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flying N-Reg in EU with EASA PPL

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flying N-Reg in EU with EASA PPL

Old 18th Jan 2016, 16:16
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flying N-Reg in EU with EASA PPL

Can I fly N-reg aircraft in EU if I only have an EASA licence? Google spits out very contradicting information. An opportunity has come up for me to get my hands on my first aircraft, the only worry is that it's N-reg and I have no idea what implications it may have. FAR 61.3 basically suggests that I should have no issues flying it in the country of which my licence is issued, however, does that mean that it would be illegal for me to tour around EU?
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Old 18th Jan 2016, 16:39
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Originally Posted by Martin_123 View Post
does that mean that it would be illegal for me to tour around EU?
Correct. You can only use it in the country of your licence issue.
You can apply to the FAA for a 61.75 (Based on) certificate. You can then use the aircraft all over Europe.

The process has been described on here many times but does require a brief trip to the USA. The CAA will take 44 from you to allow them to release your info, the FAA do it for free.
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Old 18th Jan 2016, 16:55
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I guess I found my own answer after all - http://peter2000.co.uk/aviation/misc...at-Britain.pdf

what a shame..

what's involved in getting it under EU registry? I suppose VAT, anything else? How is the VAT calculated? Let's say if I buy a plane from a friend and pay him something silly like 500eur (the rest may or may not involve brown envelopes), surely your tax office will frown upon that? are they then looking at some catalogue value or something?
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Old 18th Jan 2016, 20:28
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what's involved in getting it under EU registry?
That will vary between countries.

I suppose VAT, anything else?
If you are going to fly any plane around Europe, you had better make sure anyway the VAT has been paid _and_ carry proof. Whatever the registration.

How is the VAT calculated?
That too will vary between countries. I seem to have heard that a catalog is used by German tax authorities, but have neither certainty nor details.
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Old 19th Jan 2016, 09:48
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Originally Posted by Martin_123 View Post
I guess I found my own answer after all - http://peter2000.co.uk/aviation/misc...at-Britain.pdf

what a shame..

what's involved in getting it under EU registry? I suppose VAT, anything else? How is the VAT calculated? Let's say if I buy a plane from a friend and pay him something silly like 500eur (the rest may or may not involve brown envelopes), surely your tax office will frown upon that? are they then looking at some catalogue value or something?
VAT Shouldn't be an issue moving to an EU reg. The aircraft is either VAT paid in free circulation with proof - in which case no VAT to pay, or it is not and then VAT is due. This is a particular risk if the aircraft is based somewhere like the Channel Islands or other non-EU location.

The VAT man has enormous power to make your life a complete misery and is very alert to a range of dodges. The penalties are massive if you have intentionally avoided VAT, so not a good path.

The main cost will be ensuring the aircraft is compliant with EU regulations as there are a number of modifications and maintenance options available to N-Reg that are not necessarily directly acceptable for an EU registered aircraft. The 61.75 licence is much more straight forward than moving registration and can be done (at a higher cost) without going to the US.
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Old 19th Jan 2016, 10:02
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The CAA will take 44 from you to allow them to release your info, the FAA do it for free.
Perhaps not, as a resident of Dublin with presumably an Irish Licence!
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Old 19th Jan 2016, 10:08
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my consideration here is if I buy a plane for let's say 10k, paying an extra 2k for vat is not going to bankrupt me. I've no intention in avoiding or circumventing the law. What I don't want however is that my tax man looks at cessna or piper web site and decides that my 50yo spam can is worth in the area of 400k USD and bills me accordingly. So I was hoping for some first hand experiences with this.

The 61.75 licence is much more straight forward than moving registration and can be done (at a higher cost) without going to the US.
ah now that's something I'm interested in - go on?
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Old 20th Jan 2016, 11:01
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The process is described on the FAA Web site (Get CAA to produce letter of verification using their paperwork, send it and FAA form to US, designate the FSDO that will do the face to face, have the face to face).

I believe you designate NY International Field Office and then also contact one of two UK DPEs

The FAA Site

Note, the embedded link for Adam House might be missing the .uk on the end (i.e. is hotmail.co not hotmail.co.uk).

All the paperwork happens and then you arrange the face to face with one of the two listed DPE's at your mutual convenience in the UK and pay a material fee (I am lead to believe something like 400) to avoid a trip to the US.

I am sure which ever one you choose to use can confirm the details in a short email exchange.
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Old 20th Jan 2016, 11:12
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Originally Posted by Martin_123 View Post
my consideration here is if I buy a plane for let's say 10k, paying an extra 2k for vat is not going to bankrupt me. I've no intention in avoiding or circumventing the law. What I don't want however is that my tax man looks at cessna or piper web site and decides that my 50yo spam can is worth in the area of 400k USD and bills me accordingly. So I was hoping for some first hand experiences with this
They mostly will look at the Bill of Sale, they may have a quick check of Trade-a-plane, Controller, Vref of some other site if the value looks odd. I have never heard of an honest transaction being a problem, but have heard of dishonest transactions being rumbled.
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Old 22nd Jan 2016, 16:13
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thanks for all your help. Last concern - are there any drawbacks for Nreg ownership? Any insurance difficulties? Getting CoA/Permit/Annual sorted? How does that happen?
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Old 24th Jan 2016, 09:10
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The main drawback is the need for both EASA and FAA licenses. There are some minor hassles like needing to work out how to use the FCC website to buy your radio license. Maintenance and insurance are readily available. In particular, maintenance is globally available.
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