Making blind calls to "Traffic"
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Joined: Jul 2010
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From: USA
Making blind calls to "Traffic"
The radio convention looks like this:
[Location] Smallville Traffic
[Aircraft Type / Callsign] Cessna 924AB
[Position / Intentions] Final runway 22 - for touch and go
[Location] Smallville
Do we add location to the end of the transmission in case the beginning gets clipped?
[Location] Smallville Traffic
[Aircraft Type / Callsign] Cessna 924AB
[Position / Intentions] Final runway 22 - for touch and go
[Location] Smallville
Do we add location to the end of the transmission in case the beginning gets clipped?
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 5,658
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From: Canada
The radio convention looks like this:
[Location] Smallville Traffic
[Aircraft Type / Callsign] Cessna 924AB
[Position / Intentions] Final runway 22 - for touch and go
[Location] Smallville
Do we add location to the end of the transmission in case the beginning gets clipped?
[Location] Smallville Traffic
[Aircraft Type / Callsign] Cessna 924AB
[Position / Intentions] Final runway 22 - for touch and go
[Location] Smallville
Do we add location to the end of the transmission in case the beginning gets clipped?
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 33
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From: Los Angeles
Yes in case the first part is stepped on, and also because the same ctaf frequency can be used at multiple fields that are within radio range of each other. There are a few places in socal like this...
Joined: Nov 2010
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From: Tamworth, UK / Nairobi, Kenya
There's places with multiple airports on the same frequency all over the place, not just in California.
I think there'a another reason, not quite so obvious, and that is it defines the message as being over. You start with location, end with location. If you're listening, you won't (shouldn't) transmit until you've heard the ending location. Not sure how valuable that really is, but maybe.
I think there'a another reason, not quite so obvious, and that is it defines the message as being over. You start with location, end with location. If you're listening, you won't (shouldn't) transmit until you've heard the ending location. Not sure how valuable that really is, but maybe.
Joined: Oct 2005
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From: USA
Aeronautical Information Manual (AIM) 4-1-9:
6. Recommended self-announce phraseologies: It should be noted that aircraft operating to or from another nearby airport may be making self-announce broadcasts on the same UNICOM or MULTICOM frequency. To help identify one airport from another, the airport name should be spoken at the beginning and end of each self-announce transmission.
Joined: Jun 2005
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From: Iraq and other places
Adding this is very important. I once flew a circuit, and onto finals, at an airport in Texas with CTAF; just after I made each call, the same call was made by another aircraft! When he called finals just after I did, and we could still not see each other, I went around. He was still nowhere to be found, and it was discovered that he was in the circuit at another airport miles away that happened to have the same runway; he had not been calling out the airport name 
Joined: Oct 2005
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From: USA
Remember to look for traffic with your eyes, and not ears.
Far too many try to let the radio do their traffic scan for them.
One of my biggest annoyances on the radio is the pilot that, upon arriving at the end of the runway, announced "Mercer area traffic, Skyhawk Eight Five Niner Xray Foxtrot holding short of runway one six, any inbound traffic please advise."
Far too many try to let the radio do their traffic scan for them.
One of my biggest annoyances on the radio is the pilot that, upon arriving at the end of the runway, announced "Mercer area traffic, Skyhawk Eight Five Niner Xray Foxtrot holding short of runway one six, any inbound traffic please advise."
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Joined: Aug 2006
Aviation Qualifications: CPL
Posts: 7,090
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From: Ontario, Canada
I completely agree with Guppy, VFR stands for Visual Flight Rules, not vocal flight rules.
That said, to respond to the original question, yes, as a matter of practice, when I transmit, I make the name of the airport the last think I say. It is the most important part of my transmission, and I want it to be memorable for other pilots in that area.
That said, to respond to the original question, yes, as a matter of practice, when I transmit, I make the name of the airport the last think I say. It is the most important part of my transmission, and I want it to be memorable for other pilots in that area.
Joined: Jun 2002
Aviation Qualifications: PPL
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From: Nanaimo (CAC8)
The airfield name is also important so that someone else can reply with:
Whoops 
At least it wasn't Calgary Tower.
NJK, wrong frequency, this is Okotoks, not Black Diamond
At least it wasn't Calgary Tower.
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From: Ontario, Canada
The "proper" (whatever that is) use of the radio in the aircraft seems be taught much differently now, than the "old days". When I learned to use the radio (mid 70's), we were taught to convey what needed to be said, including the pertinent information, without un-necessary, or prolonged transmissions, or non-essential information. Certianly no chatter, other than frequencies assigned for that purpose.
More recently ('cause I now hear it all the time), someone is teaching that the aircraft radio can be used like the internet, to convey large amounts of often poorly thought out, and only vaguly relevent information.
While taking helicopter training a few years back, it was taught to me that at apparently geograhpically random places in uncontrolled airspace, one should suddenly broadcast into the airwaves, one's type, altitude, direction, and destination. The appropriate timing of these transmissions seemed to be as predictable to me as my cat suddenly needing to be in another room.
Upon my checking with Flight Service as to their thoughts on this practice, I was promptly told, by a well practiced specialist, (as I related here) VFR stands for Visual Flight Rules, not Vocal Flight Rules. Their very real basis for this position on the subject is that the transmissions are being made on the prevailing FLight Service frequency for the area, and simply tying up their much more appropriate use of their frequency.
Thus, I revert to the "old" way of doing things on the radio. I watch out a lot, and transmit a little, at appropriate times relative to geography, airspace, and traffic patterns.
But, if I need to transmit, telling people where I am, is of the greatest importance to me. I want to attract local attention by telling people where I am first, and inform the person who was late to hear my transmission, by telling people where I am last as well...
More recently ('cause I now hear it all the time), someone is teaching that the aircraft radio can be used like the internet, to convey large amounts of often poorly thought out, and only vaguly relevent information.
While taking helicopter training a few years back, it was taught to me that at apparently geograhpically random places in uncontrolled airspace, one should suddenly broadcast into the airwaves, one's type, altitude, direction, and destination. The appropriate timing of these transmissions seemed to be as predictable to me as my cat suddenly needing to be in another room.
Upon my checking with Flight Service as to their thoughts on this practice, I was promptly told, by a well practiced specialist, (as I related here) VFR stands for Visual Flight Rules, not Vocal Flight Rules. Their very real basis for this position on the subject is that the transmissions are being made on the prevailing FLight Service frequency for the area, and simply tying up their much more appropriate use of their frequency.
Thus, I revert to the "old" way of doing things on the radio. I watch out a lot, and transmit a little, at appropriate times relative to geography, airspace, and traffic patterns.
But, if I need to transmit, telling people where I am, is of the greatest importance to me. I want to attract local attention by telling people where I am first, and inform the person who was late to hear my transmission, by telling people where I am last as well...
Joined: Aug 2007
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From: Plumpton Green
AIC:
The frequency assigned is 135.475 MHz and is known as 'SAFETYCOM'. Pilots should be aware that SAFETYCOM is not a UK equivalent of the UNICOM system used in the United States, and does not work in the same way.
...
Phraseology is to comply with the requirements of CAP 413 (Radiotelephony Manual) Chapter 4, Section 6.2.2
...
It is important that RTF is concise and unambiguous, and should include the name of the aerodrome
The frequency assigned is 135.475 MHz and is known as 'SAFETYCOM'. Pilots should be aware that SAFETYCOM is not a UK equivalent of the UNICOM system used in the United States, and does not work in the same way.
...
Phraseology is to comply with the requirements of CAP 413 (Radiotelephony Manual) Chapter 4, Section 6.2.2
...
It is important that RTF is concise and unambiguous, and should include the name of the aerodrome
Joined: Sep 2006
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From: Scotland
Yes we do have standards, not necesarily better though. Say airfield name before & after is good practice, in fact I'd say essential. & what is wrong with "over"? The mil still use it, like what I was tort.
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 3,218
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From: USA
"Borton Traffic, G-ABCD, FINAL Runway 09" seems pretty clear to me.
If someone is going to use their callsign, why not include the aircraft type? I can't read your registration number from a mile or two away, but I can tell what type of aircraft you are. If three airplanes end up competing for the same spot of airspace, one a Cessna Skyhawk, one Piper Warrior, and one a Learjet, G-ABCD won't tell me much. If instead, I hear "Borton traffic, Skyhawk G-ABCD, three mile final, runway 09, Borton," I have a much better idea of what type aircraft is calling, where it is (three mile final as opposed to short final or ten mile final), and what to look for.
Some get a little too carried away, especially with accurate GPS indications, and one hears call-outs every half-mile from thirty miles away (Warrior 86X 11.3 miles west, etc). It's useful to know, however, if one is on quarter mile final, rather than a fifteen mile straight-in.
There's certainly such thing as too much verbiage, and that's not good either. The pilot who call in, "Yadalahooie area traffic, Cessna skyhawk November Niner Six Foxtrot Bandana Ringworm is about sixteen miles west of Hansons Pond near the old grain silo, heading more or less east. We're about eight thousand feet, planning on landing on runway six, and we're figuring on flying over the field for a left downwind to six. My sign is Leo, I'm wearing a green plaid shirt with black shorts, my turn-ons include cats that don't shed, lawn mowers, and flat beer. I like long walks in the rain, refried beans, and the color blue. Any traffic in the area, please advice, Yadalahooie." Perhaps a little much.
Joined: Oct 2010
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From: Lisbon
If someone is going to use their callsign, why not include the aircraft type? I can't read your registration number from a mile or two away, but I can tell what type of aircraft you are. If three airplanes end up competing for the same spot of airspace, one a Cessna Skyhawk, one Piper Warrior, and one a Learjet, G-ABCD won't tell me much. If instead, I hear "Borton traffic, Skyhawk G-ABCD, three mile final, runway 09, Borton," I have a much better idea of what type aircraft is calling, where it is (three mile final as opposed to short final or ten mile final), and what to look for.
You should know, as a professional pilot, that the purpose of having standard phrases is to achieve standardisation and increased comprehension. Tenerife in 1977 taught us the importance of that.
Anyway, as you said in an earlier post, you should be looking for the traffic with your eyes, not your ears.
As a 'non aligned' person, I find that the radio phraseology in the UK and USA is different, but works well in each domain, so long as people respect the mandated phrases.
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 215
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From: Hampshire, UK
The appropriate use of aircraft type is very sensible and CAP413 already states this:
However, as ever, brevity is of the essence, hence "Cessna G-ABCD" is useful, but "Rheims Cessna F152 Aerobat G-ABCD" may be deemed a little too much info on every call
Section 2. General Phraseology
Aircraft Callsign Prefixes
Where no confusion is likely to occur and the additional information may help the controller or other pilots, the name of the aircraft manufacturer, the aircraft model, or the aircraft category, e.g. 'Helicopter', may be used as a prefix to the registration e.g. 'Harvard G-ABCD'
Aircraft Callsign Prefixes
Where no confusion is likely to occur and the additional information may help the controller or other pilots, the name of the aircraft manufacturer, the aircraft model, or the aircraft category, e.g. 'Helicopter', may be used as a prefix to the registration e.g. 'Harvard G-ABCD'