Ipad internal GPS reliability
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Ipad internal GPS reliability
I have found it very unreliable when flying, while others have reported it to be fine.
I have just found an interesting comment here
The 3G model of the iPad, in addition to its built-in cellular antenna, also includes an internal GPS. The GPS is completely separate from the 3G data service, so you don’t even have to have an active data plan for the GPS to work. You could buy the 3G model purely for the GPS and never activate the data plan, saving yourself some money. But the on-board iPad GPS was made for ground use, and it’s not very reliable in the air. It has a tendency to drop offline, especially when switching between apps. For this reason, most iPad pilots—even those with a 3G iPad—opt for an external GPS. They are extremely accurate (WAAS-enabled) and very reliable. They also offer free apps that allow you to monitor the GPS’s performance.
which would explain why perhaps some people find theirs OK.
That particular GPS, which seems very hard to buy in the UK (though there are Ebay sellers in the USA charging variously silly postage) also delivers the satellite constellation data, which seems a first for the Iphone/Ipad on which the Apple API blocks that info from apps.
For some reason it cannot be shipped to the UK so Ebay seems to be the only option. I guess it doesn't comply with the stupid ROHS/REACH regs here.
I have just found an interesting comment here
The 3G model of the iPad, in addition to its built-in cellular antenna, also includes an internal GPS. The GPS is completely separate from the 3G data service, so you don’t even have to have an active data plan for the GPS to work. You could buy the 3G model purely for the GPS and never activate the data plan, saving yourself some money. But the on-board iPad GPS was made for ground use, and it’s not very reliable in the air. It has a tendency to drop offline, especially when switching between apps. For this reason, most iPad pilots—even those with a 3G iPad—opt for an external GPS. They are extremely accurate (WAAS-enabled) and very reliable. They also offer free apps that allow you to monitor the GPS’s performance.
which would explain why perhaps some people find theirs OK.
That particular GPS, which seems very hard to buy in the UK (though there are Ebay sellers in the USA charging variously silly postage) also delivers the satellite constellation data, which seems a first for the Iphone/Ipad on which the Apple API blocks that info from apps.
For some reason it cannot be shipped to the UK so Ebay seems to be the only option. I guess it doesn't comply with the stupid ROHS/REACH regs here.
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That unit is available in the UK, bought one from Dual Universal Bluetooth GPS Receiver (Wirelessly Add GPS To Your Devices) Deals, #XGPS150A - Expansys.com UK a couple of weeks back. It has performed very well in the one flight I have managed with it so far.
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I have a iPad1 3G I don't have a subscription ,I just plugged in the 02 sim card supplied when I bought it
I bought a RAM mount off eBay and use it in my heli it's never lost signal yet
I've even used it in a 737 as a passenger at 35,000 ft but you have to hold it next to the window it worked very good
Only drawback i can see is using it in bright sunlight and glare it will need to be placed where you can see it
I bought a RAM mount off eBay and use it in my heli it's never lost signal yet
I've even used it in a 737 as a passenger at 35,000 ft but you have to hold it next to the window it worked very good
Only drawback i can see is using it in bright sunlight and glare it will need to be placed where you can see it
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Peter, I've been using the Bluetooth gns5870 on my iPad with Skydemon and I'm very happy with it. It seems to pick up the signal quickly and hold it well. I've had no comms issues between the two devices.
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Is the 5870 the one you sweep a finger over the front of to turn it on? A friend has got one and it keeps getting turned on while in his bag.
I still haven't found an Ipad compatible bluetooth GPS which has an external antenna socket and an external power socket. I know one can bodge both of those; the former with a piece of foil stuck to the unit with a cable going to a remote passive antenna (which is how car handsfree kits for smartphones do it) and the latter by wiring up direct to the battery terminals.
It will be interesting if this is also a normal NMEA unit which works with non-Apple products (i.e. with 99% of the GPSs out there
).
I still haven't found an Ipad compatible bluetooth GPS which has an external antenna socket and an external power socket. I know one can bodge both of those; the former with a piece of foil stuck to the unit with a cable going to a remote passive antenna (which is how car handsfree kits for smartphones do it) and the latter by wiring up direct to the battery terminals.
It will be interesting if this is also a normal NMEA unit which works with non-Apple products (i.e. with 99% of the GPSs out there
).
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Peter, I too have the GNS 5870. Yes it is the one that you need to swipe to turn on/off however I haven't had the issue you mention about it turning on in my flight bag. It also comes with a cigarette USB charger which ive used successfully in charging/powering both the 5870 and the iPad or iPhone. Obviously using the appropriate cable.
I've been completely satisfied with it however on comparing specs the XGPS model appears to be 64 channel whereas the 5870 appears to be a 32 channel version. Further looking into the theroy it shouldn't make any difference for our application, having a higher channel sensitivity will probably assist in holding a signal under cover.
I have the standard wifi only IPad 2.
I've been completely satisfied with it however on comparing specs the XGPS model appears to be 64 channel whereas the 5870 appears to be a 32 channel version. Further looking into the theroy it shouldn't make any difference for our application, having a higher channel sensitivity will probably assist in holding a signal under cover.
I have the standard wifi only IPad 2.
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Here is the question, I have been pondering the I pad purchase, but, due to possible mis information regarding the GPS receiver within the pad, I was holding off to look into the IPAD3, with 3g and wifi.
Dan, it looks like the bog standard IPAD2, with wifi only, coupled to an external GPS, will do the trick. Am I correct with this assumption?
Also, do all of the apps available, work on the IPAD2, 16g??
Dan, it looks like the bog standard IPAD2, with wifi only, coupled to an external GPS, will do the trick. Am I correct with this assumption?
Also, do all of the apps available, work on the IPAD2, 16g??
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I have a standard ipad3, wifi only, with the Dual GPS. It runs SkyDemon just fine. 
Anyone know whats happening with memory map? Their freebie ipad app seems to have vanished from the app store!
Anyone know whats happening with memory map? Their freebie ipad app seems to have vanished from the app store!
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On the GNS 5870 - mine does not come on unintentionally at all in my flight bag or anywhere else (including jacket pocket). I think there's a bit of a knack to get the finger swipe right - at least on mine. Battery life seems impressive as well.
To be honest, paying out 70 quid or so for the bluetooth device is a pretty small outlay compared to other frightening avionical adventures I have funded in recent years (including that damned Mode-S transponder that nobody except spotters seem to be able to read). I've put a small velcro circle on the GNS so it can sit firmly on the top of the panel with a nice view of the sky. No problems.
At the risk of tempting thread creep, I have to say that my recent purchases of an iPad, Skydemon, the GNS5870 together with the rather neat iPro aviator kneeboard have massively enhanced the enjoyability of my weekend bimbles.
To be honest, paying out 70 quid or so for the bluetooth device is a pretty small outlay compared to other frightening avionical adventures I have funded in recent years (including that damned Mode-S transponder that nobody except spotters seem to be able to read). I've put a small velcro circle on the GNS so it can sit firmly on the top of the panel with a nice view of the sky. No problems.
At the risk of tempting thread creep, I have to say that my recent purchases of an iPad, Skydemon, the GNS5870 together with the rather neat iPro aviator kneeboard have massively enhanced the enjoyability of my weekend bimbles.
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I use the XGPS150 with an IPAD2 and Jeppesen FD, its a great combination, the GPS quickly picks up the position including in the middle of the Atlantic. Unfortunately for us, the aircraft shielding blocks the internal GPS in the IPAD, some colleagues in a different aircraft have no problem with the internal GPS, but i have never succeeded in getting it to find our position in the air.
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I have the GNS5780 and no complaints about its core function, but its ability to turn itself on and drain its battery is becoming a real pain. I went flying on Friday and it had been clipped, face down, against my kneepad in the flightbag.
Even so it had managed to turn itself on. I can always run it off the DC outlet, but it is annoying.
If I was buying another iPad I would deffo go for the 3G/GPS model. My iPhone GPS never seems to fail in the air and most people report the same for the iPad.
Even so it had managed to turn itself on. I can always run it off the DC outlet, but it is annoying.
If I was buying another iPad I would deffo go for the 3G/GPS model. My iPhone GPS never seems to fail in the air and most people report the same for the iPad.
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Interesting feedback 
Many thanks for the Bundlebox tip - that is just brilliant. Not expensive either.
Not so long ago I got ripped off $250 for shipping for a tiny jiffy bag from the USA, because the stupid company there (an avionics distributor) would not ship abroad (didn't know how to, apparently) and used an "international shipping company" for all non-US deliveries
The only issue I see is that some companies won't ship to an address which differs from the credit card billing address, but this clearly isn't common as I have bought many items from the USA directly. It's much more common among UK companies...
When I get the XGPS150 I will report. It should be good because it does EGNOS. Even 32 channels is wasted because there are nowhere near that many sats in the visible sky at any time. What will be interesting is whether it supports more than one bluetooth client concurrently. Most BT GPSs don't.
My current GPS is an old Emtac unit which has a battery but is aircraft powered via a "temporary-attached" 5V power unit, and the antenna comes from a dedicated rooftop active antenna, so it is nice and neat and 100% reliable. But of course it doesn't support any Church of Jobs device...
Many thanks for the Bundlebox tip - that is just brilliant. Not expensive either.
Not so long ago I got ripped off $250 for shipping for a tiny jiffy bag from the USA, because the stupid company there (an avionics distributor) would not ship abroad (didn't know how to, apparently) and used an "international shipping company" for all non-US deliveries
The only issue I see is that some companies won't ship to an address which differs from the credit card billing address, but this clearly isn't common as I have bought many items from the USA directly. It's much more common among UK companies...When I get the XGPS150 I will report. It should be good because it does EGNOS. Even 32 channels is wasted because there are nowhere near that many sats in the visible sky at any time. What will be interesting is whether it supports more than one bluetooth client concurrently. Most BT GPSs don't.
My current GPS is an old Emtac unit which has a battery but is aircraft powered via a "temporary-attached" 5V power unit, and the antenna comes from a dedicated rooftop active antenna, so it is nice and neat and 100% reliable. But of course it doesn't support any Church of Jobs device...
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Maxred. Yes an ipad2 coupled with gns 5870 works perfectly with skydemon or air nav pro. I don't believe the ipad3 is worth the extra money unless your into gaming on the iPad. The performance between the 2 is almost identical as the extra graphics power in the iPad 3 is mostly consumed running the retina display. (google it you'll see what I mean!) From what I've seen of others in the flying club many complain about the internal GPS performance and have since bought gns5870's anyway for confidence reasons more than anything.
It makes most sense to me to buy the ipad2 16gb wifi and gns5870 for the same money as a ipad3 16gb wifi!!
Hope that helps!
It makes most sense to me to buy the ipad2 16gb wifi and gns5870 for the same money as a ipad3 16gb wifi!!
Hope that helps!
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What will be interesting is whether it supports more than one bluetooth client concurrently
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That's a pity.
All the GPS repeaters I see are powered, too. That means this GPS would need to be fixed to the top of the dash, which makes wiring up the power neatly a little difficult.
What is the battery life on this GPS?
All the GPS repeaters I see are powered, too. That means this GPS would need to be fixed to the top of the dash, which makes wiring up the power neatly a little difficult.
What is the battery life on this GPS?
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Peter, the gns 5870 advertise 10 hrs battery life. I've flown a 6 hour round trip with it and it was still going strong so I would believe you could get 8-10 hrs on a charge out of it easily.
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Yes, battery life seems OK. I've got 8 hours out of it after forgetting to switch it off when I landed away. Not a surprise that happened. Switching the GNS5870 off isn't yet on my my shutdown checklist and I could smell bacon coming from the clubhouse.
Only complaint I have is that I wish they called it something else. I've already got another GNS in the cockpit.
Only complaint I have is that I wish they called it something else. I've already got another GNS in the cockpit.