How much do you pay per hour?
I fly at Redhill and the 172 is currently £162.50 and the landing fee £20.42.
I guess I should consider buying a share in something.
Anybody know any shares for sale at Redhill ?
I guess I should consider buying a share in something.
Anybody know any shares for sale at Redhill ?
Join Date: Jul 2011
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I pay £134 dual for a Robin HR200, brakes on / off, with no landing fees etc. Seems that's quite good value for money in today's market!
Once I'm PPL'd up, I'm looking at joining a non-equity group that charges £125 p/m with access currently to four aircraft, all at £10 p/h dry.
Once I'm PPL'd up, I'm looking at joining a non-equity group that charges £125 p/m with access currently to four aircraft, all at £10 p/h dry.
Shares seem to be really good value nowadays and it's the only way I can afford to fly the type of aircraft I prefer. There may be insurance difficulty with inital training, but immediately once passed, it's a great way to build up hours and experience with other pilots in the group.
By and large, if you plan on flying more than about 90 minutes per month, shares are almost always cheaper in the long run. Plus the availability usually of better condition and more interesting aeroplanes.
I have two group A shares which are a reasonable comparison.
(1) AA5, £40/month, £90/hr; to rent would be £145/hr. So, break-even at 50 minutes/month! My share cost me £999 so 2:15 per month is still break even with the share cost written off at the end of the year.
(2) S108:£95/month, £80/hr (roughly, we're on tacho). Can't rent one, but let's take a Chipmunk as a rough comparison which would typically cost around £200/hr to rent. So, ignoring the share cost, you break even at about 45 minutes/month, and writing the £3.5k I spent on my share off over a year at about 3:15 per month which is still pretty reasonable, after which it's pure saving.
The risk, that we all have to accept in syndicates however, is of costs running on because you can't sell your share when you want to leave the syndicate. That shouldn't be ignored.
G
Join Date: Oct 2011
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I pay £121 during week day for a c152 hobbs including as many landings i want
Its £125 at weekends
But even at those rates with a mortgage and young children its hard.
Id love a share but simply a) cant find one and b) the deposit will probably take me long time to save
Derby had two but they sold before i could save deposit and no one would lend me it for my "dangerous hobby"
Its £125 at weekends
But even at those rates with a mortgage and young children its hard.
Id love a share but simply a) cant find one and b) the deposit will probably take me long time to save
Derby had two but they sold before i could save deposit and no one would lend me it for my "dangerous hobby"
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Outright ownership will deliver the lowest direct hourly cost and thus the biggest incentive to currency.
All the other options will trade down on that, in return for reducing levels of customer commitment
At the very far end you have pure rental which has zero commitment but the highest hourly cost and the least incentive to flying somewhere
No free lunch.
All the other options will trade down on that, in return for reducing levels of customer commitment
At the very far end you have pure rental which has zero commitment but the highest hourly cost and the least incentive to flying somewhere
No free lunch.
Outright ownership will deliver the lowest direct hourly cost
I've just sold at a knock-down price* the only aeroplane I've ever owned outright. The reality was that I had the time, and to a lesser extent the money, to either look after it - or fly it, but not both.
Given that the fixed costs (hangerage, insurance, CofA) don't change much regardless of how much you fly, and nor to a large extent does a large amount of the time commitment to an aeroplane, I've become a convert to the joys of syndicates over the years.
The big advantage of sole ownership is complete control over the aeroplane, and when I had a lot more spare time I took great advantage of that. But I don't believe it saves you money.
Two substantial advantages of ownership, whether in whole or part, are that you have the ability to have the aeroplane for days, not hours, and that you get to know an aeroplane far better than you ever will as a renter. In my opinion these between you make you a better, happier and safer pilot.
Being a bit of a kleptomaniac, I currently own 2 x 1/8th shares and 1 x 1/3rd share. This gives me the time and fixed cost commitments of about 2/3 of an aeroplane to look after - but a choice of three very different aeroplanes, all of which are massively underflown so I virtually never lack something I'd like to fly, and usually something that'll do what I want for a particular trip.
G
*The original purchase price, less £13 per hour I've logged in it.
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Yes; the direct hourly cost is the same whether you fly 1hr a year or 100.
It is the fixed costs which vary
But it is the variable costs which determine the [dis]incentive to do a particular flight.
On an owned plane, they are
- fuel
- cost of a 50hr check / 50
- cost of a 150hr check (if applicable) / 150
- cost of an engine overhaul / 2000 (or whatever)
- cost of a mag overhaul / 500 (advisable )
Not sure if I left anything out...
The other stuff is all fixed costs, timed parts replacement/maintenance (the big pointless b*gger with EASA) or on-condition maintenance.
It is the fixed costs which vary
But it is the variable costs which determine the [dis]incentive to do a particular flight.
On an owned plane, they are
- fuel
- cost of a 50hr check / 50
- cost of a 150hr check (if applicable) / 150
- cost of an engine overhaul / 2000 (or whatever)
- cost of a mag overhaul / 500 (advisable
)Not sure if I left anything out...
The other stuff is all fixed costs, timed parts replacement/maintenance (the big pointless b*gger with EASA) or on-condition maintenance.
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A good way to significantly reduce costs is to fly from a place that has a club which includes free circuits and landings for members. The fixed membership though - as with synidcates - means the less you fly the more expensive it gets. £20+ landing fees are crippling to GA pilots that only fly in daytime VFR.
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I pay £121 or hour at Tatenhill very reasonable no landing fees and a nice long Tarmac runway there's something about the tires screeching as it touches that sounds good! That's for a 152
Will be changing to the pa 28 though so can take more people up with me
Will be changing to the pa 28 though so can take more people up with me
Join Date: Nov 2010
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£115/hr whilst I am learning, and then when I pass, I buy in to the club syndicate, and I think its £40 per month, and £35/hr wet. Fixed annual depreciation of £500, and I can sell back to the club at any time I want.
As G said, TAMs are the way to go!
As G said, TAMs are the way to go!
My problem is that I'm likely to have to move to different areas of the country 5 times over then next 8 years - more if I'm unlucky. Buying a share isn't an option for me, because of the possibility of not being able to sell it. So it looks as if the only options for me are non-equity or hire - both of which are pretty expensive.
Join Date: Sep 2005
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Hi All - come join our non for profit group at Elstree! PA28-180.
£1500 for a share, £100 a month, £75 wet, a great hourly rate for a 180 hp 4 seater based in London! Great tourer, cruises at 115 kts.
Hatfield Flying Club - Home
Ps - you dont need to sell your share when you leave, we have written contracts -we guarantee to refund the cost of your share!
Long established group, been going since before I was born! Good availability, flew less than 150 hours last year, 100 hours year before. Online booking, fly with yourself/mates, or other club members and share costs even more !
PM or get in touch via website
UAV
£1500 for a share, £100 a month, £75 wet, a great hourly rate for a 180 hp 4 seater based in London! Great tourer, cruises at 115 kts.
Hatfield Flying Club - Home
Ps - you dont need to sell your share when you leave, we have written contracts -we guarantee to refund the cost of your share!
Long established group, been going since before I was born! Good availability, flew less than 150 hours last year, 100 hours year before. Online booking, fly with yourself/mates, or other club members and share costs even more !
PM or get in touch via website
UAV
Join Date: Apr 2001
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Aspiring Pilot Alex:
Clearly someone is subsidising your flying because that doesn't even cover the cost of avgas for one hour in a 172.
NS
I am currently paying £60 per hour (hobbs) wet for a C172 inclusive of home landing fees
NS