kind, well organised and suits the real enthusiast but is now so grossly over-priced it deters the people it was originally intended to attract.:=

I bet plenty of people will pay. I love the Festival of Speed. Its just basic Supply and Demand.
If I owned Goodwood and knew the demand was there I would charge more.... I bet the cost of flying into F1 at Silverstone (heli's of course) is far far greater.
:}

No, it's not supply and demand, it's a rip-off. :ugh:

There is a fair and reasonable price to pay for anything; then there is the price you actually pay. IMHO it is as morally wrong to keep raising prices 'to see what the market will bear' as the current practice by supermarkets of battering farmers in order to sell produce for absurdly small amounts on the supermarket cells using the excuse that making things cheaper for the consumer is always a good thing. They don't call this place 'Rip-off Britain' for nothing. :* I think it's a curious twist that Britain is famously a socialist country, yet suffers from the worse failings of pure capitalist greed.

I imagine I'm not alone in simply boycotting events which are ridiculously over-priced. It may smack of cutting off my nose to spite my face, but I'd rather not got to an event where I would spend the whole time resenting the entrance fee. The people who are more than happy to pay unreasonable amounts are probably not the sort of people in whose company I would want to spend time anyway...

[Rant over] :E

The price you pay for something is what the something is worth to you.

Otherwise, if it's not worth it, you'll choose not to pay the price.

"Rip-off" only applies if there's something dishonest going on, like for example making it impossible for you to find out what the landing fee is until after you've landed, and then impounding the aircraft until you pay.

Quote: "Rip-off" only applies if there's something dishonest going on, like for example making it impossible for you to find out what the landing fee is until after you've landed, and then impounding the aircraft until you pay.

Not in my book.......... :hmm:

Dictionary: rip-off (rĭp'ôf', -ŏf')

n. Slang.

A product or service that is overpriced or of poor quality.
Something, such as a film or story, that is clearly imitative of or based on something else.
A theft.
An act of exploitation.

Goodwood encouraging pilots to risk overweight operation
 

Due to their absurd landing fine policy, the robbers of Goodwood are ipso facto encouraging aircraft pilots to fill all their aircrafts' seats.

This may well encourage the unwary to operate aircraft such as the PA28-140 with 4 adults - and probably overweight.

Any accidents caused as a result could well be a direct outcome of Goodwood's corporate greed....:mad: Has anyone mentioned this to them?

I enjoy cars.

I have only been to the festival once. It was brilliant to fly into Goodwood, miss all the traffic (which I gather can be horrendous) and be bused into the show ground via the VIP entrance. On that occasion the service was first class.

However that said, the "show ground" was packed with car manufacturers predalling their cars and the hill climb, whilst interesting, was for me hardly exciting. Setting aside the cost (and of course the entertainment of the hill climb) I am not convinced I want to pay that much to visit a "trade" exhibition when I can visit dealers show rooms for nothing.

Of course that is just my personal view and I fully appreciate an awful lot of people consider it very good value. Goodwood are entitled to charge whatever they like - and ultimately if people consider they are charging to much they will not go.

Personally I think the Revival far surpasses this event.

Utter nonsense.

Nobody is obliged to attend. I may choose not to go due to the charges, but have absolute respect for Goodwood (or anyone else's) right to set charges for their own airfield as they see fit.

Goodwood is a place I had penciled in to visit but having read the above I will not be attending. A charge like that is saying "We don't want you."
DO

Mariner9

On the specific issue of should they charge this amount I dont think it is that simple.

Of course they can charge what they like.

However there are many businesses that take an alternative stance by recognising that even in a capatilist economy there are other factors at work.

For example I have started a thread on the question of whether airports should charge for go arounds. Of course they can, but some might argue they have a responsibility to encourage pilots to conduct themselves safely.

In the case of Goodwood there are many of us who visit them frequently. We might like to believe we are good regular customer who contribute to their airfield income throughout the year. We might also like to think that as good customers the owners would not always want to charge the most they could simply because they can but would recognise that we are part of a small community.

Imagine what the LTA could charge for centre court tickets on finals day if they simply took the view that the tickets should be priced on the basis of what the market will stand - no they are to be commended for recognising that there is a community of tennis players that supports the LTA throughout the year and rightly the tickets should be made available to that community through the clubs at a reasonable price rather than on the basis of who is prepared to pay the most.

Maybe its time for your daughter to learn how to parachute? ;-)

You raise some fair points Fuji, but I maintain my view that Goodwood's charges are entirely up to them.

I've no support per se for high landing fees, but perhaps Goodwood management would say that the income from this event allows lower landing fees for the rest of the year for their loyal customers.

Will be interesting to see how many aircraft actually do fly in this year, particularly given the current economic climate. If attendances are low they will certainly be forced to re-think their strategy for next year's event.

DO,

Just for clarification, these higher landing fees are only charged by Goodwood during their motorsport events (ie Festival of Speed and the Revival Meeting.)

At all other times, the landing fees are very reasonable. And Goodwood is a lovely airfield (and area) to visit.

Excellent! :D :D

Has anybody else considered the fact that whilst charging for super expensive times, it makes it cheaper for the rest of us during the quieter times ?

some on here have said it makes it cheaper for the rest of us during the rest of the year. i had to pay 15 pounds in landing fees for a C152 last year and thought it was a bit too much...

Are you kidding Wombat?

The price you pay for something is rarely linked to what it's worth to you! :ugh: That kind of black and white statement avoids the point entirely. My willingness to pay £1.30 for a litre of diesel in no way represents what I think that litre is worth. I have no choice but to pay whatever they charge. Expanding on that analogy, the high oil prices we are paying are being manipulated by OPEC. They could increase supply in order to reduce price at the pumps, but they have us over a barrel (excuse the pun), and would prefer to keep supply low and prices high. They would also say that the market is 'bearing' the price.

Just because going to Goodwood is voluntary and there will always be those with more money to throw at these things than others, does not excuse the blatant profiteering. IMHO of course.

Rip-off
 

On balance I would say that this is a rip-off, a charge of £50 per person would be reasonable but charging per seat is clearly charging for something that due to performance reasons can't be used with a lot of aircraft.

On those grounds charging for something that can't be used is undoubtedly a rip-off as defined in the dictionary above.

The price you pay is always what it's worth to you, otherwise you won't pay it.

You do have a choice about paying £1.30 for diesel. You can choose not to buy diesel. The fact that you continue to buy it means that it's worth it to you, and that you prefer it to the alternative, which is not driving so much.

Example: If the price of diesel was such that it cost you twice as much to drive to work as you could earn in a day then you could give up work and be better off. In this case the price would be higher than what it was worth to you, which you would prove by refusing to buy.

Think laterally. Take all the seats out and get in for nothing.

I think there is confusion between "the price you pay is what it is worth to you" and a person's perception of whether they have "value for money".

It may be well worth it to you to pay BA £1,000 to get to a meeting in Germany at 12 hours notice, but you may not consider the flight good value for money given that the same flight a week earlier was £250.

Moreover, value to most is a moveable feast. If you pay to watch a cricket match and England win after a close battle that runs through out the day you may well consider the price you paid for the ticket was worth it to you, but if they slaughtered the opposition after two and a quarter hours you might well not!

As it usually the case you are in a much better position to judge whether it was worth paying the price after you received the service rather than before. :)

Oh, absolutely. If you think you're buying "x" and what you actually get turns out to be "y" then you might have a different perception of value. But in this case it seems fairly clear cut - you pay "x" and you get to land your aeroplane. You have, in advance, all the information you need in order to decide whether you think it's worth it.

Are you sure?

Clearly you pay X to land your aircraft AND the "privilege" to fly into the show ground - other wise Goodwood would charge you the normal landing fee. (Has got me thinking whether the landing fee includes the entry fee or not this year - when I last went the entry fee was in addition to).

Once you have come out of the show ground you might or you might not decide you didnt get value for money for the extra privilege for which you paid. :)

As I said earlier personally I didnt think the event was worth the entry fee - but then clearly I am in a very small minority.

Poppy-cock...:p

I think Fuji-Abound is on the right track talking about value for money. That is the point, not whether you're forced to pay over the odds for something.

IMHO you can talk about supply and demand economics until you're blue in the face, but we all know what constitutes a rip-off. Doubling the price while your costs remain stable in order to double the profit... is greed.

Goodwood are quite right to charge whatever they like. Everyone can choose whether to go or not. If no-one went the price would be reduced.

This is VERY simple market economics.

The choices are -

1. Don't go
2. Go by bus/train/car and pay less
3. go, but moan about how much it costs and ruin your enjoyment
4. go, and enjoy it (and maybe fill your seats, as suggested)

also maybe...
5. fly in, but take a two seater

Surely the point has been missed. Big businesses will always pay "top dollar" prices for quality corporate entertaining opportunities. The same goes for landing charges, so that they can impress their clients and potential clients by flying them into the event as well. They can set the expenses against tax, recover the VAT and get new business as well. So if Goodwood can sell all or most of the tickets and landing slots to businesses, to permit the attendance of those who don't know or care where they are so long as it is exclusive and they are plied with copious quantities of expensive food and wine, that must make good commercial sense. If, in addition, that keeps the hoi poloi (another word for those who are genuinely enthusiastic about vintage motor vehicles and aeroplanes) out, surely that makes it better still. It's what corporate entertaining is all about. Just like a test match I once attended, as the guest of a large accountancy firm. Only one other person and I ventured out onto the balcony to watch the cricket. The rest remained in the corporate hospitality suite eating and drinking. But then, why did they need to do so when the television was on in the suite and it was showing the cricket! Perhaps Goodwood needs to enhance its corporate appeal by the addition of corporate hospitality suites with close circuit televisions showing all that is going on outside, so that the guests of the big businesses don't need to drag themselves away from the food and wine to venture outside! Now do I hear someone suggesting that I might be a tad cynical?

Cheap at half the price..............
 

to have the opportunity to see the 06 Le Mans-winning Panoz Esperante and new Ginetta G50 speed up the hill!

The show is getting bigger and better every year, this costs money, the landing charges per seat (including ticket fee) is going to reflect that. I daresay it's also a way to quelle demand as I bet there are more aircraft wanting to fly in than there are slots available.

It's possible to get in for free this year (as it is every year) courtesey of The Times Online. Ask for free tickets and you shall receive.

Complaining about trade stands etc. is just bizarre; every show of this ilk does exactly the same. Go to Hickstead yesterday - how many horse-related business do you think have trade stands around the show ground?

Personally I think it's an excellent event. I love the diversity of the machinery on display and in action, I love wondering up the hill to the rally stage and the top paddock and there's simply no other event of its type in the UK that gives you the kind of access and experience that you can get at the FoS.

Was this £50/seat charge imposed last year also? I was intending on flying in with three people in a PA28 this time round, I don't think I'd get it off the ground with four on board and sufficient fuel! Did this charge include the entry into the event as well?

I've just been informed that it would cost £200 to land on the Sunday, but you do get 'VIP transport and hospitality'. Think that's probably going to be a bit pricey for me :(

We flew in for free on 1st May, 'The Ultimate Fly In'. We have since received free tickets for the F of S. Balance that out against the original post and the marketing model gets very interesting. If I use the ticket, I won't be going by air.

I don't fly in anywhere without a good idea of the landing fee. When it represents any measurable proportion (say 1/1000) of the worth of my 2 seater it's time to go elsewhere. Incidentally a 'free' landing invariably means one spends as much or more elsehow, which is as it should be, perhaps....

Also got my Free ticket for the Friday FOS, just for dropping by and landing at the May day Fly-in.
Excellent initiative by Goodwood and one that they should continue.... after all I will be spending cash at the event at the very least on Food and drink.

Unlikely that I will fly in, .......... however I will avoid the queues by Motorbike :ok:

Face it folks!
You are being asked to keep Lord March in the manner to which he has become accustomed.

F of S / Grand Prix
 

So how does £85+ vat to land at Turweston and be transported to GP sound?

Grand Prix
 

Per seat?
DO.

Makes entertaining reading, this thread!
Of course, you don't have to attend at all, let alone in an aeroplane. I may well go but by surface transport and will remember well my first visit to the circuit.

I flew - as a passenger - in a Tiger Moth from Panshanger to the Whit Monday race meeting in '58 or 9. Fantastic value as we went dct and straight across central London except for a circuit round the Crystal Palace TV mast. No landing fee and we were straight in to the paddock and members enclosure.

Those very definitely WERE the days!
rgsaero

Presumably if the fees this year are similar to what they were last year when this thread began, there were enough takers for them to justify those prices?

FOS is a bit over-rated IMHO, so woouldn't consider paying the inflated landing fees.
The Revival meeting on the other hand is still value for money even at the increased prices.
Incidentally, how much is it to land on the Thursday and depart on the Friday?
If Thursday fee is usual one then I think my a/c may fail to start on Thursday evening!