Fly in Spain Jerez - personal review PPL training
 

Hello,

to everyone who is thinking about going for a PPL-licence at Fly-in-Spain (FIS) in Jerez, Spain I share my experience in a few words.

Having checked this forum for reviews on schools I decided to give it a try with FIS since this was the one where only one single negative review existed and which was also resolved in an open manner as far as I can tell. Also prices were reasonable.

So I (mid 30s, male) went to FIS between February and April this year to start the PPL from scratch. I haven`t had the time to read any books in advance and I had a time frame of max. two months to get everything done. I booked only one week in advance and it was no problem.

Organisation
School rooms are not the newest but absolutely do serve their purpose for getting theoretical knowledge into the brains, for planning flights and having a chat with others. The staff at FIS always was friendly to me. There is one secretary who takes care of organisational stuff such as the student`s flight accounts or room booking for in of two shared apartments (if needed). There is one person taking care of booking instructors to the student`s schedules as needed. Sometimes the owner is there, also friendly and interesting to talk to.

Getting the medical was no problem, but because at FIS one is applying for the EASA PPL issued by the British CAA the initial medical had to be done by a British doctor in Gibraltar (1,5 hr trip by car).

Training
Having mentioned the administrative part which is limited to a minimum in the background, there is the training staff at FIS who in my point of view contribute 95% to the whole thing being a success or not. I was flying with two different instructors and both gave me very valuable training and knowledge. Especially emergency situations (engine failure, emergency landings) were simulated and exercised intensively and down to the last meter before touching the ground. Yes, this is stress. But this is the way to learn to handle those situations and it gives a lot of important self-confidence.

All instructors I met at FIS at this time have a lot of experience and are CPL /ATPL holders. When I was there about 50% of the students at FIS trained for a commercial career. The chief instructor is a very kind person and experienced pilot.

A great advantage at Jerez is that one gets used to flying in CTRs and controlled airspace. Especially the CTR-experience is very valuable for me. I took around 60 hrs of flying before the final skills test. I´m not sure whether I could have done the skills test a bit earlier. Maybe. However, I never regretted any extra hours. My advice is to rather not set the goal on finishing within the minimum of 45 hrs but to rather take advantage of having access to good training. This is for life and for survival in the worst case.

Aircraft
The aircraft for training (C-172s) were really not the newest but did their job and are IR equipped. I can`t remember having had to wait for an aircraft which would have delayed my schedule. As I was told by the owner he plans to buy two brand new two seat trainig aircraft soon.

Result
I am now proud owner of a British EASA PPL and I think I have had really good training at Fly-in-Spain. I will definately come to FIS once in a while if I am around southern Spain, to refresh emergency skills with an instructor.

If was asked whether I can recommend this flight school:
Yes, I can, because I have had really good flight instructors there.

I am not frequently checking PPRUNE, but if anyone has questions I will try to answer them as directly as possible.

Thank you for the review.
 

Are there many students at Fly in Spain?
How many instructors do they have?

Are the owner from Germany?

Kind regards

How much did it cost you end to end?

Acefly123456,

Number of students:
at the time when I was there (Feb-April 2013) there were 3 other PPL students in continous training. But we were all in different progress in training. I would say half of all (including me) were there for full time training from scratch, the other half took it a bit easier and as far as I know planned to come back another time to continue.
Another one was there for two weeks only to get done as much as possible (theory exams and some flying).

For CPL there were pilots coming and going, also some of them staying for a longer time.

Number of instructors:
I can remember at least 5 instructors, some of them get booked as required.

Owner:
yes, he originally comes from Germany

Emkay,

I took 60 hours in total, alltogether with accomodation I would say I was 13.000 €. Rental car was cheap, around 4 €/day.

By far the highest cost factor is flying itself. Of course, flying less makes a difference to the wallet. But it also makes a difference in flying skills and practice.
I don`t regret the additional hours which I took extra to the 45 h which are mandatory. It`s just so much fun! On my first solos I was screaming loud and grinning from ear to ear because it`s the greatest feeling ever blasting through the sky by yourself! And then flying your calculated course, finding another airfield and just landing there to have a coffee. It`s so cool!

Thank you for the reply downsetgo

And congratulation to your PPL.

It is fair to say that the real star behind FIS, Brian is no longer there having returned back to the UK. He will be a difficult act to follow as his past students will agree, so things are bound to be different going forward.


They have had problems with the Seneca for quite some time. It went off line last December for an engine overall and I am not sure whether it is back yet.

The Seneca is online.

I have been Head of Training for 2 years. Brian was CFI for us until a few weeks ago - I have had to take that role on as well while we find someone suitable to act in the capacity.

His RTF was used for PPL training, our ATO was used for training above that although we have now had to take over the PPL side as well.

None of his approvals are being used in Spain. He still holds training approvals for the UK which remain valid until such time as the forced conversion to ATO occurs then it remains to be seen what happens. However I think he is going to concentrate on RT and Ground stuff these days.

Brian will be much missed in Spain. His vast experience was a real asset to me and will be hard to replace. Fortunately being the gentlemen that he is he still provides help when I need it in the UK.

Punitz are still used for IR training as they do not require a CAA staff Examiner for initial skill test. Everything else is now done by us. It's been a transition that has taken a couple of years.

Well was down here in the Costa so thought I would give Fly in Spain in Jerez a crack, Showed up unannounced and got a plane and instructor with no bollocking about, had a great local flight, seems like a good school with nice folks, only thing that caught me unawares was upon walking up to the aircraft I was to fly I noticed it had a rather unfamiliar accessory , it had a small circular thing connected to what looked liked a enlarged nut cracker with some type of damper connecting the hinge, the whole thing was stuck out from the cowling near the front of the plane, it's primary purpose seemed to be to increase drag and weight and impede it's turning radius on the ground. Anyway it was a beautiful flight and Esther the FI originally from the Uk thankfully did not bollock my many airmanship deficiencies..

Have really been considering this flight school for some time now. Have read quite a few reviews and they seem to be good.


downsetgo, did you complete a night rating as well as part of your course or was it all day flying? Also how was the accommodation and how far is it from the airport?

Yp12,

I have not done a night rating yet. However I am thinking about it. And I will propably go for it at Fly In Spain. Reason is that I know there are really good professional instructors (no resignated hobby instructors as I have experienced in another school).
The only thing to keep in mind is, Jerez Airport closes at 2200 or 2300 local time as far as I remember. So during summer there`s not a lot of time to fly between sunset and airport closing for night flying. Propably better during winter time.

Accomodation:
The owner of the school has 2 apartments he rents out. The apartment I was in the first week has 3 bedrooms, bathroom, kitchen and a living room, completely furnished and Wifi. I met cool people (CPL students and instructors) who also had a room in the apartment. It is not completely in the center of Jerez but also not far away (10-15 minutes walk to bars&clubs). It took me around 12 minutes with the car to get to the airport.

However, after one week or so I moved out and rented a whole flat in the center of Jerez for myself. Nicer location, nicer apartment (for myself), only 50 Euros more per month than the room in the shared apartment. I found the price for this one bedroom in the shared apartment from the school quite expensive in local comparison. On the other side it is uncomplicated and quickly available which is good for people who don`t speak spanish (spanish almost mandatory for finding a good & reasonably priced apartment in Spain) and don`t stay long anyway.

Bose-x is one of the good guys on this forum and he's been here a long time..... I'd certainly trust him and any establishment he worked for.


Never met him, never been to Spain, no agenda, no axe to grind....just an observation,as a regular here.

Vfr night
 

For night VFR, be aware that it is prohibited in Spain. For schools a special permit can be given, it takes about 2 weeks to get from application. When I did my PPL there a bit more than a year ago, they had forgotten that I booked to do the NIght rating so couldn't do it before I was leaving.

The school is perfect to speed things up, something between a club and full blood pro school, but like always, follow things up yourself and the success of course also depends on which instructor you have.

Really? He comes across as argumentative and very judgemental in my opinion. I don't see the relevance of duration of board membership.

I am neither. I am a Yorkshireman however and a spade is a spade.....

Don't expect me to sugarcoat or pussyfoot.

:p

I have flown with Fly In Spain on many occasions in the past. Brian was exactly the kind of professional tempering of occasionally over authoritative German ownership that was required. I am afraid to say that Bose-X will fit in with the German model perfectly and is not a combination that I will be choosing to use again in Southern Spain.

Wow, 3 posts in five years and coming out of the woodwork just to have a go at me. I am flattered.......

Steve. You reap the crop you plant. Years of bullying and aggressive behaviour on the GA forums results in people drawing the conclusion that they probably wouldn't choose to fly with you.

I flew several times from Jerez with Brian and Hans who couldn't have been more welcoming and accommodating. Nobody ever seemed to have a bad word to say about Brian on the forums and indeed you have perpetuated this. That is very reassuring when contemplating stretching yourself to fly outside the UK in a very different environment.

Reputation is everything and yours precedes you which is why I think many long term forumites including some apparent uber-lurkers come out of the shadows to acknowledge they would no longer be comfortable taking the risk at FlyInSpain.

It's their choice. The team are still in place in Spain and doing a great job. You can take or leave me, I won't lose any sleep over it.

Judging someone by an anonymous Internet forum is pretty narrow minded in anyone's book. If you can find someone who has trained or flown with me and can actually back up your assertion I would be a little more interested.

My job in Spain is to ensure that everything is done in accordance with our company approvals and operations manuals. I am satisfied this is done and that's something I am very happy with. I may not be the touchy feely person that Brian was but then this is not my day job so it does not need to be. I would much rather I still had Brian down there but he has moved back to the UK and there is nothing I can do about it.

FIS provide a great service with a good team and good aircraft. All are welcome to come and visit and make there mind up in person.

As they say in Yorkshire - barge pole wouldn't touch it with

I'm utterly astonished by the bitter vitriol being directed against Steve here. I've had the incredible privilege of being trained by him in Jerez, and in the course of my interaction, I have been consistently impressed by the professionalism that he has demonstrated - not just in his management of the organisation (most notably when he chaperoned FIS through its periodical CAA audit in Q4 2013), but also in his ability to instruct and guide his students in a manner that keeps theme performing to the best of their abilities. If there's one takeaway from this thread, let it be this: whilst individuals are entirely entitled to express opinions of their own, let us work to ensure that these opinions are fair, responsible, and founded in material fact; we should resist engaging in an unfounded character assassination on a public forum of this nature. Steve is a competent pilot of the finest order, and above that, an extraordinary gentleman whom I have had the distinct honour of interacting with.

RedKnight

Agreed.

I'm a Yorkshireman too and believe that there should be fair play here.

Perhaps the corespondents who are undermining bose-x may be taking the opportunity to deride his abilities due to a lack of their own?!

That's absolutely right!!:D

Keep the "Angle of Attack" in focus. That's what this forum is all about.:ok:

WP

I’m an A320 pilot with a major european airline and recently renewed my MEP-VFR/IR rating at FIS on their Seneca. My instructor (Harry) had 20,000hrs including 7000 on the A320 and was one of the best instructors I have ever flown with. A lot of experience in the past and great tutoring skills. If you need ME-IR basic or refresher training I would strongly recommend FIS, as long as you can get this guy.

Best regards,

Berlinxpress

Keep Britain great
 

The only problem with training in Spain, is that it takes cash away from the much needed small airfields in our own land.
There maybe a few reasons why some people may want to train in Spain ( that rhymes ) but let's not forget if we want to keep our airfields we must invest in them.

FI rating
 

Hi guys.

Im thinking of doing my FI rating there. Has anyone done this at FIS?

My main reason is the the quick 4 week completion time.

Though its still scary to spend all that money in a foreign land with people I dont know.

Thx

We run FI courses on demand and use a very experienced UK FIE to run the courses. He is the former CFI of Leicester Aero Club and is a vastly experienced Instructor and Examiner.

I find it strange, really strange, that people who fly aeroplanes are so emotional. The cockpit is not a good place for emotion.
I've had some interactions with Bose X. Likeable? Not that I noticed. Professional? Yes, definitely. Reliable? Absolutely. Knowledgable? well, he knows a lot more than me so who am I to judge? Good bloke to spend time with on a night out with the boys? I've got no idea, I have my own mates for that.
I run a small business in a similar environment to aviation businesses that has its' own specialist forums.
I do not court business from those forums because the people who populate those forums are not the kind of customers I like to encourage.
I wonder if Bose feels the same?

I don't court any business from these forums as generally they are populated by Walts and various other people with social disorders. It is also a sad fact that people are judged by what they write which is invariable a slant from the readers own personality.

However I will answer any questions directly if asked. It is up to the individual to decide if they want to train through the organisation.

Like you I have my own friends and social circles and I choose my friends carefully and they are generally not pilots.

Hello,

I have written my review in order to let those who are interested know about my (justified positive) experience at the school.

And to let others who have made personal experience with the school to leave detailed and justified reviews on a factual level.

I have not written a review to offer a platform for insultations and insinuations or topics that are not directly related to the training at the school I went to.

Personal issues can be and should to be treated non-publicly in direct 1-to-1 discussions (like real men do). Please let us show this minimum of respect towards ourselves and towards others.

The author

I agree and for what it's worth, the vitriol (based on web activity) hasn't put me off considering what looks like a good set up. The original post here was very helpful. Thanks for taking the trouble to start the conversation.
Currently looking to do my PPL over the next month or so and FIS look like the best bet (weather, aircraft availability, track record etc). I'd considered US, NZ Western Australia but Spain ticks most of the boxes rather well (for me at least) I hope..
I'll perhaps post how I get along.

Hi GvonSprout,

I´ve also researched a lot in advance before going to Spain. I was close to going to the US for the EASA PPL (there were around two places or so, prices seemed attractive) or to other countries.

In the end Spain was the best choice for me. Independently from the training also because I like Spain, the people, the language, the food and life there.
In Spain I talked to a student who has started training in one of the schools in the US that offer EASA PPL and made rather negative experience there and switched to Spain to finish.

Independently from the country, it really helped me having to fly in the CTR / controlled airspace from the beginning. It even makes me feel more safe.

Thanks to Downsetgo (and to the others) for this review. I'm planning to join Fly-in-Spain soon and begin with a PPL, a distance learning ATPL and some hour building there :)

Bad experience in FIS
 

Sorry guys, but maybe just happened to me and I hope it does not happen any more, I had an engine failure with one of FIS planes and I am very afraid about it happens again. I was performing touch and go and on the runway, when I put full power the propeller stopped. I asked to FIS staff for explanations, but they said it was my fault because I did not leave carburettor heater on. The fact is that my instructor told me to do it and I remember in that moment was on. The owner did not want to speak about, but I was told that it happened just two month ago.

Someone could give an idea?

Hello Maxwingspan,

I was a student there. And have posted the experience I made.

Concerning the condition of the planes, yes they were far away from new when I was there. When I was there they were work horses and have been in use for decades. But this accounts for some other schools as well, where I have rented later in other countries. FIs at F.I.S. have told me that at other schools they worked at, planes were even worse. I personally have never experienced anything special.

I would suggest: if one doesn't get what agreed on, don't pay. The system, that normally some money has to be on the account before going flying makes this a bit more difficult, I can see that. And maybe that's the reason why it's handled this way, don't know. But there must be ways to to talk about these things directly and find agreements.

An engine failure is extremely bad! I cannot say anything about it, simply because I don't know the facts.
What happened exactly? In which phase did it quit? And could it be restarted directly afterwards? Which plane was it? I have not yet experienced how extreme the effect of carburettor icing could be in touch-and-go. So please, let all of us learn from your experience.

But if you feel you were in danger due to a technical malfunction and which could happen to others after you as well, take appropriate action.

Again, I am trying not to advertise for or against the school. All I can do and want to do is bring my own personal experience (which in my case was a positive one) to the keyboard.

An extremely helpful post from 'downsetgo' as I am considering Fly-in-Spain for LAPL.

Here in Germany, I have heard about the lessons getting cancelled because the weather, which makes Jerez a good option if you can spare the block of time. However, I am wondering if this is a good idea to flying in favorable conditions. Most likely, I would be renting an aircraft in Germany later in not so ideal conditions, and there won't be an instructor to guide me through. :confused:

Any thoughts?

Hi indyaachen,

if you're based in Aachen, I'm sure you're aware that there's a very good school in EDKA (Aachen-Merzbrück), Westflug with well maintained aircraft.

They can offer you a wide range of aircraft as well, from Katanas to M20Js. I don't remember his name, but apparently one of the FIs there is quite an institution flying Mooneys.

Don't bother too much about lessons getting cancelled due to weather. Yes, it will happen, however you will get used to the environment/weather/procedures you'll be flying in once you got your ticket.


All the best,
Alex

Yes I know about EDKA. I have been there. However, I was not aware of any Flight Mooney. I am going to an open day there on 2nd Aug and will inquire further.

My preference of FIS, Jerez is partially based on my comfort level with English as opposed to German. In a lot of videos, I have noticed the instructors using common-day expressions to make the student pilot understand the concepts. Not sure yet, how comfortable I'd be with that if it were in German. At least this was the case during the 'Schnupperstunde' .

Thanks AlexUM for inputs anyway. :ok:

Hello Indyaachen,

concerning the weather, I had the same thoughts before making the decision for Spain. But then, in my case, I couldn`t fly some days in Spain due to bad weather. And some days it was at the limits. However, weatherwise this was an exceptionally bad period when I was there, which has happened once in 50 yrs.
Coming back to Germany to fly, I was very cautious concerning weather, thinking that it was going to be different. But things were not as bad as expected. Of course one should analyse weather before.
An idea might be to get an FI in Germany for one or two hours to experience flying in not so perfect weather conditions. Helps to become more confident with weather.

Just a cautionary note to those intending to learn to Fly-in-Spain.

They advertise that you can fly all year round - well, mostly you can, except for the period downsetgo was there :} - but what you should be aware of is that they appear to have a shortage of instructors and that if your instructor is off sick, you will not be doing any flying.

I recommended Fly In Spain to a friend based on forum reports but this friend has spent the past 3 days sitting around doing practically nothing because their instructor is off sick - initially, Fly-in-Spain said my friend would do a minimum of 2 hours flying plus other training per day, but including today and the past 2 days, my friend will have done 1 hour flying. My friend planned 5 weeks to pass the test but even the most adept student will NEVER pass in that time frame with this rate of hours.

Yes, sickness is one thing that can't be avoided but there should be plans in place to ensure that when one instructor is sick, their workload is spread around to ensure ALL students lose out on a little flying, not, as in my friend's case, lose practically all their flying.

Worse is the fact that you pay to fly to Spain, pay for accommodation, pay for transportation and you are still left standing around waiting - well, if you're going to be kept waiting around, why not stay in your own country and just wait for the weather???