Airbus Captain for an hour
Thread Starter
Airbus Captain for an hour
About a month ago, through a well-connected friend, I was offered an hour in an A330 Level D simulator. It was not difficult to accept the offer, even though it meant a four-hour flight to get to the training centre. 
I’m a PPL with no large aircraft experience, but I used to have an IR and pre-2001, I had several jump seat rides on various commercial aircraft. I had previously flown a 737 NG simulator and was very keen to see how the Airbus differed from the Boeing.
In preparation for the flight, I downloaded and read the appropriate parts of the A330 Flight Crew Training Manual. Following a request for other appropriate information on the “Questions” forum, FlightDetent pointed me to the more useful (from my point of view) A330 Flight Deck and Systems Briefing for Pilots and fantom reminded me to be aware of the inertia of such a large aeroplane.
Yesterday morning, I had a call to say that the A330 was “AOG”, but they were hoping to have it fixed by today.
Then in the afternoon, I had a bad news/good news call. The A330 had not been fixed, but they had arranged a slot for me in an A380 sim!
So today was the day. The cockpit of the A380 is very similar to the A330 I had been studying, with the obvious difference of four power levers and lack of a manual trim wheel plus differences in instrument layout and controls, that were not relevant to the manual flying that I was going to do. The cockpit is smaller than I had expected for the size of the aircraft. I sat in the left seat and after adjusting the seat and armrest, was able to comfortably manipulate the sidestick and the rudder pedals. Normally, I don’t like flying with a stick in my left hand but this felt quite comfortable after a short while, mainly due to the forearm support provided by the armrest.
I did an initial takeoff from Doha, flying manually, but with auto throttle to handle the speed. It was very simple - brakes off, power levers to TOGA, keep straight with the rudder, rotate after the automatic V1 callout, positive ROC - gear up, power levers back to the CLB detent and flaps up in stages at the appropriate speeds. The visual display is very impressive and you very quickly forget you are looking at a synthetic world outside.
I then did some manoeuvring in Normal Law. Medium turns are very easy - deflect the stick slightly until the appropriate bank angle is reached and then let the stick re-centre. No need for back stick to hold the nose-up - trim is applied automatically. The stick does take some getting used to though - there is no feel, other than centreing springs - it is just like a computer joystick. I found holding it with two fingers and my thumb worked well. Applying small movements and waiting to see what happened worked well. Large movements tended to lead to PIOs.
We then repositioned to a 10 mile final on the ILS and I did a manual landing, with auto throttle and flight director. I found it easy to follow the flight director (two green bars like ILS needles and a small white square which represents the aircraft) but when transitioning to outside scene, I had a tendency to over control. The landing was easy - power levers to Idle at the 100’ RA callout, a slight pitch-up to flare at 40’, a slight jolt and a satisfying main wheel rumble, lower the nose wheel and keep straight with the rudder pedals during the rapid deceleration (Autobrake 3).
I remember being surprised by the cockpit height at touchdown when I first saw a landing from the jumpseat in a 777, but I had no problem judging the flare in the A380, mainly due to the height callouts.
We then moved to Hong Kong, where I did a couple of landings (one with an engine failure on approach) and a takeoff, with cloud base at about 1000’ and a crosswind. I’m not sure of the wind velocity, but there was about a 10 degree crab angle. I can’t remember if I kicked off the drift in the flare - I may have done so automatically out of habit, but again the landings were uneventful. One of the landings was done using the HUD, which due to lack of experience, I found more difficult than using the conventional instrument displays.
My instructor then took us up to FL300 and I then tried flying in Direct Law, without auto throttle. This is where all the protections are not available and there is no autopilot or auto-trim available. Reversion to Direct Law would only happen in reality if there were multiple hydraulic or computer failures, but the sim has a special Direct Law demo mode, that avoids having to fail systems and then have ECAM messages to deal with. I found the Direct Law fairly straight-forward, although a little bit more challenging than Normal Law, since the controls are now basically like a conventional aircraft, but again with no force-feedback. Unlike the A330, which has a conventional trim-wheel adjacent to the power levers, manual trimming in the A380 is done with two rocker switches in an inconvenient location at the back of the centre pedestal. In the short time I was trying this, I never did get the aircraft trimmed properly and there were some significant height variations. In the end, I just flew out-of-trim and lived with the stick centreing forces, which were not too bad.
I also flew with airspeed sensor failure. The speed tape on the left of the horizon is replaced with a very straightforward AOA display, with red bars top and bottom and a green zone, and Fast or Slow superimposed as appropriate.
I then did another ILS and landing in Direct Law. Again no problem, apart from the same tendency to over control when flying visually below 200’. Unfortunately at this point, the motion system had been deactivated due to some problem and it was difficult to tell if I had touched down or not, because of the cockpit height during the flare.
fantom, I didn't really notice any significant inertia effects in comparison to my 737 experience. However, I didn't do any aggressive manoeuvering and perhaps the inertia helped damp out my over-controlling near the ground. The only time I thought about the size of the aircraft was during some of the roll PIOs, when I had a vivid image of what they would look like from the ground!
At my request (thanks for the suggestion, FlightDetent), we then did a GPWS escape manoeuvre. While flying at 144 kts on the 07R ILS at Hong Kong, at about 2 miles from the threshold, I turned right and flew directly towards the 2000’ high ridge on Lantau Island. I found this very unnatural and difficult to do. Because we were in approach mode, the GPWS is much more tolerant of ground proximity than in cruise and it wasn’t until the forward view was filled with mountain side, that we got the “TERRAIN TERRAIN” warning followed almost immediately by “PULL-UP PULL-UP”. I pulled the stick back to the stop and applied TOGA thrust and suddenly there was nothing but sky outside and we were climbing out, with full-flaps and gear down, at 104 kts.
I didn't note the rate of climb or the pitch attitude, but it was a very impressive performance.
One final landing and my hour was done. A wonderful experience and I came away very impressed with the simulator fidelity and the A380's performance.
Thanks to those who organized this for me. Perhaps I am now qualified to be Bernard Ziegler's concierge?
PS Several times during the flight, I had a slight feeling of unease, which I couldn't quite pin point. It was only afterwards that I realized it was because I was "flying" without a fastened seat harness!
I’m a PPL with no large aircraft experience, but I used to have an IR and pre-2001, I had several jump seat rides on various commercial aircraft. I had previously flown a 737 NG simulator and was very keen to see how the Airbus differed from the Boeing.
In preparation for the flight, I downloaded and read the appropriate parts of the A330 Flight Crew Training Manual. Following a request for other appropriate information on the “Questions” forum, FlightDetent pointed me to the more useful (from my point of view) A330 Flight Deck and Systems Briefing for Pilots and fantom reminded me to be aware of the inertia of such a large aeroplane.
Yesterday morning, I had a call to say that the A330 was “AOG”, but they were hoping to have it fixed by today.
Then in the afternoon, I had a bad news/good news call. The A330 had not been fixed, but they had arranged a slot for me in an A380 sim!
So today was the day. The cockpit of the A380 is very similar to the A330 I had been studying, with the obvious difference of four power levers and lack of a manual trim wheel plus differences in instrument layout and controls, that were not relevant to the manual flying that I was going to do. The cockpit is smaller than I had expected for the size of the aircraft. I sat in the left seat and after adjusting the seat and armrest, was able to comfortably manipulate the sidestick and the rudder pedals. Normally, I don’t like flying with a stick in my left hand but this felt quite comfortable after a short while, mainly due to the forearm support provided by the armrest.
I did an initial takeoff from Doha, flying manually, but with auto throttle to handle the speed. It was very simple - brakes off, power levers to TOGA, keep straight with the rudder, rotate after the automatic V1 callout, positive ROC - gear up, power levers back to the CLB detent and flaps up in stages at the appropriate speeds. The visual display is very impressive and you very quickly forget you are looking at a synthetic world outside.
I then did some manoeuvring in Normal Law. Medium turns are very easy - deflect the stick slightly until the appropriate bank angle is reached and then let the stick re-centre. No need for back stick to hold the nose-up - trim is applied automatically. The stick does take some getting used to though - there is no feel, other than centreing springs - it is just like a computer joystick. I found holding it with two fingers and my thumb worked well. Applying small movements and waiting to see what happened worked well. Large movements tended to lead to PIOs.
We then repositioned to a 10 mile final on the ILS and I did a manual landing, with auto throttle and flight director. I found it easy to follow the flight director (two green bars like ILS needles and a small white square which represents the aircraft) but when transitioning to outside scene, I had a tendency to over control. The landing was easy - power levers to Idle at the 100’ RA callout, a slight pitch-up to flare at 40’, a slight jolt and a satisfying main wheel rumble, lower the nose wheel and keep straight with the rudder pedals during the rapid deceleration (Autobrake 3).
I remember being surprised by the cockpit height at touchdown when I first saw a landing from the jumpseat in a 777, but I had no problem judging the flare in the A380, mainly due to the height callouts.
We then moved to Hong Kong, where I did a couple of landings (one with an engine failure on approach) and a takeoff, with cloud base at about 1000’ and a crosswind. I’m not sure of the wind velocity, but there was about a 10 degree crab angle. I can’t remember if I kicked off the drift in the flare - I may have done so automatically out of habit, but again the landings were uneventful. One of the landings was done using the HUD, which due to lack of experience, I found more difficult than using the conventional instrument displays.
My instructor then took us up to FL300 and I then tried flying in Direct Law, without auto throttle. This is where all the protections are not available and there is no autopilot or auto-trim available. Reversion to Direct Law would only happen in reality if there were multiple hydraulic or computer failures, but the sim has a special Direct Law demo mode, that avoids having to fail systems and then have ECAM messages to deal with. I found the Direct Law fairly straight-forward, although a little bit more challenging than Normal Law, since the controls are now basically like a conventional aircraft, but again with no force-feedback. Unlike the A330, which has a conventional trim-wheel adjacent to the power levers, manual trimming in the A380 is done with two rocker switches in an inconvenient location at the back of the centre pedestal. In the short time I was trying this, I never did get the aircraft trimmed properly and there were some significant height variations. In the end, I just flew out-of-trim and lived with the stick centreing forces, which were not too bad.
I also flew with airspeed sensor failure. The speed tape on the left of the horizon is replaced with a very straightforward AOA display, with red bars top and bottom and a green zone, and Fast or Slow superimposed as appropriate.
I then did another ILS and landing in Direct Law. Again no problem, apart from the same tendency to over control when flying visually below 200’. Unfortunately at this point, the motion system had been deactivated due to some problem and it was difficult to tell if I had touched down or not, because of the cockpit height during the flare.
fantom, I didn't really notice any significant inertia effects in comparison to my 737 experience. However, I didn't do any aggressive manoeuvering and perhaps the inertia helped damp out my over-controlling near the ground. The only time I thought about the size of the aircraft was during some of the roll PIOs, when I had a vivid image of what they would look like from the ground!
At my request (thanks for the suggestion, FlightDetent), we then did a GPWS escape manoeuvre. While flying at 144 kts on the 07R ILS at Hong Kong, at about 2 miles from the threshold, I turned right and flew directly towards the 2000’ high ridge on Lantau Island. I found this very unnatural and difficult to do. Because we were in approach mode, the GPWS is much more tolerant of ground proximity than in cruise and it wasn’t until the forward view was filled with mountain side, that we got the “TERRAIN TERRAIN” warning followed almost immediately by “PULL-UP PULL-UP”. I pulled the stick back to the stop and applied TOGA thrust and suddenly there was nothing but sky outside and we were climbing out, with full-flaps and gear down, at 104 kts.
I didn't note the rate of climb or the pitch attitude, but it was a very impressive performance.One final landing and my hour was done. A wonderful experience and I came away very impressed with the simulator fidelity and the A380's performance.
Thanks to those who organized this for me. Perhaps I am now qualified to be Bernard Ziegler's concierge?
PS Several times during the flight, I had a slight feeling of unease, which I couldn't quite pin point. It was only afterwards that I realized it was because I was "flying" without a fastened seat harness!
Last edited by India Four Two; 13th Dec 2014 at 05:20. Reason: Expanded on Direct Law reversion, over-controlling and GPWS. PS
Thread Starter
fantom,
Thanks, but I'm too old to make a career of it. I fly exotic aircraft just for fun and for the intellectual challenge. It's even better if I don't have to pay!
Thanks, but I'm too old to make a career of it. I fly exotic aircraft just for fun and for the intellectual challenge. It's even better if I don't have to pay!
Sounds great! Here'something I've been struggling with for ages though. I can only get my hands on a commercial simulator through companies which provide 'experiences' - this means it is expensive (in the hundreds of pounds for a decent amount of time at the controls). So it is worth it for the buzz and experience? Alternatively, I could spend the same money on actually flying a small aircraft instead, for longer!
Thread Starter
So it is worth it for the buzz and experience?
If the money is coming from your flying budget and you are interested, the answer is unequivocally YES. You will learn a lot.
If you do not have any instrument experience, I would recommend spending some time on a decent PC simulator (I use X-Plane) practicing instrument flying, particularly flying an ILS (probably with the autopilot turned on, so you don't have to deal with the unrealistic controls). The flight model doesn't have to be the same as the simulator you will fly, but it helps.
Then, make sure you fly in a full-motion simulator. A fixed base simulator does not give you the inner-ear cues, which add so much to the reality of the experience. I would NOT recommend an Airbus for your first experience. Choose a 737 and fly it like a big 172.
Tell the instructor what you want to do - don't waste your money by boring holes in the sky and/or letting the autopilot follow the magenta line. You can do that at home for free.
I would recommend an initial take off, climb out and practice levelling off, medium turns, climbing and descent. I suggest using the autothrottle initially and turning it off later, if you are managing OK.
Then reposition the simulator onto the final approach and intercept the glideslope, fly the ILS and land, using the VASIS for the last few hundred feet. Get the instructor to prompt you with speeds (and heights for closing the throttles and for the flare) and also ask him to handle the gear and flaps.
Try the approach and landing again a few times, working up to starting from a 30 degree intercept.
Also, don't forget to try the GPWS escape manoeuvre - in a Boeing, you will need to be briefed on the pitch angle and speed to fly.
Finally, if you go with some friends, you can sit or stand in the back and watch their sessions. It helps a lot if you have already seen someone else fly the sim. Just bear in mind that observers in sims sometimes get airsick - my wife did!
Thread Starter
A and C,
That's the difference between flying sims to earn a living and doing it for fun!
That's the difference between flying sims to earn a living and doing it for fun!
Hi, thanks for the response! I haven't been flying at all for about 3 years following a nasty eye injury. Prior to the injury most of my flying was with an instructor in a Pitts Special (aeros), which I loved. My PC simulator saw good use in the couple of years before I got my hands on an actual aircraft... Now my eye has almost completely recovered I am starting to get the urge to do something aviation again.
What you've suggested sounds ideally what I'd like to do in a sim. Full motion was my choice too, for the reasons you have stated.
Think I might give it a go.
Cheers!
What you've suggested sounds ideally what I'd like to do in a sim. Full motion was my choice too, for the reasons you have stated.
Think I might give it a go.
Cheers!
Thread Starter
Think I might give it a go.
I've never flown a Pitts but I did do a lot of aerobatics in Chipmunks in my early days. I must admit I was tempted to try a loop in the A380, but didn't have the nerve! However, I did complete a slow-roll on final in a PC-based Space Shuttle simulator at the Houston Space Center, much to the surprise of the onlookers, and me!
It's been eight months since I asked India Four Two about his experience in an airliner sim, and I'm pleased to say I tried one today - a Boeing 737NG - with a very friendly, relaxed and enthusiastic instructor (although it wasn't a full motion sim - it was a 60 min surprise experience gift from my parents so they chose the type, location, and cost!!).
Firstly, I'm glad it was 60 minutes (not less) as everything was unhurried and I felt relaxed about getting to do some of the stuff I'd wanted. Secondly, the instructor was chatty and chilled out, which I really liked. India Four two suggested:
This pretty much matches what I did, although I didn't use autopilot at all, all the approaches and landings were "flown" by hand including throttles/thrust reversers, rudder and spoilers with reference to PAPIs and looking out the window. Also operated the gear, although this was a tiny bit of a stretch whilst trying to maintain control. The instructor explained everything very well indeed and helped out with flaps and throttles when things got too busy for my total lack of experience! Initial takeoff from Heathrow, then a practice approach /landing into Bournemouth - my choice as I've flown out of there before in various light aircraft. The instructor was happy to try out some slightly more interesting approaches/landings. The old classics of course (St.Maarten, Innsbruck), a night landing into Gatwick and a couple for the fun of it - touch & go at the new Hong Kong airport, followed by an immediate climb right turn and landing into Kai Tak. We tried getting the 737 into St Barts (!) but unsurprisingly it all ended in disaster Pretty much scraped the hill on approach, used the spoilers to try to get the speed down, pulled the nose up in panic and stalled it into the ground.... OK, so we knew it wasn't going to work, but it was fun seeing what would happen! Managed to get on the runway for all the others, with some landings probably bumpier than others. Strangely my best one was the night approach into Gatwick.
Would have liked to try an engine failure on approach, but ran out of time.
Had a really good time, once the headset went on I was completely immersed in the experience and would love to do it again some time in a full motion sim. Would recommend it. Even came out sweating from the concentration!
Turned down the offer of a very expensive photo of me sitting in the left hand seat, and an equally pricey video of the whole experience.....
Firstly, I'm glad it was 60 minutes (not less) as everything was unhurried and I felt relaxed about getting to do some of the stuff I'd wanted. Secondly, the instructor was chatty and chilled out, which I really liked. India Four two suggested:
Tell the instructor what you want to do - don't waste your money by boring holes in the sky and/or letting the autopilot follow the magenta line. You can do that at home for free.
I would recommend an initial take off, climb out and practice levelling off, medium turns, climbing and descent. I suggest using the autothrottle initially and turning it off later, if you are managing OK.
Then reposition the simulator onto the final approach and intercept the glideslope, fly the ILS and land, using the VASIS for the last few hundred feet. Get the instructor to prompt you with speeds (and heights for closing the throttles and for the flare) and also ask him to handle the gear and flaps.
Try the approach and landing again a few times, working up to starting from a 30 degree intercept.
I would recommend an initial take off, climb out and practice levelling off, medium turns, climbing and descent. I suggest using the autothrottle initially and turning it off later, if you are managing OK.
Then reposition the simulator onto the final approach and intercept the glideslope, fly the ILS and land, using the VASIS for the last few hundred feet. Get the instructor to prompt you with speeds (and heights for closing the throttles and for the flare) and also ask him to handle the gear and flaps.
Try the approach and landing again a few times, working up to starting from a 30 degree intercept.
Pretty much scraped the hill on approach, used the spoilers to try to get the speed down, pulled the nose up in panic and stalled it into the ground.... OK, so we knew it wasn't going to work, but it was fun seeing what would happen! Managed to get on the runway for all the others, with some landings probably bumpier than others. Strangely my best one was the night approach into Gatwick.Would have liked to try an engine failure on approach, but ran out of time.
Had a really good time, once the headset went on I was completely immersed in the experience and would love to do it again some time in a full motion sim. Would recommend it. Even came out sweating from the concentration!
Turned down the offer of a very expensive photo of me sitting in the left hand seat, and an equally pricey video of the whole experience.....
Last edited by Blues&twos; 14th Aug 2015 at 21:40.
Thread Starter
Blues&twos,
I was very surprised to see my old thread come to the top again and very pleased to see that you had followed up on my suggestion. You obviously had a good time. Would you agree with my comment about it being like a big 172?
That's why Captains have FOs - to operate the gear! Just say "Postive rate - gear up!"
I've stood on the road on the ridge at St. Barts and watched Twin Otters come over my head on final - I'm not surprised you crashed there!
Do try to do it again in a full-motion sim - the experience is even more immersive - particularly the inner-ear acceleration/deceleration cues during takeoff and landing, and the gear noise and jolt on landing. Maybe an Airbus next time to see the difference?
As an aside, for anyone who is visiting or passing through Singapore and who would like to fly a sim, I should point out that there is a fixed-base 737NG sim at the base of the Singapore Flyer (London Eye equivalent). Quite reasonable prices.
I was very surprised to see my old thread come to the top again and very pleased to see that you had followed up on my suggestion. You obviously had a good time. Would you agree with my comment about it being like a big 172?
Also operated the gear, although this was a tiny bit of a stretch whilst trying to maintain control.
Just say "Postive rate - gear up!"I've stood on the road on the ridge at St. Barts and watched Twin Otters come over my head on final - I'm not surprised you crashed there!
Do try to do it again in a full-motion sim - the experience is even more immersive - particularly the inner-ear acceleration/deceleration cues during takeoff and landing, and the gear noise and jolt on landing. Maybe an Airbus next time to see the difference?
As an aside, for anyone who is visiting or passing through Singapore and who would like to fly a sim, I should point out that there is a fixed-base 737NG sim at the base of the Singapore Flyer (London Eye equivalent). Quite reasonable prices.
Last edited by India Four Two; 15th Aug 2015 at 20:34.
Hi again India Four Two! Yes, I had a really enjoyable hour...I wasn't sure what to expect, but could have happily played around there all day. It was like a "big 172" in some respects, and particularly noticeable ( which fortunately I was expecting) was the momentum of the aircraft during manoeuvres and the spool-up/down lag when thrust settings were changed. Utterly different, of course, from the Pitts! I tended to over-flare at first and float along the runway, but soon sorted that out. Will see if I can save up now for a full-motion hour.
Thread Starter
I'm planning to be in England next summer. I should save up too and then we could have two hours, alternating between PF and PNF! 😀
