What is it with Flying Schools
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Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Bristol, UK
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What is it with Flying Schools
they seem to have less commerical awareness than Mr Magoo !
Picture the scene, it's Saturday, the weather is fantastic, better in fact, than free beer at the world Page 3 bikini mud-wrestling competition.
Ring, ring, "Hi, it's X flying school here, I know you haven't flown since the 1st July what with the airfield being shut for 2 weekend's in a row and us bogging off on holiday (as well as the time you took the afternoon off work, drove for an hour and we'd gone home) etc etc. Bad news, the kite won't start.
Oh, haven't you got another?
Err, well, no, we've hired the other one out for a weeks Camel herding in Katmandu and the Jurrasic era 172 is on another lesson where a spotty youf is trying to ding the prop.
Well, can you fix it in time my lesson, please, pretty please, desperate avaition mad indvidual who just wants his flying fix.
Err, tell you what, we'll give it a go. Thing is, we haven't run it for a couple of days and left it parked out in a monsoon, so it could be a bit on the damp side !"
Ring ring, "Hi, nope it's shafted, sorry, see you next weekend then"
AAAaaaarrrggghhhhhhhh, followed by expletives .
Now I'm in a quandry, I've nearly finished my soddin PPL and don't really want the hassle of going to another club, they've got some of my money and my instructor is bloody good (as well as being rather fanciable), so what do I do?
Why can't clubs be a bit more savvy, I mean we pay through the nose, they seem to think that Joe PPL will just part with his (or her) money and take whatever crap customer service and moth-eaten old Piper that comes his or her way.
That's better, I've got it off my chest now!
Picture the scene, it's Saturday, the weather is fantastic, better in fact, than free beer at the world Page 3 bikini mud-wrestling competition.
Ring, ring, "Hi, it's X flying school here, I know you haven't flown since the 1st July what with the airfield being shut for 2 weekend's in a row and us bogging off on holiday (as well as the time you took the afternoon off work, drove for an hour and we'd gone home) etc etc. Bad news, the kite won't start.
Oh, haven't you got another?
Err, well, no, we've hired the other one out for a weeks Camel herding in Katmandu and the Jurrasic era 172 is on another lesson where a spotty youf is trying to ding the prop.
Well, can you fix it in time my lesson, please, pretty please, desperate avaition mad indvidual who just wants his flying fix.
Err, tell you what, we'll give it a go. Thing is, we haven't run it for a couple of days and left it parked out in a monsoon, so it could be a bit on the damp side !"
Ring ring, "Hi, nope it's shafted, sorry, see you next weekend then"
AAAaaaarrrggghhhhhhhh, followed by expletives .
Now I'm in a quandry, I've nearly finished my soddin PPL and don't really want the hassle of going to another club, they've got some of my money and my instructor is bloody good (as well as being rather fanciable), so what do I do?
Why can't clubs be a bit more savvy, I mean we pay through the nose, they seem to think that Joe PPL will just part with his (or her) money and take whatever crap customer service and moth-eaten old Piper that comes his or her way.
That's better, I've got it off my chest now!
Join Date: Aug 2000
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very familiar indeed..
You just wanna
Imagine the truly helpful attitude of my flying club when I told them I wanted to finnish my PPL this summer. The words sacrés imbécile come to mind, they keep mucking up my flight times!!
<breathe> gotta stay calm, GOTTA STAY CALM!
wot d'ya mean I can't fly today?!?!
Imagine the truly helpful attitude of my flying club when I told them I wanted to finnish my PPL this summer. The words sacrés imbécile come to mind, they keep mucking up my flight times!!
<breathe> gotta stay calm, GOTTA STAY CALM!
wot d'ya mean I can't fly today?!?!
Join Date: Sep 2002
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they've got some of my money
we pay through the nose
don't really want the hassle of going to another club
they seem to think that Joe PPL will just part with his (or her) money and take whatever crap customer service and moth-eaten old Piper that comes his or her way
Join Date: Aug 2001
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Go to the US. Do an intensive JAA course. Come back again. You'll find that the money and time saved is more than enough to get you checked out, and up and about in the local club PA28s, should you ever decide to darken their door again.
It would be nice to support local clubs, but there are far too many that are the way you describe. Hard-nosed it may be, but they deserve to go out of business, and you shouldn't waste your money delaying the day that happens.
Charlie.
It would be nice to support local clubs, but there are far too many that are the way you describe. Hard-nosed it may be, but they deserve to go out of business, and you shouldn't waste your money delaying the day that happens.
Charlie.
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You are absolutely right to ask "What is it with flying clubs?"
The majority are so poorly run and leave you with the impression that the student or aircraft renter is there for the school's benefit.
Rarely does anyone assume responsibility.
Usual gripes:
Aircraft u/s, late returning, or even just absent (lent to another club yesterday?)
Communication is the key here - Ops need to have finger on the pulse and talk to people.
Once the restriction on my FI rating is removed I'm gonna start a school that cares
It would make great business sense.
The majority are so poorly run and leave you with the impression that the student or aircraft renter is there for the school's benefit.
Rarely does anyone assume responsibility.
Usual gripes:
Aircraft u/s, late returning, or even just absent (lent to another club yesterday?)
Communication is the key here - Ops need to have finger on the pulse and talk to people.
Once the restriction on my FI rating is removed I'm gonna start a school that cares
It would make great business sense.
PPruNaholic!
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Not all clubs are like this, there are plenty of good ones. I can personally recommend BAFC at Wycombe, and I understand Wycombe Air Centre are also good.
The difference may be that here in the London / Home Counties area there is much more supply AND demand, so easier for these business to be run in a decent manner, with more predictable turnove, hence more aicraft and instructors and better maintenance etc.
I'm sure its not a universal rule, but might help explain your problems in Bristol?
Just a guess.... wouldbe interested in what others think?
Andy
The difference may be that here in the London / Home Counties area there is much more supply AND demand, so easier for these business to be run in a decent manner, with more predictable turnove, hence more aicraft and instructors and better maintenance etc.
I'm sure its not a universal rule, but might help explain your problems in Bristol?
Just a guess.... wouldbe interested in what others think?
Andy
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VFR800
Buy your own plane (the absolute very best thing), or if you can't afford it try to form a group with a few other keen pilots, and buy a plane between yourselves.
It's the ONLY way if you want to do any real flying. Nearly all the people who are limited to self fly hire pack it in not long after getting their PPL.
You are right, most schools are run by people who could not run a p****p in a brewery, but there are deeper problems in this game which ensure that even a well run business would not make money in the majority of locations.
Buy your own plane (the absolute very best thing), or if you can't afford it try to form a group with a few other keen pilots, and buy a plane between yourselves.
It's the ONLY way if you want to do any real flying. Nearly all the people who are limited to self fly hire pack it in not long after getting their PPL.
You are right, most schools are run by people who could not run a p****p in a brewery, but there are deeper problems in this game which ensure that even a well run business would not make money in the majority of locations.
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Good idea slider, There are a few good schools out there, but most of them are that way due to the staff NOT the management. Most of the schools I've taught at seem to balance on the edge of a precipice at all times. No forward planning example: every time an a/c needs a 50 hourly everyone panics as it's only been noticed on Friday afternoon so the engineers get a rush job and then moaned at if it doesn't come back on time!
The stuff that most schools should try to do are just the basics. Don't muck students around, keep the a/c servicable(not as easy as it sounds sometimes), say hello when people come through the door, sweep/hoover the floor ocassionally, make people a cup of tea etc. etc......I often think that most schools make money despite their best efforts. Nothing like keeping the customers (and staff) happy, and mostly it's nothing like keeping the customers happy!
A bit of a brush to tar flying schools with and there are some noticable exceptions.
The stuff that most schools should try to do are just the basics. Don't muck students around, keep the a/c servicable(not as easy as it sounds sometimes), say hello when people come through the door, sweep/hoover the floor ocassionally, make people a cup of tea etc. etc......I often think that most schools make money despite their best efforts. Nothing like keeping the customers (and staff) happy, and mostly it's nothing like keeping the customers happy!
A bit of a brush to tar flying schools with and there are some noticable exceptions.
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Aircraft late back...
Question for renters: If you are 'given' an aircraft late, do you try to return it according to the original schedule, or take your time booked (and hence return 'late') ?
Question for renters: If you are 'given' an aircraft late, do you try to return it according to the original schedule, or take your time booked (and hence return 'late') ?
Join Date: Dec 2002
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VFR,
Jump in the car and go to Glos. Its the only viable training field for the Bristol area. I never had one lesson cancel due to aircraft problems during my whole PPL. Speak to Phil at Cotswold Aero Club - All clubs are not the same!
Kingy
Jump in the car and go to Glos. Its the only viable training field for the Bristol area. I never had one lesson cancel due to aircraft problems during my whole PPL. Speak to Phil at Cotswold Aero Club - All clubs are not the same!
Kingy
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VFR800
Most clubs are run so un-commercially as they are run by people who have romantic ideas of making a living out of aviation!
Anyone with a modicum of business nouse realises that there is no money to be made out of the sort of GA we are talking about on this forum.
Hence the reality that most schools/clubs are run by well intending people with a FI ticket, usually starting out with a vast injection of private funds.
As in most walks of life having the ticket and some dosh does not necessarily equip you to be a sleek entrepreneur or good manager.
Similar lack of success can be observed in a wide variety of other businesses ranging from the building trade to the NHS.
FD
Most clubs are run so un-commercially as they are run by people who have romantic ideas of making a living out of aviation!
Anyone with a modicum of business nouse realises that there is no money to be made out of the sort of GA we are talking about on this forum.
Hence the reality that most schools/clubs are run by well intending people with a FI ticket, usually starting out with a vast injection of private funds.
As in most walks of life having the ticket and some dosh does not necessarily equip you to be a sleek entrepreneur or good manager.
Similar lack of success can be observed in a wide variety of other businesses ranging from the building trade to the NHS.
FD
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Errm, not sure I see what the problem is. The plane won't start and the others are out on hire. That is what happens from time to time!
As you said the instructor is cool so stay with it and let the inevitible glitches with 40 year old technology and 30 year old construction wash over you
As you said the instructor is cool so stay with it and let the inevitible glitches with 40 year old technology and 30 year old construction wash over you
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This isn't an advert, but I must back up Aussie Andy, BAFC is a very well run club. There are always planes available, the instructors are great, the staff are friendly and knowledgable and if an instructor is ill, they get another one in! (plus the clubhouse is hoovered every day - I've seen it!)
Plus it's the only way I am going to ever captain a plane with chatham historic dockyard on the tail!
Steve
Plus it's the only way I am going to ever captain a plane with chatham historic dockyard on the tail!
Steve
