Safety Pilot - Simulated IMC
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Safety Pilot - Simulated IMC
I need to get my IFR flying up to scratch and some of it will be in VFR conditions in the UK.
What's the score with the safety pilot? Doe they have to have a PPL, UK PPL with IMC Rating or god forbid an instructor?
Thanks in advance.
Dean
What's the score with the safety pilot? Doe they have to have a PPL, UK PPL with IMC Rating or god forbid an instructor?
Thanks in advance.
Dean
Join Date: May 2002
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For any simulated IFR flying you do while in VMC conditions your safety pilot needs to be PPL or above.
Obviously for any real IMC you should have an IMC, I/R or FI with you.
Hope this helps........
Obviously for any real IMC you should have an IMC, I/R or FI with you.
Hope this helps........
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Given your 'N-Reg' status, I'm not sure whether a UK PPL will count. I think the idea is that the safety pilot has to be able to take control of the aircraft if it all goes wrong. Can a UK PPL do that on an N-Reg aircraft?
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I suppose what matters is 'who is pilot in command'? You can fly IFR in VMC - there is probably no legal requirement to look out of the window! So all you are doing is using your passenger as a set of eyes. Therefore, legally I suppose they don't even need to be a PPL, although I wouldn't do it myself with anyone less than a PPL.
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I'm sure I heard that a UK PPL IMC who wants to fly symulated IMC (ie, a VFR flight) only needs a responsilbe person sitting next to him/her. That means you're granny if you want! Can;t be right can it, but I'm sure that any PPL will do (pick one with good eyesight, bags of patience and an ability not to grab the controls when they see another a/c that's 5 miles away.
Don't know about N registered a/c - not much help really, am I?
Don't know about N registered a/c - not much help really, am I?
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loglickychops
Wrong I'm afraid. May I suggest a read of Rules 6 & 7 of the Rules of the Air - you're looking in section two of CAP393
CM
Wrong I'm afraid. May I suggest a read of Rules 6 & 7 of the Rules of the Air - you're looking in section two of CAP393
CM
Last edited by Chilli Monster; 23rd Jul 2002 at 04:50.
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S turns
The answer will to some extent depend upon whose aeroplane you are flying. If it belongs to a school, club or syndicate, they will no doubt have an order book that specifies the precise requirement.
If its your own, then you as the captain will be required to make an executive decision, as compliance with the Rules of the Air and avoiding a prosecution for endangerment, are your responsibility.
In simple, don't use anyone who is not qualified to act as PIC in the prevailing conditions, after all, you did say "some of it will be in VFR conditions" so presumably, some of it is under IFR.
The answer will to some extent depend upon whose aeroplane you are flying. If it belongs to a school, club or syndicate, they will no doubt have an order book that specifies the precise requirement.
If its your own, then you as the captain will be required to make an executive decision, as compliance with the Rules of the Air and avoiding a prosecution for endangerment, are your responsibility.
In simple, don't use anyone who is not qualified to act as PIC in the prevailing conditions, after all, you did say "some of it will be in VFR conditions" so presumably, some of it is under IFR.
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If you're flying under the FAR's, ie. N reg then the safety pilot must be minimum of an FAA PPL holder who is current and qualified on type. This means if you are doing ME IR currency, the other pilot must hold a ME rating (they must also sign your logbook). There is no requirement for them to hold an IR if you will remain in VMC.
in the UK the same applies, so long as you're both qualified and current on type, there is nothing to stop you practicing instruments, you under the hood and your buddy acting as safety pilot in VMC. When I say qualified, I mean if you are in a G reg aircraft, you must both hold an appropriate licence to act as PIC of this aircraft. If you mate happens to hold an IMC or IR then you can enter IMC.
Cheers
EA
in the UK the same applies, so long as you're both qualified and current on type, there is nothing to stop you practicing instruments, you under the hood and your buddy acting as safety pilot in VMC. When I say qualified, I mean if you are in a G reg aircraft, you must both hold an appropriate licence to act as PIC of this aircraft. If you mate happens to hold an IMC or IR then you can enter IMC.
Cheers
EA
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Dean, A previous post suggested that you will fly in an N Reg. If this is the case then you need another pilot when in VMC and under the hood. In IMC he will need an FAA IR and dual controls. If you want to book the time towards an FAA IR when under the hood then the other pilot should enter his license number in your log book. I am not sure this is really necessary but I have heard it asked for so just do it anyway.
If you are stuck for an FAA IR then I can always sit in with you.
If you are stuck for an FAA IR then I can always sit in with you.
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I'm playing devil's advocate here.....
OK, a PPL with the same qualifications can act as a safety pilot but does he not need to be trained to fly from the right hand seat?
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For the UK and a G-reg aircraft in VMC, I believe the legal minimum is that the safety pilot holds a PPL, i.e. that they are capable of acting as P1 should the need arise. That said, some clubs (including the one I fly with most regularly) and/or insurance companies may impose a tighter restriction - even for simulated IFR flight in VMC using foggles or similar the safety pilot must hold at least a PPL/IMC, for example. Always check the flying orders book - all good clubs should have one, although that might not apply to privately owned aircraft.
Sennadog - flying from the right-hand seat is not a lot different from flying from the left in my experience, although I haven't tried take-offs or landings from the right yet. I've also not found much difficulty going from stick to yoke. Don't forget that most single-seat or tandem-seat planes actually look like the right-hand side of most training aircraft, i.e. the stick is in the right-hand and the throttle in the left hand. Having said all that, I'm sure that any transition between types is made easier or more difficult depending on the skills (or in my case lack thereof) of the pilot - certainly my worst ever landing (including those during PPL training) occurred on my first flight in a new type where I had considerable experience on the smaller version of the same aircraft - thank God the instructor was ready for my faux-pas!
Cheers,
MD.
Sennadog - flying from the right-hand seat is not a lot different from flying from the left in my experience, although I haven't tried take-offs or landings from the right yet. I've also not found much difficulty going from stick to yoke. Don't forget that most single-seat or tandem-seat planes actually look like the right-hand side of most training aircraft, i.e. the stick is in the right-hand and the throttle in the left hand. Having said all that, I'm sure that any transition between types is made easier or more difficult depending on the skills (or in my case lack thereof) of the pilot - certainly my worst ever landing (including those during PPL training) occurred on my first flight in a new type where I had considerable experience on the smaller version of the same aircraft - thank God the instructor was ready for my faux-pas!
Cheers,
MD.
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There is no mystic in flying from the rhs. Parallax errors affect the DI and ASI more than the most important IFR instruments, i.e. the AI (& if the vacuum fails - the TC and Mag compass). Parallax error on the altimeter is less than instrument error.
There are more variations between individual aircraft and their RNAV fits and controls than the differences between left and right front seats.
However, like most things in flying, it is sensible to be cautious and think things through whenever you do something in a slightly different way to the way you've done it before.
Remember, some aircraft don't have toe or heel brakes on the rhs and so if you are landing on hard runways, or doing any sort of performance landing, you need to be where the brakes are.
There are more variations between individual aircraft and their RNAV fits and controls than the differences between left and right front seats.
However, like most things in flying, it is sensible to be cautious and think things through whenever you do something in a slightly different way to the way you've done it before.
Remember, some aircraft don't have toe or heel brakes on the rhs and so if you are landing on hard runways, or doing any sort of performance landing, you need to be where the brakes are.
