New medical rules for NPPL/PPL
The original NPPL Medical Declaration system did at least require the pilot to visit a GP to countersign the certificate. There were 2 grades, one which permitted flight with passengers and one which did not.
But the new brooms at the CAA have swept that level of prudence away and now anyone can simply lie like a cheap Changi watch and self-declare.
But the new brooms at the CAA have swept that level of prudence away and now anyone can simply lie like a cheap Changi watch and self-declare.
Last edited by BEagle; 17th Oct 2016 at 16:39. Reason: I meant GP, not AME!!
The original NPPL Medical Declaration system did at least require the pilot to visit an AME to countersign the certificate. There were 2 grades, one which permitted flight with passengers and one which did not.
Oops -yes, sorry! I meant to write 'GP'! Post duly edited!!
That was one of the best aspects of the NPPL system - no need to see an AME. In fact an AME wasn't even allowed to sign the Medical Declaration unless he/she happened to be your GP.
That was one of the best aspects of the NPPL system - no need to see an AME. In fact an AME wasn't even allowed to sign the Medical Declaration unless he/she happened to be your GP.
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So thanks to the good offices of the LAA/BGA et al in lobbying for common sense with the "clarification" there is now some meaning to the changes as we're OK up to 2000kg, still tough if you've got an especially large plane though. We can continue flying our LAA types anon and EASA types until 04/18. I've heard rumours that they're working on that, which would sensible as it will keep more money in the industry from those who currently only have access to them. As the US is going the same way with driver medical standards for PPLs it would be the icing on the cake if the CAA and the FAA could come to the sensible agreement to recognise each other's rules so we could then fly again over there if we wanted to. My declaration has been done, so my old style PPL is now valid again as well as the NPPL, it's nice to have it back! Maybe my FAA one will become usable again some day, fingers crossed.
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So, does this really mean that you can ignore any disqualifying condition/s and self declare providing you do not fly an aircraft over 2000kg MTOW?
A person must not act as the member of the flight crew of an aircraft registered in the UK if they know or suspect their physical or mental condition renders them temporarily or permanently unfit to perform such functions or to act in such capacity, including unfitness.
Withdrawal of Medical Fitness
If you no longer reasonably believe that you meet the medical requirements:
• • •
Of a DVLA Group 1 Ordinary Driving Licence, or
have been so advised by a medical practitioner, such as a GP, or
if you reasonably believe that you have developed one or more of the disqualifying medical conditions, as mentioned in ‘The
Medical Declaration’ section, appropriate to the declaration made, or as otherwise specified by the CAA.
you must withdraw your medical declaration by ticking the appropriate box and submitting a new self-declaration to the CAA. You should request advice from an AME if you subsequently wish to resume flying.
Withdrawal of Medical Fitness
If you no longer reasonably believe that you meet the medical requirements:
• • •
Of a DVLA Group 1 Ordinary Driving Licence, or
have been so advised by a medical practitioner, such as a GP, or
if you reasonably believe that you have developed one or more of the disqualifying medical conditions, as mentioned in ‘The
Medical Declaration’ section, appropriate to the declaration made, or as otherwise specified by the CAA.
you must withdraw your medical declaration by ticking the appropriate box and submitting a new self-declaration to the CAA. You should request advice from an AME if you subsequently wish to resume flying.
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That's as it should be, but the LAA statement, "if you're fit to drive to the airfield, you're fit to fly!", is to say the least a bit misleading.
The DVLA group 1 medical requirement is pretty lenient with most medical conditions, but group 2 does rightly impose much more stringent requirements.
Also, if my reading of the revised Medical Declaration is correct it also seems to allow for the carriage of passengers, not what the old NPPL countersigned Medical Declaration allowed for under Group 1.
- or am I just confused!
The DVLA group 1 medical requirement is pretty lenient with most medical conditions, but group 2 does rightly impose much more stringent requirements.
Also, if my reading of the revised Medical Declaration is correct it also seems to allow for the carriage of passengers, not what the old NPPL countersigned Medical Declaration allowed for under Group 1.
- or am I just confused!
If I ask my GP whether I should continue driving, and he says "Yes', then, providing I have concealed nothing from him, I can legally fly, within the UK National Boundaries, to the limits permitted by my licence, while carrying pax.
Correct??
Correct??
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AIUI there is no restriction on the carriage of passengers using the new self declaration, neither is there any need to ask your GP whether you are fit to fly.
For sub 2 tons you simply need to declare that you are not bonkers and to undertake not to fly, or to cease flying if you have any reason to suspect or know that you are not fit to do so.
For sub 2 tons you simply need to declare that you are not bonkers and to undertake not to fly, or to cease flying if you have any reason to suspect or know that you are not fit to do so.
My post assumed I had just been diagnosed with some serious medical condition. As long as the GP says OK to driving, I can now fly. He may be thinking of me driving on the local roads to the shops, or to his surgery.
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https://www.gov.uk/government/public...-professionals
See this for the guidelines for your doctor. There is no way they are going to say "yes you can drive to the local shops, but dont go on any big scary roads". Either you meet the standards or you dont.
So yes, if you can drive, you can fly up to 2000kg on the national licence unless you are under medication for a mental illness. With passengers.
See this for the guidelines for your doctor. There is no way they are going to say "yes you can drive to the local shops, but dont go on any big scary roads". Either you meet the standards or you dont.
So yes, if you can drive, you can fly up to 2000kg on the national licence unless you are under medication for a mental illness. With passengers.
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Self declaration Medical submission
Is there a clever workaround for making the CAA self declaration online form work via Google Chrome? Doesn't seem to submit.
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Pilot Medical Declaration
On the Declaration Form you have to tick the box that confirms :-
a. I hereby declare that I reasonably believe I meet the medical requirements for a Group 1 Ordinary Driving Licence issued by the DVLA and am not subject to any disqualifying medical condition as defined in the ‘Pilot Medical Declaration Guidance Notes’.
From the ANO wording 'disqualifying medical condition' is quoted :-
6) For the purposes of this article, “disqualifying medical condition”means any physical or mental condition or illness, or any history of such a condition or illness, including—
(a) any alcohol or drug abuse, addiction or misuse;
(b) any neurological condition;
(c) any functional disability;
(d) any surgery or medical treatment;
(e)any collapse, fainting or loss of consciousness;
(f) any history of (a) to (e); or
(g) such other medical conditions as the CAA may specify,
that might impair the safe operation of normal flight controls or render the licence holder unfit at any time to perform any function for which the licence is granted.
If appropriate you then tick the 'Fly no greater than 2000kg' box.
So from the above, previous comments on this thread about only needing to meet the medical requirements for a Group 1 Driving Licence are incorrect, because you are declaring also that you are not subject to any of the disqualifying medical conditions.
Please tell me I am wrong but don't seem to be able interpret any other way.
a. I hereby declare that I reasonably believe I meet the medical requirements for a Group 1 Ordinary Driving Licence issued by the DVLA and am not subject to any disqualifying medical condition as defined in the ‘Pilot Medical Declaration Guidance Notes’.
From the ANO wording 'disqualifying medical condition' is quoted :-
6) For the purposes of this article, “disqualifying medical condition”means any physical or mental condition or illness, or any history of such a condition or illness, including—
(a) any alcohol or drug abuse, addiction or misuse;
(b) any neurological condition;
(c) any functional disability;
(d) any surgery or medical treatment;
(e)any collapse, fainting or loss of consciousness;
(f) any history of (a) to (e); or
(g) such other medical conditions as the CAA may specify,
that might impair the safe operation of normal flight controls or render the licence holder unfit at any time to perform any function for which the licence is granted.
If appropriate you then tick the 'Fly no greater than 2000kg' box.
So from the above, previous comments on this thread about only needing to meet the medical requirements for a Group 1 Driving Licence are incorrect, because you are declaring also that you are not subject to any of the disqualifying medical conditions.
Please tell me I am wrong but don't seem to be able interpret any other way.
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Pilot Medical Declaration
On the Declaration Form you have to tick the box that confirms :-
a. I hereby declare that I reasonably believe I meet the medical requirements for a Group 1 Ordinary Driving Licence issued by the DVLA and am not subject to any disqualifying medical condition as defined in the ‘Pilot Medical Declaration Guidance Notes’.
The ‘Pilot Medical Declaration Guidance Notes' are shown at the top of the SRG1210 form and make clear that, for sub-two-tonne aircraft, the only disqualifying condition is psychiatric.
The twelve disqualifying conditions listed further down on page 1 apparently only apply for aircraft between 2001 kgs and 5700 kgs.
Or perhaps it is I who have misunderstood. Clear as mud, eh?
a. I hereby declare that I reasonably believe I meet the medical requirements for a Group 1 Ordinary Driving Licence issued by the DVLA and am not subject to any disqualifying medical condition as defined in the ‘Pilot Medical Declaration Guidance Notes’.
The ‘Pilot Medical Declaration Guidance Notes' are shown at the top of the SRG1210 form and make clear that, for sub-two-tonne aircraft, the only disqualifying condition is psychiatric.
The twelve disqualifying conditions listed further down on page 1 apparently only apply for aircraft between 2001 kgs and 5700 kgs.
Or perhaps it is I who have misunderstood. Clear as mud, eh?
You are wrong.
Read the second section 'To Only Fly an Aircraft of 2000kg MTOW or Less' (sic) of https://publicapps.caa.co.uk/modalap...e=form&id=7580 .
Read the second section 'To Only Fly an Aircraft of 2000kg MTOW or Less' (sic) of https://publicapps.caa.co.uk/modalap...e=form&id=7580 .
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The trouble is that the group of aircraft categorised as 'any Aircraft up to 5700kg MTOW' also includes as a subset all those aircraft categorised as 'an Aircraft of 2000kg MTOW or Less'. Poorly worded & open to misinterpretation.