Visas to fly in the US?

[The man formerly known as]

Did I hear correctly ypu now need a Visa to train for a PPL or hourbuild in the USofA?

[sennadog]

Sort of. All of the details that you need are in this thread....


http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthr...threadid=60273

[Just_Another_PPL]

You dont need one, i just came back a week ago with my PPL, the only thing to be aware of is when you go hour building, you used to be able to turn up with your JAA licence (any ICAO) get a FAA one, since mid-july you now have to wait up to 2 months so that the FAA can get a background check on you.

[ETOPS773]

If your hour building,the American Embassy in London say you need a tourist B-2 visa to be on the safe side,as you might get turned back if your on on the visa waiver programme.

[Baldie Man]

You need an M1 Student VISA to get a PPL and hours build in the States now.

You have to apply for an I-20 form through the FTO then apply for the VISA. This so far has taken me in the region of 8 weeks.

This is a very new procedure that has just been introduced and a bloody good job too IMHO. It is a pain being arsed around but if it avoids anymore terrorists getting trained over there then so be it.

BM.

[Just_Another_PPL]

It is simple, when you get there, just tell them that you are there for pleasure and then yu can be there for 3 months without a visa, thats what i did.

[Baldie Man]

I would imagine the INS are now aware of that little loophole you exploited J_A_P and I think you'll find that a prospective PPL'er will not be able to do that shortly (if they can't already) as the FTO will have to apply for an I-20 for you to be allowed to train at their establishment.

A safe bet wouldn't you say?

BM.

[mattpilot]

thats correct baldie, but not to hour build.

[englishal]

Yea...hour building the US Embassy recommends a B2 visa...however when entering under visa waiver, you are essentially getting a B2 when they stamp you in (check your passport for last entry, by the "Admitted" stamp they usually write B1: business or B2: pleasure)...so you don't really need a visa to hour build....but if you've got time, it may be worth getting.

EA

[Just_Another_PPL]

I agree, if you have the time and you can be arsed, go ahead, if not dont worry, i arrived in the US on the 30th of June so my experience is fairly recent. If you talk to the flight school i am sure they will help you out.

[FlyingForFun]

I know the situation has changed since, but when I went to America my understanding was that a Visa Waiver was sufficient for hours building, as mattpilot said. However, I didn't have very much faith that the guy working on the immigration desk would know that, or would even understand the difference between hour building and training. And if they decide not to let you in, you're on the next plane home, with no right of appeal. If I'd had time, I'd have got a Visa, even though it wasn't necessary. Since I didn't have time, I went without one, but I certainly didn't mention to the guy on immigration that I was in the country to go flying. Especially since this was only a couple of months after September 11th.

FFF
----------------

[englishal]

One other thing....don't forget you FTO phone number! Sounds stupid I know, but I heard about a chap getting questioned at LAX about hour building. Once INS had phoned and the FTO had confirmed that he was only there to rent the aircraft, he was let in...

Cheers
EA

[mattpilot]

here's a tip: Dont be stupid enough to tell the immigrations officer that your going to do some flying. As FFF said, he may be incompetent and dont understand the difference between anything that has to do with aviation. And in the rare case that they do question you at one point on your vacation, just deny it and say you did mention it Who's to say you did or didn't? Its not like they are recording every conversation with the immigrations officer, or do they?

But then again, i guess you could deny that too and say you "thought" you said it.

[Naples Air Center, Inc.]

Just thought I would clear up some of the questions in this thread.

Non U.S. Citizens

First off, I was worried about people talking about trying to deceive the Immigration Officer when entering the U.S.A. When you come though, Immigration, tell the officer exactly what you are doing! It is not worth running the risk of being deported and not being able to return to the U.S.A. for the rest of the decade.

You need to be on a Visa if you are going to do any flying towards a Licence, Rating, or Certification. The Visa you need to be on is either F-1, M-1, or J-1. The B-1/B-2/Visa Waiver are not acceptable for this type of flying.

If a pilot has a JAA Licence, for example, and wants to hour build in the U.S.A. they will need to go though the backgroud check to get a Licence Conversion before flying. This process can take up to 60 days. When they enter the U.S.A. they will need to be on a B Visa. If you do not have the time to get a Licence Conversion, you will need to take the FAA Private Written Exam and PPL Checkride before flying in the U.S.A. as PIC. In this case you will need to be on an F-1, M-1, or J-1 Visa even to hour build.

Please read the new rules from INS added to Visitor Visas on April 12, 2002:

Requiring Change of Status From B to F-1 or M-1 Nonimmigrant Prior to Pursuing a Course of Study

Note the wording written into the new rules, " A Course of Study". INS did not specify FAA Flight Training, it is ANY course of study where by definiton the student is studying towards a certification.

The rules are clear and they are in black and white. Anyone that tells you anything different from what is listed in the rules is incorrect.

Also be suspect of anyone that tells you to lie or to try to deceive the Immigration Officers. If they are telling you this, it is because they know what they are telling you is incorrect and you need to lie to get into the country.

Safe and Happy Flying,

Capt. Richard J. Gentil, Pres.
Naples Air Center, Inc.

[GoneWest]

This process can take up to 60 days.

Indeed - if you are coming from the UK - this process is, currently, endless.

There is no process avialable, at the moment, to convert a UK licence to an FAA one. You would need to take the full FAA flight test.

One POSSIBLE way MAY be to transfer your UK JAA licence into some other countries JAA licence - and then do the 60 day route.

It's a snag with UK law - not really the CAA's fault (certainly not all of it) - but there is no transfer process available.

[ETOPS773]

I think You can still fly PIC and hour build without FAA PPL. Think about it!!!!just your a slow student who has just gotten to solo stage and your doing your x/c`s,and your going to do quite a few of them...

There isn`t a limit on how many x/c`s you can do when going for your PPL as far as I know,your not under training doing the x/c,so as long as your signed off before hand I don`t see why you cannot get all your hours in under that condition.

[Naples Air Center, Inc.]

ETOPS773,

If you are going to fly on a Student Solo Certificate, you will need to have either an F-1, M-1 or J-1 Visa. It is a "Student" Certificate.

Also, you will need to be signed off by an instructor for each cross country flight and you will not be able to take passengers.

In addition you will need to review all maneuvers with the instructor and do a minimum of 3 hours of cross country time with the instructor.

It is better to just get the full FAA PPL and have an unrestricted licence that allows you to take passengers, fly at night and it complies 100% with the rules.

Take Care,

Capt. Richard J. Gentil, Pres.
Naples Air Center, Inc.

[FRIDAY]

Just curious? What if you decide to go just for the PPL , and complete it under 30 days. Can you not be let in for just recreational flying for such a short period of time???

[Facts Not Fiction Pls]

Friday

That is the whole point...

Any training that is received towards a certification or license is classed as a course of study ie F1/M1/J1 visas.

Students without Visas are being turned away at Immigration every week.