Setting up a flying group

[MarcusH]

I wonder could someone help me. I am trying to set up a group of pilots, flying an LAA aircraft, this is my first time doing this, and was wondering if there is an app for running logs and peoples account for us. It strikes me that It would all be easiest if we could have something online (that can be filled in at the end of each flight by the relevant member), rather than a big logbook in the aircraft, that needs to be taken home and have the details all entered again into spreadsheets.
It should keep track of
1)Members accounts Costs per hour and per month
2)Aircraft accounts
3)Maintenance logbooks for the aircraft
4)Possibly pilot logs as well.
Is there anything else we need to keep logs of?

[Maoraigh1]

After almost 29 years in a group, which had been running for years before I joined, I was a founder member of a new Group in May. We're still not settled.(I haven't left the old Group)
There is a Group bank account into which the monthly payment for hangarage, insurance, etc is payed by direct debit.
The hourly charge is aimed at making a profit after fuel to cover routine maintenance, engine fund, improvements, etc. We pay our months flying less the fuel we've put in directly into the account.
I use a simple Excell sheet to record my flying expences, and email a copy to our treasurer.
We use a free online booking system.
We have a simple log sheet in the aircraft, from which the official aircraft log can be completed.
We arranged insurance before paying for the aircraft.
4 is not a good member number - we're split 2 v 2 at present over some decisions.

[gasax]

I think that for most groups a fairly active 'hands on' approach is more likely to work. Any potential distance is unfortunately an opportunity for some people. Regrettably you will generally only find out from those hands on activities, comparing fuel burn versus tacho and time, aircraft cleanliness, oil burn - all the things which as a sole owner I have a mental model of, but still need someone who will check over the aircraft and accounts with a detailed eye.

You may be lucky and have a group of honest caring individuals, but human nature being what it is that may not be the case. Individuals who are financially constrained will often push things a long way before doing the honourable thing and paying up or quitting. Best of luck and enjoy the work!

[Genghis the Engineer]

I've been in 10 groups, and had pretty much every role in them at some point.

I'm not sure I've found software that does all of that, but I do like GoBoKo for bookings and messaging - it'll also do things like tracking biennials and medicals if you want. Generally tech logs work best on paper, and pilots can look after their own logbooks without needing software help. Also make sure you've got an agreement now from everybody to any data being kept about them under the new GDPR regulations. Pretty much everybody I've seen does their finances in a spreadsheet - you could if you wish put that on something like a free Dropbox for everybody to update when they fly - but ensure everybody's IT friendly first.

I'd recommend having a trustee, chairman (last two often combined), maintenance member, treasurer, and consider having somebody responsible for organising regular cleaning as well. Have some mechanism for rotating those roles so that nobody feels all the work is dumped on them indefinitely - ideally nobody wants to do these jobs for more than about 3 years a time.

G

[pulse1]

I'd recommend having a trustee, chairman (last two often combined), maintenance member, treasurer, and consider having somebody responsible for organising regular cleaning as well. Have some mechanism for rotating those roles so that nobody feels all the work is dumped on them indefinitely - ideally nobody wants to do these jobs for more than about 3 years a time.

That's a wonderful idea but, in practice, probably impossible. For a start, having a Trustee is a legal requirement and the person has to be registered with the CAA along with the members of the Group. The CAA charge for changing the name of the Trustee but not the names of individual members. However, I do like the idea of a rota for being responsible for aircraft cleaning although, even that job can have small complications such as an agreed procedure for cleaning critical items such as windshields etc. You will be very lucky if you have one member with the specialised skills to ensure that proper maintenance is carried out and, particularly, to work out the best action in the event of minor problems which occur from time to time.
Another issue which makes changing jobs a bit less viable for Permit aircraft is that each group has to have at least one member who has full membership of the LAA. The rest can be ordinary members which is about £50 cheaper.