IMC RATING

[madgav]

Result of second phone call this morning.

My application was received on 15/3 (I knew that). But has not been "assessed" yet .
They are currently working on applications received on 8/3. So it should be done late next week. Will phone back midweek.

I would *really* like to get this before 8/4!!!! Thought I was in good enough time but it looks like it will be running close to the mark

[thing]

You did the examination and sent it off before 8/4 which is what counts, chill bro..... Your reval will be 25 months after the date of the exam.

As I remember mine took about 15 working days, and don't make the mistake I made which is thinking they hadn't sent a new FCL back. I was just about to ring them when it slipped out of my log book where they had hidden it.

[Slopey]

madgav - why all the consternation at the 8th April date? The CAA will add an IMCr onto a JAR PPL up until the 30th June - so no worries.

[madgav]

why all the consternation at the 8th April date?

One word - uncertainty! Yes I know the CAA will be adding IMCRs to JAR-FCL licences until 30/6, no problem there. The uncertainty is regarding any future cut off date for whatever is agreed between CAA/EASA regarding the IMCR. It could be that when the dust settles the 8/4 date may have no significance at all, but for now it's the date that EASA legislation comes into effect so it could potentially be relevant (someone else earlier in this thread also recommended gettting it before this date if possible). It's the date I've been working to from the start and despite the weather, aircraft availability etc beating me on so many occasions I thought I had it done and posted off in plenty good time. Hence the frustration - I'm sure you'll understand I want to give myself the best chance of keeping it post-2014 after all the effort and £££ spent

You did the examination and sent it off before 8/4 which is what counts

Interesting point. Yes I know my skills test was done before 8/4 which is what determines the revalidation date. But is that the date which will appear in my licence? Don't think so as my licence currently carries the date processed by the CAA, for both PPL and NQ.

Anyway sorry for venting a bit. End of a rather frustrating week and this just added to it I suppose..... first outing in the P2002 earlier helped a bit

[BEagle]

Whoever gave this brief at Shoreham seems to have been rather poorly prepared.

You should see another CAA press release in a couple of weeks concerning 'grandfathering'of the IMCR, I understand.

Meanwhile, EASA will begin to consider NPA 2011-16 responses next week. The CAA will be participating; thanks to the tenacity of AOPA, the CAA representative will now be arguing the case for retention of the IMCR under direction from the very top of the Authority.

[Slopey]

I would imagine that EASA would have serious problems in the future insisting on a cut off date of the 8th April when the rating can still be issued onto a JAR licence up to 30th June, which will be an EASA licence when re-issued - can't see how they could make that stick. Doesn't give me anything to worry about to be honest.

The original advice about the 8th April was before the CAA clarification on dates.

But if the move is to push for retention, then it won't matter anyway.

[BEagle]

As far as pilots of EASA aeroplanes are concerned, there are 2 main issues:

1. Grandfathering. The inclusion of IMC privileges in part-FCL licences for those who obtained them before an as yet unspecified date. The CAA has almost finalised proposals for this and will be putting them to EASA 'soon'.

2. Continuance. The inclusion of IMC privileges in part-FCL licences for future pilot licence holders. This is, as far as EASA is concerned, a highly contentious issue. However, AOPA(UK), CAA, IAOPA(EU) and PPL/IR have all proposed a method by which this may be achieved in their comment repsonses to EASA's NPA 2011-16. The comment review team will hold its first meeting in Köln next week; fortunately, 'over regulation' of GA is currently a hot topic at the European Commission and within national aviation authorities, which should influence EASA's rulemakers in terms of accepting the need for regulatory flexibility to take account of the individual national needs of Member States.

Lastly, THERE IS NO 8 APR 2012 CUT-OFF DATE!!!!

[late-joiner]

Is there anything that would prevent the "as yet unspecified date" being defined retrospectively on the "NO 8 APR CUT-OFF DATE" or on any other date before the day that date is promulgated?

[Slopey]

1. Grandfathering. The inclusion of IMC privileges in part-FCL licences for those who obtained them before an as yet unspecified date. The CAA has almost finalised proposals for this and will be putting them to EASA 'soon'.

One would hope that the date would be the last date the IMCr would be attainable on a JAR licence - I don't see how they could argue logically that someone who obtained the IMCr ticket in March could include it, but someone who obtained it in May could not.

[madgav]

"Continuance" is of course what we all want and hope for.
There is however a realistic chance that that may not happen, in which case we have to fall back on "grandfathering". In that case there would be a cut off date. As Slopey says if the CAA are issuing IMCRs on JAR licences until 30th June then one would hope that any cut off date would not be before that, but who knows?

[BEagle]

The as yet unspecified date will not, according to the CAA, be before 30 Jun 2012.

The 'Interim Statement' released recently made that quite clear.

The CAA has lined up its ducks and will be putting its 'conversion report' intentions to EASA any day now.

[Gertrude the Wombat]

any day now

So those of us with an IMCr on a lifetime CAA PPL still don't know what to do.

[madgav]

The as yet unspecified date will not, according to the CAA, be before 30 Jun 2012.

The 'Interim Statement' released recently made that quite clear.

BEagle could you quote where in the Interim Statement it says that? Genuine question - I've re-read it and can't see that but maybe I'm missing something.

What it does say (paragraph 7) is:

It is this proposal, including the specific date - being the last date to obtain an IMC Rating that can be converted to an IR(A)(Restricted) - which is still to be agreed.

and also (paragraph 2):

There is agreement in principle that the priveliges of licence holders that are gained before Regulation (EU) 1178/2011....... ...... applies should as far as possible be preserved.

Isn't that 8th April 2012?

[madgav]

Or are you referrring to page 27 of this presentation (which outlines the CAA's proposal but is subject to EASA approval)?

[S-Works]

Yes it would be illegal to fly without the rating being issued as you dont have a rating....

You could fly with an Instructor or with a safety pilot in VMC with foggles to maintain currency.

[madgav]

I was going to call again but there seemed little point, even before reading the above posts.
Like Will Knot my application was also received on 15th March. Last Friday they were processing applications received on 8th March. And I'm guessing they won't be working tomorrow?

Here and on another forum it's been stated that cut off date for any grandfathering will not be earlier than end June. However it seems that is only what the CAA are proposing, and is subject to agreement with EASA.

[BEagle]

The whole grandfathering / continuance / regulation of GA area is inextricably linked. No-one can give you any written assurances at this stage; however, the EASA has always said that they cannot remove existing privileges under part-FCL. The UK won't adopt part-FCL until 1 Jul 2012, most other Member States are using 8 Apr 2013. Thus UK IMCR privileges gained before part-FCL will, according to the Agency, be safe; however, the 'grandfathering' of those gained subsequently is being debated by the CAA and EASA presently.

The issue of 'grandfathering' v. 'continuance' will depend upon the outcome of the FCL.008 Comment Review Team's work. They should also take into account the EASA Management Board's recent meeting at which they were told emphatically (by all NAAs, the EC and industry, particularly EAS and IAOPA) that their GA regulation is disproportionate.

So those of us with an IMCr on a lifetime CAA PPL still don't know what to do.

Until 7 Apr 2014 at the latest - nothing. National ICAO-compliant PPLs, including any privileges contained therein, may be used to fly EASA aircraft until that date. By which time the outcome of the NPA 2011-16 Opinion will have become law.........probably

[liam548]

[quote=Will Knot;7119400]Just to up-date you all and save you a phone call, I have spoken with the CAA today to enquire about how they're getting on with my IMC rating application.

It was received on the 15th March and is still in the 'to be assessed' pile, possibly swapping stories with madgav's.

quote]



Indeed as per my previous post I have also phoned them today.

They have had mine since the 20th march for my IMC rating adding, no money taken yet from my card.
She also said do not be concerned regarding the mentioned April 8th...

[madgav]

Thanks for the info BEagle
My feeling remains that something decent will eventually result from this mess......

I'm expecting mine to be processed probably sometime next week now.......

[madgav]

Close enough.
Received documentation today, one month and 3 days after passing the flight test.
That should give some idea of the delays at the moment........