My RT is terrible...!
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 1,294
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From: UK
I'm fluent in R/T being an ATCO (umm yes of course he he he)
and I still write everything down.
We are intimidating as we speak so quickly but trust me you want us to say it more slowly we can do.
Lots of good advice here , as everyone says practice practice practice, its how we learnt as ATCOs and yes we found it equally intimidating when we started.
Keep It Simple Stupid is the best way to do things , we do not need to know everything about your flight if we want more info we will ask for it , but position , height and flight conditions are very important to us.
Have you spoken of your concerns to your flight instructor they may be able to put you in touch with a local ATCO willing to help out with your R/T as some of us have been known to do.
Otherwise I would just say relax and anticipate the response you will get to your transmission.
and I still write everything down.
We are intimidating as we speak so quickly but trust me you want us to say it more slowly we can do.
Lots of good advice here , as everyone says practice practice practice, its how we learnt as ATCOs and yes we found it equally intimidating when we started.
Keep It Simple Stupid is the best way to do things , we do not need to know everything about your flight if we want more info we will ask for it , but position , height and flight conditions are very important to us.
Have you spoken of your concerns to your flight instructor they may be able to put you in touch with a local ATCO willing to help out with your R/T as some of us have been known to do.
Otherwise I would just say relax and anticipate the response you will get to your transmission.
Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 19
Likes: 0
From: on the river
Don't worry if your frined hasn't an RT licence. Just do the RT yourself and let them take control.
Simple!
2nd thoughts - don't try that at home kids!!
As an ATCO though, please just get yourself ready before you hit the switch - and of course listen out for a few seconds before you make your call - nowt worse than jumping in half way through a reply.
Write down the read-back-able items - on a knee pad preferably. NOT on the canopy in chinograph like someone did before me during my 15 (scarey) hours at CWL!
enjoy
Simple!
2nd thoughts - don't try that at home kids!!
As an ATCO though, please just get yourself ready before you hit the switch - and of course listen out for a few seconds before you make your call - nowt worse than jumping in half way through a reply.
Write down the read-back-able items - on a knee pad preferably. NOT on the canopy in chinograph like someone did before me during my 15 (scarey) hours at CWL!
enjoy
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 39
Likes: 0
From: South of England
Mr B is also a controller and although in some ways I found his advice invaluable whilst training, in other ways it over-complicated things a little. I ended up confusing myself by having too much information from three different sources (controller + instructor + groundschool lecturer). In the end, the groundschool lecturer's advice along with the CAA handbook got me through the r/t oral exam, my instructor's advice got me through the skills test, and then Mr B's advice came in handy once I was through the training and ready to take on the world!
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 8
Likes: 0
From: London
I read one of those dubious "scientists have found" statements somewhere (I think it was Nigel Everett's excellent Beyond PPL book but not sure) that the stress level for an average PPL student prior to making a radio call was higher than combat pilots going into battle.
I remember my instructor saying three things which might help here. First, the ATC people are there to help you, you are their reason for having a job. Second, you may annoy them intensely but to give a decent service to other aircraft, they need you to give them information. So you can give your position reports any way you like and take as much time as you need. And you can say "say again" as many times as you like. They might get annoyed but so what? The other thing is that, in many situations, if you don't like them you are perfectly entitled to cancel their service and switch them off.
Now I'm not saying you shouldn't strive to get the calls right first time, both in terms of personal satisfaction and general safety. And the ATC people do a great job and are worth being nice to and even a FIS is worth having. But your RT stress levels will be lower if you remember they are there for you and you are in control. And if you make a rubbish RT call, laugh about it.
I remember my instructor saying three things which might help here. First, the ATC people are there to help you, you are their reason for having a job. Second, you may annoy them intensely but to give a decent service to other aircraft, they need you to give them information. So you can give your position reports any way you like and take as much time as you need. And you can say "say again" as many times as you like. They might get annoyed but so what? The other thing is that, in many situations, if you don't like them you are perfectly entitled to cancel their service and switch them off.
Now I'm not saying you shouldn't strive to get the calls right first time, both in terms of personal satisfaction and general safety. And the ATC people do a great job and are worth being nice to and even a FIS is worth having. But your RT stress levels will be lower if you remember they are there for you and you are in control. And if you make a rubbish RT call, laugh about it.
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 146
Likes: 0
From: England
1) Try playing pilots in the car on the way to work, bloke next to you at the lights may think your off your rocker , so what practice makes perfect.
2) Get an airband receiver listen in to the pros
3) Work out in advance what you want to say and what your likely to get in reply, its dead satisfying when bloke on the ground says exactly what you expected.
4) Two invalulable r/t phrases:
Stand by - means I have no idea what to say or where I am, hang on a mo whilst I work it out .and
Say again - means what the f**k did he say
5) Try to sound confident remember bull!!!!! baffles brains, if you sound like your day job is driving jumbos you'll get better service from atc than if you sound like Frank Spencer.
Finally remember its for fun whilst flight safety is a serious business if like me you do it as a hobby relax and enjoy.
2) Get an airband receiver listen in to the pros
3) Work out in advance what you want to say and what your likely to get in reply, its dead satisfying when bloke on the ground says exactly what you expected.
4) Two invalulable r/t phrases:
Stand by - means I have no idea what to say or where I am, hang on a mo whilst I work it out .and
Say again - means what the f**k did he say
5) Try to sound confident remember bull!!!!! baffles brains, if you sound like your day job is driving jumbos you'll get better service from atc than if you sound like Frank Spencer.
Finally remember its for fun whilst flight safety is a serious business if like me you do it as a hobby relax and enjoy.
The Original Whirly
Joined: Feb 1999
Aviation Qualifications: CPL
Posts: 4,327
Likes: 2
From: Belper, Derbyshire, UK
As has been said, you're perfectly normal, but it does get easier. I was terrified of the radio. When I was a solo student I came back after flying one day, and an instructor said to me: "I heard you umming and ahing on the radio, and I said to my student: "That's an example of how NOT to talk on the radio!"
Well, apart from being tactless, he was WRONG. There is no right or wrong way to talk on the radio. If you're nervous, you're nervous. The ATCOs are there to help you, not the other way round. All the advice about writing things down is good, but you don't have to do it that way. As a helicopter pilot I can't; I don't have enough hands,
Until very recently, I found there was no way I could remember a clearance and a squawk and probably something else too. I just repeated back what I could, and asked them to "say again" the rest. No-one ever seemed to mind, and if they did, tough.
Using the radio is about communication. If you're getting your point across, that's good enough. If you forget something, they can ask you. So try not to worry, and if that's impossible, try not to worry about the fact you're worried!
Well, apart from being tactless, he was WRONG. There is no right or wrong way to talk on the radio. If you're nervous, you're nervous. The ATCOs are there to help you, not the other way round. All the advice about writing things down is good, but you don't have to do it that way. As a helicopter pilot I can't; I don't have enough hands,
Until very recently, I found there was no way I could remember a clearance and a squawk and probably something else too. I just repeated back what I could, and asked them to "say again" the rest. No-one ever seemed to mind, and if they did, tough. Using the radio is about communication. If you're getting your point across, that's good enough. If you forget something, they can ask you. So try not to worry, and if that's impossible, try not to worry about the fact you're worried!
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 504
Likes: 0
From: South Yorkshire
Take courage - it is just a phase you are going through. I found the R/T difficult to cope with - the thought of the R/T practical test still brings me out in a cold sweat!
At the level you are at, you are still practising making standard calls. This is perfectly reasonable. There is nothing that says you MUST be confident making these calls before you can go off on your QXC. I suppose the point is that you should know what you are supposed to say at this point in your training; the QXC is just another opportunity to practise saying it, while also flying and navigating at the same time.
Only other bit of (facetious) advice I can offer is do your QCX on 23rd December like I did. Flying around Lincolnshire I should have been doing MATZ Penetrations all over the place, but on 23rd Dec, the RAF had all gone home for Christmas and Lincolnshire was shut!
At the level you are at, you are still practising making standard calls. This is perfectly reasonable. There is nothing that says you MUST be confident making these calls before you can go off on your QXC. I suppose the point is that you should know what you are supposed to say at this point in your training; the QXC is just another opportunity to practise saying it, while also flying and navigating at the same time.
Only other bit of (facetious) advice I can offer is do your QCX on 23rd December like I did. Flying around Lincolnshire I should have been doing MATZ Penetrations all over the place, but on 23rd Dec, the RAF had all gone home for Christmas and Lincolnshire was shut!
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 236
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From: Nottingham,UK
I deliberately chose East Midlands to do my training because I knew that I would be intimidated by R/T - I'm a masochist! 
I don't even like telephones. I do a reasonable impression of sounding relaxed and confident on the radio, but I'm like a rabbit caught in headlights if I have to readback any kind of instruction that's longer than say five words. My brain just doesn't want to retain more than a few words at a time. I'm just glad that I made the effort to learn my phonetic alphabet before I started. I'm also glad that I have plenty of experience of making a complete arse of myself - so sounding like the clueless idiot that I am with lots of people listening isn't really all that bad. The biggest confidence booster for me is hearing other people who are worse at R/T than me - some of the airline pilots you hear aren't all that great, so there's hope for me yet.
I don't even like telephones. I do a reasonable impression of sounding relaxed and confident on the radio, but I'm like a rabbit caught in headlights if I have to readback any kind of instruction that's longer than say five words. My brain just doesn't want to retain more than a few words at a time. I'm just glad that I made the effort to learn my phonetic alphabet before I started. I'm also glad that I have plenty of experience of making a complete arse of myself - so sounding like the clueless idiot that I am with lots of people listening isn't really all that bad. The biggest confidence booster for me is hearing other people who are worse at R/T than me - some of the airline pilots you hear aren't all that great, so there's hope for me yet.
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 856
Likes: 0
From: I sell sea shells by the sea shore
Lots of very good advice here and as one of those "mystical" Controller Chaps (and sometime PPL) here's my 2p worth...
We are ALL Human... honest! Can I suggest you arrange a visit to your local (or even not-so-local) ATC unit. You'll find they're all normal people and more than happy to explain what they do and how they do it. They'll also give you some first rate advice, and hopefully this will help your confidence.
All you need to do is give them a phone call and explain who you are and why you'd like to visit.
Good luck
Rgds BEX
We are ALL Human... honest! Can I suggest you arrange a visit to your local (or even not-so-local) ATC unit. You'll find they're all normal people and more than happy to explain what they do and how they do it. They'll also give you some first rate advice, and hopefully this will help your confidence.
All you need to do is give them a phone call and explain who you are and why you'd like to visit.
Good luck
Rgds BEX
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 589
Likes: 0
From: UK
As an ATCO, I'm said this many times in various threads before.
1. Don't wait until you're in the aeroplane to practice your RT. I hear people everyday, wasting their money by using all their powers of concentration simply by trying to talk to me in a slightly technical language.
2. Learn the meanings of the standard words and phrases thoroughly and commit them to memory. Personally, I think the Manual of Air Traffic Services CAP493, which you can find on the CAA website has the most concise list.
3. Learn the list of items which require a MANDATORY readback.
4. Visit your local Tower. Put faces to the voices and see the 'mechanics' of what we do with the information that you give us.
5. Think before you open the mike. Not just about what you're going to say, but also about what you might hear back.
6. Relax! We're human too and we also make mistakes. Furthermore, we'll know if your a student or a stumbly PPL and most ATCO's will be gentle with you.
7. If in doubt, shout. I'd rather hear 'Say again' half a dozen times and know that you've got the right info. If you read something back incorrectly, it's our job to give it to you again...(and again and again, until you've got it right)
8. Remember, it's an Air Traffic SERVICE, of which you are the customer...don't be frightened to use it...your landing fees pay our wages! (This is probably the only industry, however, where the customer is NOT always right!!
)
Email me if you'd like any further help, I'll be happy to oblige
1. Don't wait until you're in the aeroplane to practice your RT. I hear people everyday, wasting their money by using all their powers of concentration simply by trying to talk to me in a slightly technical language.
2. Learn the meanings of the standard words and phrases thoroughly and commit them to memory. Personally, I think the Manual of Air Traffic Services CAP493, which you can find on the CAA website has the most concise list.
3. Learn the list of items which require a MANDATORY readback.
4. Visit your local Tower. Put faces to the voices and see the 'mechanics' of what we do with the information that you give us.
5. Think before you open the mike. Not just about what you're going to say, but also about what you might hear back.
6. Relax! We're human too and we also make mistakes. Furthermore, we'll know if your a student or a stumbly PPL and most ATCO's will be gentle with you.
7. If in doubt, shout. I'd rather hear 'Say again' half a dozen times and know that you've got the right info. If you read something back incorrectly, it's our job to give it to you again...(and again and again, until you've got it right)
8. Remember, it's an Air Traffic SERVICE, of which you are the customer...don't be frightened to use it...your landing fees pay our wages! (This is probably the only industry, however, where the customer is NOT always right!!
)Email me if you'd like any further help, I'll be happy to oblige
Rainbow Chaser
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 608
Likes: 0
From: At home, mostly!
I would strongly recommend an airband radio - for (a) listening to the big-guys and practice beating them to the readback and (b) listening to those at "your" airfield and elsewhere.
Quite apart from liking to listen (OMG am I admitting this in public?) I found that my "sad bas*ard" radio was an invaluable tool in getting it right(er) when it came to my own RT.
At the time I was doing my PPL I was working as a negotiator of fairly complex contracts in banking - most of my role was on the telephone so the exchange of information/key data over a telephone was commonplace for me. A bonus as the transition to radio was, essentially, no biggie. I was, however, learning at an airfield which is only a radio service and at the time the owner of the airfield who ran the radio had his own wonderfully idiosyncratic way of working [RIP Chris Freeman] so this meant that when I came to speak with Thames Radar for the first time my heart was in my mouth. I have to say that having spent some time with my sad bas*ard radio, having listened out on frequency before making my call on the day, having my checklist for the call pre-printed and ready to rock-n-roll I had eliminated most of the uncertainty - all that was left was me broadcasting to the airwaves. My first call was clipped, efficient, seemingly spot-on (judging by the instructors reaction and the ATC response) and what I heard from ATC was what I expected (having listened out) BUT ..hehehe... having been so relieved at the exchange being so normal I totally forgot to reset QNH hehehehe
Key is practice. Understand what it is that ATC will expect of you, have your data ready at all times ... being in the air is a fabulous privilege and you are surrounded by an infrastructure designed to keep you safe but you have to play your part. The reality is that everyone involved in aviation wants it to be a successful "event" and are all there to help make it so!
Happy landings!
Quite apart from liking to listen (OMG am I admitting this in public?) I found that my "sad bas*ard" radio was an invaluable tool in getting it right(er) when it came to my own RT.
At the time I was doing my PPL I was working as a negotiator of fairly complex contracts in banking - most of my role was on the telephone so the exchange of information/key data over a telephone was commonplace for me. A bonus as the transition to radio was, essentially, no biggie. I was, however, learning at an airfield which is only a radio service and at the time the owner of the airfield who ran the radio had his own wonderfully idiosyncratic way of working [RIP Chris Freeman] so this meant that when I came to speak with Thames Radar for the first time my heart was in my mouth. I have to say that having spent some time with my sad bas*ard radio, having listened out on frequency before making my call on the day, having my checklist for the call pre-printed and ready to rock-n-roll I had eliminated most of the uncertainty - all that was left was me broadcasting to the airwaves. My first call was clipped, efficient, seemingly spot-on (judging by the instructors reaction and the ATC response) and what I heard from ATC was what I expected (having listened out) BUT ..hehehe... having been so relieved at the exchange being so normal I totally forgot to reset QNH hehehehe
Key is practice. Understand what it is that ATC will expect of you, have your data ready at all times ... being in the air is a fabulous privilege and you are surrounded by an infrastructure designed to keep you safe but you have to play your part. The reality is that everyone involved in aviation wants it to be a successful "event" and are all there to help make it so!
Happy landings!
Guest
Posts: n/a
MonkeySlave,
I feel for you - my R/T was without the WORST aspect of my flying - and I dreaded using the radio. You are not alone!
Lots of good advice already - here's my 2p
I did a course of R/T ground school given by a professional ATCO, to both prepare for the R/T test and to improve my R/T. Best investment I made - equivalent to an hour's flying.
I also did with what many others suggest - practice wherever you can - in your car, on the train (you don't have to say it out loud!).
Another thing I do is to look at my half mil chart some evenings and plot a flight, thinking through what I would say to whom - request for FIS, MATZ pen, zone transit, whatever.
A tip for when you are in the air - think about where you are when you want to talk to someone. Even consider orbiting a landmark (but don't lose sight of your track time) so that you are confident in giving your location. Takes some of the pressure off when you can say "Overhead thistown" instead of "I'm ehhh, about ...... 2 miles ehhhhh... SW of ehhhhm".
Oh yes, and have a pen & pad ready to note the ATC responses / clearances for readback.
Listening to "the professionals" on an airband receiver is useful to hear the flow, but not necessarily to hear the correct phraseology!
Anyway, all, none or some of the above have contributed to making me confident and competent enough to ask for (and receive) SVFR through the Heathrow zone on my first flight after getting my licence. I co**ed up several other things, mind you!
Good luck,
SD
I feel for you - my R/T was without the WORST aspect of my flying - and I dreaded using the radio. You are not alone!
Lots of good advice already - here's my 2p
I did a course of R/T ground school given by a professional ATCO, to both prepare for the R/T test and to improve my R/T. Best investment I made - equivalent to an hour's flying.
I also did with what many others suggest - practice wherever you can - in your car, on the train (you don't have to say it out loud!).
Another thing I do is to look at my half mil chart some evenings and plot a flight, thinking through what I would say to whom - request for FIS, MATZ pen, zone transit, whatever.
A tip for when you are in the air - think about where you are when you want to talk to someone. Even consider orbiting a landmark (but don't lose sight of your track time) so that you are confident in giving your location. Takes some of the pressure off when you can say "Overhead thistown" instead of "I'm ehhh, about ...... 2 miles ehhhhh... SW of ehhhhm".
Oh yes, and have a pen & pad ready to note the ATC responses / clearances for readback.
Listening to "the professionals" on an airband receiver is useful to hear the flow, but not necessarily to hear the correct phraseology!
Anyway, all, none or some of the above have contributed to making me confident and competent enough to ask for (and receive) SVFR through the Heathrow zone on my first flight after getting my licence. I co**ed up several other things, mind you!
Good luck,
SD
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 353
Likes: 4
From: Around
Don't worry about being nervous or feeling overwhelmed by the radio, it happens to everyone, even us controllers when we are new to the game, or as a civvy controller when a millitary pilot asks you for something strange.
I think it's been said already, but my top tips for making dealing with ATC easier would be:
Use the phrases 'Standby' and 'Say Again'. They are not the sole possessions of the controller, pilots can say 'em too! The wrong response when you don't understand something is (my personal niggle) an extended silence.
Learn what is a mandatory readback. It's mandatory! If the controller is doing his/her job, they won't leave you alone until you've read it back if you just replied 'roger' first time.
The initial contact details seem to vary from person to person. I'm happy with the basics: 'XYZ Radar, this is G-ABCD (wait for 'pass yr message') G-CD is a PA28 out of Somefield, inbound to Otherfield, routing via (Navaid/turning point). Overhead Blahtown at 3000', requesting FIS.' If they want more, they'll ask for it.
If all else fails, use plain english. It's surprisingly effective
I think it's been said already, but my top tips for making dealing with ATC easier would be:
Use the phrases 'Standby' and 'Say Again'. They are not the sole possessions of the controller, pilots can say 'em too!
The wrong response when you don't understand something is (my personal niggle) an extended silence. Learn what is a mandatory readback. It's mandatory! If the controller is doing his/her job, they won't leave you alone until you've read it back if you just replied 'roger' first time.
The initial contact details seem to vary from person to person. I'm happy with the basics: 'XYZ Radar, this is G-ABCD (wait for 'pass yr message') G-CD is a PA28 out of Somefield, inbound to Otherfield, routing via (Navaid/turning point). Overhead Blahtown at 3000', requesting FIS.' If they want more, they'll ask for it.
If all else fails, use plain english. It's surprisingly effective
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 265
Likes: 0
From: Belgium
As an ex-controller and a current PPL I would say there are four simple things you need to say, when outside the circuit:
Who you are: - GABCD
what you are: - C150
where you are: - 5 miles SW of BigTown at 2500ft
what you want to do: request transit en route to Smalltown
That should get the ball rolling - be ready to write down any instructions - especially altitudes, QNH, Transponder codes, routing, runway etc. (have pen ready in hand and blank space on form). Just say back to ATC what they said to you (forget the wind though).
Who you are: - GABCD
what you are: - C150
where you are: - 5 miles SW of BigTown at 2500ft
what you want to do: request transit en route to Smalltown
That should get the ball rolling - be ready to write down any instructions - especially altitudes, QNH, Transponder codes, routing, runway etc. (have pen ready in hand and blank space on form). Just say back to ATC what they said to you (forget the wind though).
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 303
Likes: 0
From: Almost Scotland
Lots and lots of good advice above, and I can't better it.
However, the advice about practising away from the aerodrome is, IMHO, very good. It certainly worked for me! (I'm not saying I get it all right, all the time now, but at least I'm not afraid to make the call, not unconfident that I will understand whatever info. I need from ATC and be able to read back accurately, and not unconfident enough to ask for clarification/repetition if I've missed something - I think that's a reasonable practical compromise.)
Good luck with the RT - and its right: it will suddently come good, and with it the confidence.
However, the advice about practising away from the aerodrome is, IMHO, very good. It certainly worked for me! (I'm not saying I get it all right, all the time now, but at least I'm not afraid to make the call, not unconfident that I will understand whatever info. I need from ATC and be able to read back accurately, and not unconfident enough to ask for clarification/repetition if I've missed something - I think that's a reasonable practical compromise.)
Good luck with the RT - and its right: it will suddently come good, and with it the confidence.
Thread Starter
Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 6
Likes: 0
From: London
I'm amazed with all the responses, thanks, and I'm feeling a lot more confident now that I know I'm not the only one who's brain has gone blank when told a whole garble of instructions from ATC!
I do sound like Frank Spencer, how did you know?
I've started talking to myself in the car and this is helping so I think what the general message coming across here is practice, practice and practice.
I am getting better but I think its just a confidence thing here. I start ok but if i make one mistake, more often than not i'll start getting muddled and more stressed and make more mistakes. My instructor is excellent but i feel it is probably getting frustrating for him!
I remember something my driving instructor said many years ago "believe in the force" ie have confidence in yourself and what your doing and stop doubting yourself, if you feel you are doing something or might do something wrong, then you will be more stressed and likely to do something wrong.
I have to admit that i have done a few solo cross country flights and these have gone really well, including the RT but this is because i'm alone and i don't have my instructor looking over my shoulder. When i'm with my instructor its very easy to think that if i miss something i can just ask him. When i'm solo I have to concentrate hard on the message or "Say again". I've noticed that if I miss something important, i'm always prompted or reminded by ATC anyway.
I think i just have to relax a little more, practice the RT on the ground, and prepare what i'm going to say before i say it in the air and be ready for instructions i'm likely to hear back.
If you see somebody talking to themselves at Kings Cross Thameslink in the evening, don't worry, it will probably be me! OOH Betty!
I do sound like Frank Spencer, how did you know?
I've started talking to myself in the car and this is helping so I think what the general message coming across here is practice, practice and practice.
I am getting better but I think its just a confidence thing here. I start ok but if i make one mistake, more often than not i'll start getting muddled and more stressed and make more mistakes. My instructor is excellent but i feel it is probably getting frustrating for him!
I remember something my driving instructor said many years ago "believe in the force" ie have confidence in yourself and what your doing and stop doubting yourself, if you feel you are doing something or might do something wrong, then you will be more stressed and likely to do something wrong.
I have to admit that i have done a few solo cross country flights and these have gone really well, including the RT but this is because i'm alone and i don't have my instructor looking over my shoulder. When i'm with my instructor its very easy to think that if i miss something i can just ask him. When i'm solo I have to concentrate hard on the message or "Say again". I've noticed that if I miss something important, i'm always prompted or reminded by ATC anyway.
I think i just have to relax a little more, practice the RT on the ground, and prepare what i'm going to say before i say it in the air and be ready for instructions i'm likely to hear back.
If you see somebody talking to themselves at Kings Cross Thameslink in the evening, don't worry, it will probably be me! OOH Betty!
The Original Whirly
Joined: Feb 1999
Aviation Qualifications: CPL
Posts: 4,327
Likes: 2
From: Belper, Derbyshire, UK
One thing I forgot that helped me tremendously...
Sleap, which I flew from for a time as a newish PPL, was desperate for more A/G operators. I started training as one, though I never had time to complete it. But I did around 6 hours, most of it practising talking to aircraft, with an experienced guy on hand if I really couldn't cope. And after you've given your umpteenth aircraft the QFE, runway in use, and wind, and coped with every standard of RT from excellent to worse than you would have believed possible (and worse than you are!), and tried to remember just how many aircraft are in the circuit and where they all are....I guarantee you won't be scared of the radio any more! See if you can find an airfield that will let you help out, if only for an hour or two. It really really helps.
Sleap, which I flew from for a time as a newish PPL, was desperate for more A/G operators. I started training as one, though I never had time to complete it. But I did around 6 hours, most of it practising talking to aircraft, with an experienced guy on hand if I really couldn't cope. And after you've given your umpteenth aircraft the QFE, runway in use, and wind, and coped with every standard of RT from excellent to worse than you would have believed possible (and worse than you are!), and tried to remember just how many aircraft are in the circuit and where they all are....I guarantee you won't be scared of the radio any more! See if you can find an airfield that will let you help out, if only for an hour or two. It really really helps.
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 138
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From: Over the hedge... just!
monkeyslave,
I had to research an aviation product idea by conducting a survey at the North Weald airshow, the most common area that pilots gave as a weak point was RT. This was not just students.
So you are not alone.
On my QXC I wrote down the anticipated RT scripts with some blanks which were filled in just before Tx. One sheet for each leg. It worked well for me
My RT was better when I passed my PPL than it is now.
Use it or loose it
CC
PS I had my RT ticket issued before I had my PPL issued.
I had to research an aviation product idea by conducting a survey at the North Weald airshow, the most common area that pilots gave as a weak point was RT. This was not just students.
So you are not alone.
On my QXC I wrote down the anticipated RT scripts with some blanks which were filled in just before Tx. One sheet for each leg. It worked well for me
My RT was better when I passed my PPL than it is now.
Use it or loose it
CC
PS I had my RT ticket issued before I had my PPL issued.
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 278
Likes: 0
From: UK
Not much I can add to what has been said on a REALLY good thread. As an ATCO and PPL (who FYI can still make a tit of himself on the RT whether flying or controlling) I want to hear
Who, what,where, from where, to where what do you want.
ie GABCD PA38 from Nottingham to Leicester, 5 miles south of leicester one thousand four hundred feet request zone transit in the climb to altitude two thousand feet and FIS.
I know CAP 413 says it but giving your heading to a radar controller is very little use, we only see tracks on the screen so speaking personally don't bother.
My biggest bug bear is people not asking for what they want. They will give you details and then stop short of any request.
Alsio if you want zone transit include from where to where so we can judge what you are going to affect.
Any way must go, am due in approach!!
Who, what,where, from where, to where what do you want.
ie GABCD PA38 from Nottingham to Leicester, 5 miles south of leicester one thousand four hundred feet request zone transit in the climb to altitude two thousand feet and FIS.
I know CAP 413 says it but giving your heading to a radar controller is very little use, we only see tracks on the screen so speaking personally don't bother.
My biggest bug bear is people not asking for what they want. They will give you details and then stop short of any request.
Alsio if you want zone transit include from where to where so we can judge what you are going to affect.
Any way must go, am due in approach!!