Turboprops
Thread Starter
Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 4
Likes: 0
From: London
Turboprops
Hi all,
I am wondering if there is a pressuized turboprop that can takeoff on a 620 metre grass strip at gross weight or a few hundred pounds under gross weight. I have looked at the PC12 and the TBM 850 but i am not sure if they are able to do so. The reason I am looking for pressuized is that I operate from just out side London and would make a few trips a year to glascow and Sion in Switzerland. But I would be frequently flying in to Bolt head in Devon which has a 620 metre grass strip. Bolt Head is about 150nm from my home strip. I have looked at a cessna caravan and a Kodiak Quest but I am not sure if they would suit the longer trips.
And advice would be greatly appreciated.
I am wondering if there is a pressuized turboprop that can takeoff on a 620 metre grass strip at gross weight or a few hundred pounds under gross weight. I have looked at the PC12 and the TBM 850 but i am not sure if they are able to do so. The reason I am looking for pressuized is that I operate from just out side London and would make a few trips a year to glascow and Sion in Switzerland. But I would be frequently flying in to Bolt head in Devon which has a 620 metre grass strip. Bolt Head is about 150nm from my home strip. I have looked at a cessna caravan and a Kodiak Quest but I am not sure if they would suit the longer trips.
And advice would be greatly appreciated.
Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 2,460
Likes: 0
If the ground is of excellent standard and the grass is short then it should be fine. A TBM, appropriately loaded, routinely goes to sub-500m tarmac runways.
There is a video on youtube showing a Citation on grass, but if you look closely you can see the grass is like a billiard table.
My TB20 gets off in ~400m tarmac but the grass takeoff roll can be anything from 450m to 1000m depending on how bad it is. There is very little data out there on the performance drop for different types of aircraft and dry v. wet grass and short v. long grass etc.
If you have enough dosh to buy a TBM and you can control the strip, then you can do it.
There is a video on youtube showing a Citation on grass, but if you look closely you can see the grass is like a billiard table.
My TB20 gets off in ~400m tarmac but the grass takeoff roll can be anything from 450m to 1000m depending on how bad it is. There is very little data out there on the performance drop for different types of aircraft and dry v. wet grass and short v. long grass etc.
If you have enough dosh to buy a TBM and you can control the strip, then you can do it.
Fleet Manager
Joined: Aug 2006
Aviation Qualifications: CPL
Posts: 7,090
Likes: 2,952
From: Ontario, Canada
I have no experience with the TBM or PC12, (or Piper Meridian), but I suggest that in general, the design requirement for 620 M runway operations, and pressurized higer speed operation are rare in the same turboprop. If possible for any of these aircraft, I opine that you're skating on thin ice, particularly with the insurance company, and one day it's not going to work out well for you.
I have flown a Twin Otter, and Grand Caravan in and out of my 630 M grass runway, but both were light, and conditions favourable. Under some conditions, The Caravan would struggle.
I suggest that your objectives with this are very optimistic. Even if a type will meet this performance in some cases, I doubt it would be under all likely operating conditions, and you're back in that grey zone, where operations are atmospheric, and highly pilot skill dependant.
I have flown a Twin Otter, and Grand Caravan in and out of my 630 M grass runway, but both were light, and conditions favourable. Under some conditions, The Caravan would struggle.
I suggest that your objectives with this are very optimistic. Even if a type will meet this performance in some cases, I doubt it would be under all likely operating conditions, and you're back in that grey zone, where operations are atmospheric, and highly pilot skill dependant.
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 34
Likes: 0
From: Sweden
I don't know what you are looking for in terms of seats, payload etc but an option you may want to look into is the Cessna P210 Silver Eagle (conversion with Rolls Royce 250 turbine) that will meet your criteria of rwy length and range. More info on O&N Aircraft Modifications' home page. Nice plane. Pressurized, deiced and turboprop comfort at lower operating costs than TBMs/PC12s.
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 234
Likes: 24
From: germany
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 1,178
Likes: 0
From: BFS
Thanks inbalance. Interesting reading. It obviously can be done, though as Bose alludes to there are only a limited number of situations where it can.
DO what a poor statement. Half. Is that exactly half, or roughly half? Wind? Temp? Did you measure it?
DO what a poor statement. Half. Is that exactly half, or roughly half? Wind? Temp? Did you measure it?
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 1,129
Likes: 0
From: 18nm NE grice 28ft up
silverknapper
Sorry if it was not a scientific analysis. I was not in the aircraft. It was viewed from the tower. What I was trying to indicate was that operators of this type seem happy to use them on short runways even when there are longer options.
We have had several visits of the type over the year. Weather? This is Scotland. Not that warm. Wind? usually. Sorry I can't give you a link but if you look up EGPT in the AIP it will give you an idea. They are generally off before the windsock on RWY 27 and have no difficulty exiting at "B" with no backtrack.
D.O.
Sorry if it was not a scientific analysis. I was not in the aircraft. It was viewed from the tower. What I was trying to indicate was that operators of this type seem happy to use them on short runways even when there are longer options.
We have had several visits of the type over the year. Weather? This is Scotland. Not that warm. Wind? usually. Sorry I can't give you a link but if you look up EGPT in the AIP it will give you an idea. They are generally off before the windsock on RWY 27 and have no difficulty exiting at "B" with no backtrack.
D.O.
