Pilot Wrist watches...
 

My girlfriend is going to treat me to a watch for my xmas present :ooh: but tbh i dont know the first thing about watches and could use a little advice!

Basically, i am nearing the Qualifying cross country stage of my PPL training and obviously a watch of some sort is required for navigation and i am currently making do with a girls pink £5 jobbie that is pure crap tbh! I have seen the Citizen Red-arrows range of pilot watches, they look very nice and appear to have a lot of functions on them, i would love to own one however £400~500 is 'in my opinion' bloomin expensive for a watch and i know my gf cannot afford that much on one! My instructor tells me that all these pilot specific watches are a waste of money and all i need is a reliable and accurate watch that literally does not much else but 'Tell the time'! Now i can see where he is coming from but still, they are nice watches and if the features are actually worth the extra, i could always pay some towards it to get one.

What is everyone's opinions on the Pilot specific watches? specially the Citizen skyhawk/Red arrows range? Do you really find yourself using the built in wizz wheel / slide rule whilst in flight? does the watch actually become a very handy piece of kit? Or in reality does everyone who buys these, buy them and never actually used them for anything more than telling the time!!?

Heres a website with the Red-arrows range:
Buy Citizen Red Arrows Watches | Official UK Dealer | First Class Watches

Thanks for the advice!
Ryan

I don't think I'd find a pilot specific watch any more useful than my normal daily watch. I found it much more difficult to fly, navigate, and lift my sleeve to establish the time. That said, my normal daily watch would be accurate if my normal tools fail and can't do the job.

So what do I use I hear you ask?

One of these...

...Attached to one of these...

...Screwed to one of these.

(Disclaimer: All linked to the same website for ease of hyperlinking. I'm not suggesting that this company should or should not be used, nor advertising on their behalf)

Also a simple easy to use and view stopwatch is very useful later if you intend to enter the world of instrument flight (ironically the stopwatch becomes useful when the instruments aren't so useful!).

That's my two penneth :)

GW

For heaven's sake, if you are actually going to use it while flying, make sure it's face and hands are clear and distinct, not cluttered with silly amounts of other symbols and indicators. If you can't quickly discern the necessary information, it's really not much use!

I do like hands on my watch, preferably illuminated ones. Having a stopwatch built in is nice, but not vital.

I use a 16 year old Seiko military - the RAF issue version in other words. Arguably much more than you need to spend, but for a pilot watch quite cheap, and exceptionally practical. II'm likely to keep using this, which I've become very fond of over the years, for many years to come - on which basis I'd recommend it; and yes, you can still buy them.

But ultimately a 20 quid Casio would work just as well.

G

agreed
 

Agree with above post.
My wife bought me an all singing all dancing flight computer watch... So many calculations can be done but only if your sitting in a chair at home!
Big, clear if not dont bother. In fact i dont ever use it for ppl at all!

I got mine in Argos for about £20.

It's a Lorus, has a luminous green face which glows very well in the dark, all the numbers are very clear, as are the minute indentations for accurate time telling. I've met at least 10 other pilots who also wear this watch, as it is so clear and simple. It also gives day and date. I reset it about once a month, and it only drifts seconds from the GPS time in my aircraft.

The watch with the flight computer round the edge may make you feel more like a pilot, and show off to your mates, but in the cockpit keep it simple stupid!

For me, it's a 20+-year old analog watch with no frills whatsoever.

The only "aviation feature" I'd be interested in is some sort of dual time mechanism for UTC. Not necessary, but handy sometimes.

Remember that you are only going to need to do timekeeping for your x-country legs. And on your exam those have a margin of error of +/- 5 minutes. Timed turns, holds and so forth require more accuracy but are not part of the PPL syllabus.

"Aviation" watches from e.g. Citizen and Breitling are not so much "functional" but "lifestyle". As far as function is concerned, your girls pink £5 jobbie will do just fine until well past the PPL level.

Old Pprune thread on a related subject.

of the much loved old RAF issue watch.

But repeating what we've all said, a £20 job from Argos will work fine - but this is a very nice reliable watch fine for flying, and looks okay with a suit as well. Strangely a fraction of the price of most of the watches being sold as "pilot watches" - which by and large no serious pilot would be seen dead wearing.

Incidentally one thing I would not be without is the "Animal" velcro wrist-strap on my watch (about the fifth I think, they usually last about 3 years), which allows me to take the watch off and wrap it around a convenient bit of aircraft structure in front of me - usually the yoke.

G

I own a Citizen skyhawk series, I've had it for 3 years.

The slide rule does come in quite useful during flight, can save scrabbling for the flight computer. After a while the information is easy to find on the face.

It's a nice watch, reliable and doesn't need looking after.

Is it a bit much for PPL? Possibly. The only in flight function I use is the stopwatch, but the good bit is that this runs with the time still visible and UTC visible too, whilst still having the slide rule available.

I'd still choose the same again, but I wouldn't worry about needing all of those functions, at PPL you can happily get away with something that just tells you the time!

4015

Personally, at those prices I'd ask for a £20 watch and a night qualification!

I was very lucky earlier this year when my wife inherited quite a bit of money and decided to treat me to a Breitling Emergency which I've always wanted but could never bring myself to buy!

Normally, my idea of a pilot watch is something cheap, easy to read and very robust but I have to say its nice knowing I have a 121.5mhz transmitter strapped to my wrist if it all goes wrong. Granted its only for homing purposes but since I regularly fly over the Scottish wilderness its potentially a handy thing to have....

I also have a Tissott - T touch with all its wonderful functions but the only one I could see being of use to a pilot is the compass if you find yourself downed and roaming the hills looking for civilisation.

Other than that I've generally been flying with a Citizen divers watch with a rubber strap, thats taken quite a bit of abuse over the years however still looks like new, is very clear to see day or night and runs great.

Regards

UA

If you want historic value, try and find a Cartier as they effectively invented the pilot's watch for Alberto Santos-Dumont.

Just don't trigger it by mistake, otherwise it generates a yellow helicopter option which is available at extra cost. :}

Lorus make a titanium watch with a military cloth strap.

It comes with a white face or a black one. Very clear numbers and hands.

The Lorus mechanism is made by Seiko.

Costs around £30-35.

No need to spend more unless you want to impress people down the pub.

As people have said, a stopwatch on your clipboard or on the aircraft yoke is probably more useful than a watch.

Considering that triggering it requires unscrewing the end caps and pulling out the +/- 70 cm antenna wires (1/4 wavelength of 121.5 MHz) to create the dipole, I don't think "triggering by mistake" is a risk factor here. (Although "triggering while drunk" or "triggering by drunk friend" could be an issue.)

The bigger issue is that the rescue services/satellites are not routinely monitoring 121.5 anymore. So you're at the mercy of an accidently passing over airliner which happens to have 121.5 standby. And they typically don't have homing equipment.

You'd need the 406 MHz Breitling (which doesn't exist, AFAIK) if you want a true PLB.

Personally if something goes bang the first thing I will be doing is putting out a Mayday to whichever service I'm speaking to giving my rough position, that will be enough to instagate a rescue. Any SAR chopper dispatched will be able to home into a signal on 121.5mhz no problem at all which is all I'm worried about.

After far too many years having to push my sleeve up to read my wrist watch - it takes both hands - my brother bought me a cheapo modern pocket watch.

Now simply mounted on the front of the panel, one can read off & jot down the time for the essential map & knee pad "nav aid" as needed.

mike hallam.

Next time you're in a rental aircraft, take a good look around the panel.

Most panels include a regular analog clock (not always set to the proper time though), but also various avionics are able to tell you the time or act as a stopwatch. For a GPS it's obvious but a reasonably modern digital transponder will also include a flight timer. And I remember having seen some sort of clock/timer function on an ADF too.

True, although as somebody who (a) often wants to know the time,and (b) flies multiple aeroplanes - I like having a timepiece that I'm always familiar with at a glance.

G

I have a 'Rotary' watch, I cant see what its name is as the writing is too small. It was about £100 (though reduced) from £200 in last years xmas sale. It has a rotating dial, and a stop watch. However, the most useful and exciting thing about it is that it has a picture of some wings, and as a pilot, thats all I want :).

I dont use a whizz wheel for flight planning on the ground. There are electronic pilot calculators which are much more friendly, or pieces of software or websites that will help with most basic flight planning calculations. I cant ever imagine myself trying to squint at a tiny watch and attempt to perform some whizz wheel calculation, and fly the plane at the same time. The watch is only good for time functions (brakes off, brakes on and ETA calculations). A stopwatch is very useful for diversions, holds, procedural approaches (if and when you do IMC training), however I prefer something simple to operate, with relatively large numbers. To that end we have a small basic timer / stopwatch mounted on the yoke, or I use the timer function on our Garmin digital transponder. Timers on watches are too fiddly.

IMO, a pilot watch with lots of functions, is just something that is used aesthetically.

I would recommend a good quality analouge watch, possibly with a separate hand for UTC. Any more functionality, and I see it as a distraction.

When I did my IMCr I started off using a stopwatch, but after a while I found it easier to use my analouge watch and not pressing any buttons at all.

I own a Citizen Skyhawk. I have had it for many years and am very pleased with it. It is clear, the s/w works well and the power indicator removes the risk of it stopping unexpectedly.

Get the titanium version of you will need to do a new W & B just for the watch.

Rod1

A watch with a Tachymeter can be very useful. Many moons ago, when flying Shacks from Ice Station Kilo, when we came 'off task' over northern waters, I would use the Tachymeter to measure groundspeed, using the Saxa Vord Tacan. I would then calculate ETA ISK and tell it to the crew. It was always very accurate, much to the consternation of our two, very senior, Navigators.

One night in the bar, post-flight, they asked me how I did it. When I showed them my watch and explained, they both roared with laughter and bought me a pint - each.

I've had a Citizen Eco-drive Skyhawk since my wife got it for me for Christmas about 8 or 9 years ago and still love it.

The multi city function and ease of changing from one to another or to GMT is great as is the GMT hand.

Have never used the whizz-wheel and it's so long since my PPL I have forgotten how to (anyway it's seized up). The phot-cell charging means I've never had to buy a battery and it keeps time to about 10 secs a year.

Only downside is changing all the cities times twice a year depending whether or not they observe daylight saving.

Would buy the same again ... and by trawling the internet, got it about £100 cheaper than the high street.

I've been flying for my living since 1977. During my military career we were required to put troops on the ground at a grid reference within fifteen seconds of a given time. I've never once found the need for a watch with anything other than one big hand, one small hand and a second hand.

The date is useful once a day when filling out the tech log for the first time but these days I can get that off my mobile phone.

I now fly using a basic and simple Citzen Eco-drive titanium watch (never needs a new battery), but not the aviation one.

I was given a brand new Breitling Navigator some years ago (then worth about £1200?) but I found the claws on the rotating bezel snagged on my jumper cuff and pulled threads, so I never use it when flying.

I would agree with those above who say that if you need a stopwatch for the type of flying you do, buy a simple, straightforward but separate stop watch. Digital or analogue, whatever you prefer, but make sure it's simple and reliable to operate because the one thing that ruins your split second timing is pressing the control knob then after an unknown number of seconds finding it didn't actually start timing.

Most "pilot watches" are a total waste of time.

Most are not usable because they have a 60-minute stopwatch minute dial, which is too fine to read easily. One needs a 30-minute dial.

And one does not need to do timing in what I call normal flying. It is only on flight tests (flying NDB holds etc) that a stopwatch is required. For that I have used a cheap yellow plastic thing, about 3" in diameter with big buttons, which hangs around my neck. The rest of the time one uses radio navigation (GPS usually) which gives you a continuous track guidance, with distance to the next waypoint, so timing is not required. I never time anything during any flights I do myself.

I have used a wrist watch stopwatch, in my US IR, and it was more trouble than it was worth because it was too fiddly. That was actually a nice watch - a Seiko "pilot watch", like the one currently sold by Transair. It packed up (as those Seiko pilot watches tend to do, apparently) and was fixed under warranty. I got rid of it in the end because the fabric straps lasted poorly and cost a packet.

170a ?:O:O:O:O:O

I am surprised that training aircraft do not have a built in, clear and easy to use stopwatch/clock (ideally with a moveable bug) alongside the other basic flying instruments as standard. Accurate timekeeping was part of my navigation training I seem to remember, which is a rather major part in learning to fly!

But for my PPL, I bought a simple £35 Casio digital watch with stopwatch function, as I found my analogue watch had a cluttered dial and was not easy to read in flight.

I have a nice Seiko pilot's watch (with the whizz-wheel bezel), which I've had for nearly twenty years. Never missed a beat and still water tight. I have it serviced in the Jewellery Quarter in Birmingham. £6 for a battery and new seal!

I bought a Timex at the local Sears when my instructor insisted (he wouldn't let me go solo without a watch on my wrist). 9 years on it's still doing its job and I'm quite happy that I got the combined digital/analogue face as I can have the hands on local time while the digital readout stays on UTC.

(looks a lot like this one)

How about a cook's timer??
 

What about this then??

Does the job perfectly, but does nothing for your street cred with your mates down at the pub!!

2 watches; one glued to my clipboard (UTC) the other on my wrist (local). Both analogue, dark face white hands, sweeping secondhand, quartz.

Anything else clutters the face and my brain.

Both £12 from Argos.

Spend your squeeze's money on a decent ANR headset, not watches/epaulettes/ray-bans/leather flight bags. The former will allow you to hear her nag, the latter is a free pass into the the tosser camp.

Any make you like and the price you can afford, so long as it's big. Saves having to buy epaulettes, and assures people you meet in bars that you are the real deal :E

One of for flying and one of for when your telling people about being a pilot :ok:

Disagree on both counts.

The first lacks hands, and if I had the money for the second I'd buy myself another aeroplane (or treat myself to a ME/IR and then go on holiday with the change!).

G

I agree Casio F-91W is the best, if only the straps would outlast the batteries. They have been declared iconic according to the Sunday Times a week or two back. As standard they are: waterproof, accurate, 12/24 hour format, day and date, stop watch, alarm, all for less than a tenner. Fab - u - lous.

Don't worry Genghis, I'd find it hard to spend a 10th of that on a watch. What's the facination with hands?

Aesthetic preference I suppose - at heart I'm a bit old fashioned.

G

Casio G-Shock for me. Solar powered, radio time signal updating, light, comfy strap, UTC & local at the same time, lots of colours & styles (I think all-black is best), bright long-lasting phosphor on big hands as well as digital displays, wear it in the shower, survives a drop that you wouldn't.

Oh, and I don't think there are any fake ones!

Sorry Barcli... failed the 170A while going like a one armed bandit keeping the plane straight in turbulence, on NDB holds and inbounds. The examiner took no hostages, too. I've decided to drop it now and maybe have another go in 2013 or 2014. See what develops. The exams are good for 2 years. Spain suddenly looks attractive - should have followed everybody's bl00dy advice and gone down to FIS for a week :)

Silvaire - apart from maybe 2 countries in the world, all ATIS is GMT, and all altimeter settings are in mb / hPa. You justy live in an out of touch backwater that is slowly catching up.

G