Will I ever go solo?
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Wow
Geez--I wish I had the time on my hands to trawl around online forums for opportunities to slang junior pilots!
If you want to be helpful, I sincerely appreciate your input--if not, go busy yourself some other way. Surely you can find a more constructive way to spend your time.
If you want to be helpful, I sincerely appreciate your input--if not, go busy yourself some other way. Surely you can find a more constructive way to spend your time.
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If you want to be helpful, I sincerely appreciate your input--if not, go busy yourself some other way. Surely you can find a more constructive way to spend your time.
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Quinze, I do not believe simply agreeing with you that the schools you have attended and the instructors you have had are 100% to blame is doing you any favours.
Yes you may have been unfortunate in your choices to date and most here will sympathise with you on that score. However, to get to 36hrs and have to come to a forum to be advised to go talk to the CFI does leave one questioning your train of thought.
The intention is not to berate you, but actually to help by simply telling it as it is. You can choose to take the advice in the interest of making progress and getting your ppl, or you can continue to point the finger of blame in other directions, continue to wallow in self pity and ultimately give up, as you have indicated you may do!
I recommend the former for 2 reasons:
1) the years of pleasure you will eventually get will very quickly dilute the experience to date
2) in years to come you will regret quitting.
Best of luck.
BB
Yes you may have been unfortunate in your choices to date and most here will sympathise with you on that score. However, to get to 36hrs and have to come to a forum to be advised to go talk to the CFI does leave one questioning your train of thought.
The intention is not to berate you, but actually to help by simply telling it as it is. You can choose to take the advice in the interest of making progress and getting your ppl, or you can continue to point the finger of blame in other directions, continue to wallow in self pity and ultimately give up, as you have indicated you may do!
I recommend the former for 2 reasons:
1) the years of pleasure you will eventually get will very quickly dilute the experience to date
2) in years to come you will regret quitting.
Best of luck.
BB
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I am not an instructor, but my two cents worth anyway....
Yes, a conversation would appear to be in order - prepare to take a few notes. Your instructor must think something is missing/inadequate in your skills. If you have yet to be trained in engine failures, that would be one important thing! You instructor has the responsibility and opportunity to assure that you are not sent first solo until the conditions align well for you (but cannot guarantee an engine which will run the whole way 'round!)
I would expect that there is a skills checklist which must be filled before first solo - what's not checked in your case?
At this phase in your training, avoid receiving training from multiple instructors.
Good luck, let us know how it works out....
Yes, a conversation would appear to be in order - prepare to take a few notes. Your instructor must think something is missing/inadequate in your skills. If you have yet to be trained in engine failures, that would be one important thing! You instructor has the responsibility and opportunity to assure that you are not sent first solo until the conditions align well for you (but cannot guarantee an engine which will run the whole way 'round!)
I would expect that there is a skills checklist which must be filled before first solo - what's not checked in your case?
At this phase in your training, avoid receiving training from multiple instructors.
Good luck, let us know how it works out....
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Quince
Come on
are you one of these people who blame everything but yourself for your own mistakes ??
You posted a problem in a very vague fashion and many here with the lack of detail you supplied had to second guess the problem.
You then jump late back in the forum and warble on about the nature of the airfield again without supplying any detail of what your problems have been in not being sent solo after 36 hrs.
What are we supposed to do ? Gaze into a crystal ball!
Have you discussed the instructors you have had? Have you detailed your path to 36 hrs. Have you passed on conversations where problems with your flying or attitude have been discussed? Have you explained why you have not brought this up with the CFI? Have you discussed reasons why you feel the club are rip off merchants? NO NO NO !
We are all still clueless to the extent that some of us are at a loss as to why you are here?
So now your only response is to post being offensive to those who have tried to help!
GROW UP!
Pace
Come on
are you one of these people who blame everything but yourself for your own mistakes ??You posted a problem in a very vague fashion and many here with the lack of detail you supplied had to second guess the problem.
You then jump late back in the forum and warble on about the nature of the airfield again without supplying any detail of what your problems have been in not being sent solo after 36 hrs.
What are we supposed to do ? Gaze into a crystal ball!
Have you discussed the instructors you have had? Have you detailed your path to 36 hrs. Have you passed on conversations where problems with your flying or attitude have been discussed? Have you explained why you have not brought this up with the CFI? Have you discussed reasons why you feel the club are rip off merchants? NO NO NO !
We are all still clueless to the extent that some of us are at a loss as to why you are here?
So now your only response is to post being offensive to those who have tried to help!
GROW UP!
Pace
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However, there are some people who will never never never go solo. And some have gone solo who should have been advised to take up golf.
I have had in a long career five students, two women, three men, who seem to be missing a circuit in the brain. After struggling with a father and son, aged 40 and 20 respectively, who seemed to be deteriorating over a weeks course, I asked the highly experienced Chief Flying Instructor to fly with them. I was beginning to think it was my instructing at fault! CFI told me that these two individuals would/should never go solo, and it was possibly hereditary!
Another chap did go solo, and frightened us on a regular basis, and was finally asked to give it up. And the two women displayed serious lack of concentration. On the ground as well as in the air. Dear me.
I have had in a long career five students, two women, three men, who seem to be missing a circuit in the brain. After struggling with a father and son, aged 40 and 20 respectively, who seemed to be deteriorating over a weeks course, I asked the highly experienced Chief Flying Instructor to fly with them. I was beginning to think it was my instructing at fault! CFI told me that these two individuals would/should never go solo, and it was possibly hereditary!
Another chap did go solo, and frightened us on a regular basis, and was finally asked to give it up. And the two women displayed serious lack of concentration. On the ground as well as in the air. Dear me.
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Quinze - first of all I can't believe the level of hostility that some people are directing at you. OK so you're a new poster and might not have provided in-depth analysis regarding your problem and it has rung alarm bells with some people, but you should be given the benefit of the doubt!
Anyway - back to your problem. I'd be interested to know more about your previous school. I noticed you posted on another thread about it and some people are even suggesting that they weren't qualified to teach GA! (if thats the same school)
Even if they were - don't forget that your new school has only seen you for 8 hours. They have to satisfy themselves that you're OK to fly before sending you solo. They haven't been involved in your development up to this point. If your previous school was as ropey as you say, then they may have doubts about the quality of training you have received. Secondly, its not a good idea to have several instructors (especially in just 8 hours). Find one you like and stick to them!
However, there are a few comments I agree with.
1. If you're not happy about something, go and ask. Make a noise! Its your cash and its expensive enough at the best of times.
2. Learning to fly is a very proactive discipline. You should not expect to be prompted to do your ground exams. You know you have to do them. If they do ground school, then sign up. If they don't, get on and do it yourself or find someone that can teach you. You must learn to take decisions yourself. When you're on your own at 5000ft and the engines developing a problem, there's no one to hold your hand!
Hope thats slightly more helpful than some of the other responses you've had.
Anyway - back to your problem. I'd be interested to know more about your previous school. I noticed you posted on another thread about it and some people are even suggesting that they weren't qualified to teach GA! (if thats the same school)
Even if they were - don't forget that your new school has only seen you for 8 hours. They have to satisfy themselves that you're OK to fly before sending you solo. They haven't been involved in your development up to this point. If your previous school was as ropey as you say, then they may have doubts about the quality of training you have received. Secondly, its not a good idea to have several instructors (especially in just 8 hours). Find one you like and stick to them!
However, there are a few comments I agree with.
1. If you're not happy about something, go and ask. Make a noise! Its your cash and its expensive enough at the best of times.
2. Learning to fly is a very proactive discipline. You should not expect to be prompted to do your ground exams. You know you have to do them. If they do ground school, then sign up. If they don't, get on and do it yourself or find someone that can teach you. You must learn to take decisions yourself. When you're on your own at 5000ft and the engines developing a problem, there's no one to hold your hand!
Hope thats slightly more helpful than some of the other responses you've had.
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When you're on your own at 5000ft and the engines developing a problem ...
It's when it happens at 500ft that it gets interesting.
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The thing this thread has highlighted is the lengths some training outfits will go to too rip people off.
I was fortunate enough to be taught by an honest man who sent me off on my own after 4 and a half hours (honest enough to say "I don't think you'll kill yourself") and have only met one rip-off merchant since then in the last 35 years of flying.
I can say rip-off because that was what it was and no getting away from the fact.
I spent 5 hours all in the circuit with this guy without once being allowed to complete a full circuit without him interfering in some way i.e. adjusting throttle/trim, taking control without warning and releasing back to me without warning and a multitude of other little things that got me doubting my own abilities.
The only reason I was undertaking this training was to gain a microlight rating on my NPPL which I'd gotten in exchange for my old lifetime CAA PPL
I didn't doubt my capabilities as I'd just done a GST to revalidate and was flying back and forth to this training school in my Tomahawk.
Initially, I thought a couple of hours would do it but boy was I mistaken and how on earth did I allow myself to get sucked in to this instructor's guile and spell.
I'd understand if I was converting to flexwing but it was a simple 3-axis type that if it had any unusual aspects to it's performance it was it's tendency, like many 3-axis microlights, to float on, something that is easy to contend with after a couple of landings.
So, from my experience, it can be easy to become beguiled by an instructor if you're not careful and even this sly old fox got caught out.
Went elsewhere a couple of months later and got my rating after 2 hours instruction which mostly involved bimbling around for 90 minutes doing some local sightseeing after my instructor had satisfied himself of my proficiency in the first half hour.
I don't know where to begin with identifying good instructors/flying schools from the rip-off merchants but asking questions at an early stage and keep on asking them has got to be a sensible approach to this issue.
I was fortunate enough to be taught by an honest man who sent me off on my own after 4 and a half hours (honest enough to say "I don't think you'll kill yourself") and have only met one rip-off merchant since then in the last 35 years of flying.
I can say rip-off because that was what it was and no getting away from the fact.
I spent 5 hours all in the circuit with this guy without once being allowed to complete a full circuit without him interfering in some way i.e. adjusting throttle/trim, taking control without warning and releasing back to me without warning and a multitude of other little things that got me doubting my own abilities.
The only reason I was undertaking this training was to gain a microlight rating on my NPPL which I'd gotten in exchange for my old lifetime CAA PPL
I didn't doubt my capabilities as I'd just done a GST to revalidate and was flying back and forth to this training school in my Tomahawk.
Initially, I thought a couple of hours would do it but boy was I mistaken and how on earth did I allow myself to get sucked in to this instructor's guile and spell.
I'd understand if I was converting to flexwing but it was a simple 3-axis type that if it had any unusual aspects to it's performance it was it's tendency, like many 3-axis microlights, to float on, something that is easy to contend with after a couple of landings.
So, from my experience, it can be easy to become beguiled by an instructor if you're not careful and even this sly old fox got caught out.
Went elsewhere a couple of months later and got my rating after 2 hours instruction which mostly involved bimbling around for 90 minutes doing some local sightseeing after my instructor had satisfied himself of my proficiency in the first half hour.
I don't know where to begin with identifying good instructors/flying schools from the rip-off merchants but asking questions at an early stage and keep on asking them has got to be a sensible approach to this issue.
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Well, here's my story...
I went 24 frustrating hours before I went solo. I think when I got to 14-15 hours I was getting worried and asked my instructor what I was doing wrong. He told me to persevere, I was nearly there and some time soon everything would just 'click'. Well it didn't seem to, and I was seriously considering throwing the towel in at 20 hours.
But then I had some business in the US, and found a flight school over there. I just went flying with an instructor for a couple of hours, he told me where to fly and talked on the radio. I just enjoyed the controls and flying somewhere for lunch.
I got back to the UK and a couple of hours later I was solo. In my mind the hours and hours of frustrating circuit practice getting nowhere were the problem. I'd suggest to anyone having problems, just to ask their instructor to take them "flying", fly somewhere, land away for a break. Come back refreshed and motivated.
I went 24 frustrating hours before I went solo. I think when I got to 14-15 hours I was getting worried and asked my instructor what I was doing wrong. He told me to persevere, I was nearly there and some time soon everything would just 'click'. Well it didn't seem to, and I was seriously considering throwing the towel in at 20 hours.
But then I had some business in the US, and found a flight school over there. I just went flying with an instructor for a couple of hours, he told me where to fly and talked on the radio. I just enjoyed the controls and flying somewhere for lunch.
I got back to the UK and a couple of hours later I was solo. In my mind the hours and hours of frustrating circuit practice getting nowhere were the problem. I'd suggest to anyone having problems, just to ask their instructor to take them "flying", fly somewhere, land away for a break. Come back refreshed and motivated.
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quinze....check the syllabus to see that you have been passed on all the pre solo requirements.
Go and talk directly to the CFI. I'm interested in the fact you havent done engine failures yet. When you are asked to learn things before lessons , make a point of getting on top of memory items and actively demonstrating your knowledge.
You should get a recommendation regarding the best instructor for you, and stick with that instructor.
Make a point of getting an effective debrief after each flight, and habbitually debrief yourself.
I was 17 hours to solo, and I knew I could have gone earlier, but the young instructor at the time was new at it, and was just being carefull.
Make sure its not attitudinal, but I doubt that. What is your age may I ask?
Go and talk directly to the CFI. I'm interested in the fact you havent done engine failures yet. When you are asked to learn things before lessons , make a point of getting on top of memory items and actively demonstrating your knowledge.
You should get a recommendation regarding the best instructor for you, and stick with that instructor.
Make a point of getting an effective debrief after each flight, and habbitually debrief yourself.
I was 17 hours to solo, and I knew I could have gone earlier, but the young instructor at the time was new at it, and was just being carefull.
Make sure its not attitudinal, but I doubt that. What is your age may I ask?
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First, yes talk to the CFI.
Second, get all the pre solo stuff out of the way - exams the school needs before solo, EFATO etc.
Then I go with
. I had a student I had inherited with over 60 hours, had flown with other instructors including the deputy CFI and all these had recommended he pack in took him out of the circuit and did some GH with just a few circuits at the end of each trip and he got solo OK.
Good luck
Second, get all the pre solo stuff out of the way - exams the school needs before solo, EFATO etc.
Then I go with
Also by the time I had about 4 hrs in the circuit I asked to go and do some GH and a bit of basic Nav when I went back to the circuit I managed 3 unaided circuits and to my surprise the FI jumped out and let me solo
Good luck
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With a good instructor, maybe we would all solo in less than a specified number of hours. But a range of factors come into it (weather, airfield, instructor, student, lesson frequency, ....) What is most important is not the hours but the reasons.
Some suggestions:
- Stick with one instructor. They will be able to monitor your progress better and understand which areas are going well and which need work. Everyone has their own style and if you change instructors you are going to get lots of different advice.
- Ask for a list of skills required to solo and check off the ones that are complete. Then make sure that future lessons are focussed on the areas you still need to work on.
- Move on with other skills like navigation. It will improve your confidence in your flying (there's more than just circuits) and take the pressure off. Going around and around in the circuit can be demoralising.
- After a lesson, ask the instructor to spend time with you going over what needs to be improved and what to prepare for next time. That way you can make the best use of your lessons.
Stick with it, and good luck. I started flying lessons 15 years ago, was in a similar situation to you, and gave it up. Two years ago I went back to it, had a completely different experience (even if I was not the speediest to solo!) and have my PPL.
Some suggestions:
- Stick with one instructor. They will be able to monitor your progress better and understand which areas are going well and which need work. Everyone has their own style and if you change instructors you are going to get lots of different advice.
- Ask for a list of skills required to solo and check off the ones that are complete. Then make sure that future lessons are focussed on the areas you still need to work on.
- Move on with other skills like navigation. It will improve your confidence in your flying (there's more than just circuits) and take the pressure off. Going around and around in the circuit can be demoralising.
- After a lesson, ask the instructor to spend time with you going over what needs to be improved and what to prepare for next time. That way you can make the best use of your lessons.
Stick with it, and good luck. I started flying lessons 15 years ago, was in a similar situation to you, and gave it up. Two years ago I went back to it, had a completely different experience (even if I was not the speediest to solo!) and have my PPL.
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In my mind the hours and hours of frustrating circuit practice getting nowhere were the problem. I'd suggest to anyone having problems, just to ask their instructor to take them "flying", fly somewhere, land away for a break. Come back refreshed and motivated.
In this country there is such heavy emphasis on banging circuits. The student is mostly mentally overloaded and sweating like a pig, and learning very little.
Much better to do a landing (or a go-around) and then fly off somewhere for 10 minutes, relax, let the events sink in, then come back for another one.
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Not having flown for a month I went out today & did 3 touch & go, all mediocre, bouncy,too long, went out the circuit for 30mins & chucked it about a bit, came back & did two 3 point greasers. 
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Crash, it's such a perishable skill. I haven't flown for over a month and a half in my aircraft now and all the little routines, quirks and skills will be if not lost, at least half forgotten.
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carb heat on during go around
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Had a Cessna full up with friends and thought the climbout was anaemic to say the least - friction lock not on and the throttle had vibrated out... I often forget to put up flap up after takeoff and I've even almost forgotten to put the gear down when I was overloaded on a checkride (no less)... And this is when I'm in practice and have flown recently
When I get my plane back from annual next week I immediately need to fly a xcountry 2 hrs to get it back home. After the test flight (to see that everything works properly) I'll make sure to do a couple of circuits to nail the visual references, speeds, etc before I set off.
When I get my plane back from annual next week I immediately need to fly a xcountry 2 hrs to get it back home. After the test flight (to see that everything works properly) I'll make sure to do a couple of circuits to nail the visual references, speeds, etc before I set off.