Indifferent partner
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Indifferent partner
A query to all you married/partnered pilots out there.
I am happily married for 10 yrs to a wife that has always embraced my hobbies/interests. I don't mean that she actively involved herself, (neither of us would want that) but she has always been interested whenever I discussed my activities. That is until I started my PPL training a couple of months back. She has always been aware of my passion for flying and knew that some day I was going to "follow the dream" as they say. But, she just doesn't want to know. It's not the money, we've been through that. Tonight I was telling her about my lesson and how breathtaking the sight of the runway lights were on approach to landing ( my first time ever seeing them) but she was simply not interested.
This is a bit disappointing and I won't get hung up over it. I just wonder if she is listening to friends etc. who repeatedly speak of how "mad I am getting into one of those things, only one engine, too small blah,blah,blah."
Is she simply convinced that I've chosen a dangerous hobby?
Any insight would be a big help.
I am happily married for 10 yrs to a wife that has always embraced my hobbies/interests. I don't mean that she actively involved herself, (neither of us would want that) but she has always been interested whenever I discussed my activities. That is until I started my PPL training a couple of months back. She has always been aware of my passion for flying and knew that some day I was going to "follow the dream" as they say. But, she just doesn't want to know. It's not the money, we've been through that. Tonight I was telling her about my lesson and how breathtaking the sight of the runway lights were on approach to landing ( my first time ever seeing them) but she was simply not interested.
This is a bit disappointing and I won't get hung up over it. I just wonder if she is listening to friends etc. who repeatedly speak of how "mad I am getting into one of those things, only one engine, too small blah,blah,blah."
Is she simply convinced that I've chosen a dangerous hobby?
Any insight would be a big help.
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You could always do the unthinkable and ask her ...
Seriously though, I am not the most experienced aviator by any means but I have already accepted that the joys of flying are simply not understood by most people, especially after you tell them how much you just spent for the privilige of sitting in that cramped, cold and often damp space for an hour! If it's any consolation, most of us on here know exactly what you mean!
Seriously though, I am not the most experienced aviator by any means but I have already accepted that the joys of flying are simply not understood by most people, especially after you tell them how much you just spent for the privilige of sitting in that cramped, cold and often damp space for an hour! If it's any consolation, most of us on here know exactly what you mean!
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You fly in a small, single engined aircraft? My God....... 
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Pre-Divorced !
Years ago, when I started gliding, members of the club were making polite conversation and asking about my domestic situation. "I'm recently separated" I told them. "oh, pre-divorced" came the reply. Since then I have come to understand that it is men, not ladies who find cars and aviation sexy. Even my girlfriend, who follows F1 and gets the off-side rule was less than impressed with our first flight. Far from the scene out of the film 'The Aviator' which I had imagined, our first flight ended with an abort 2/3 of the way up the runway and when we finally did get aloft, she filled an entire sick bag. (not sure if was my flying, the turbulance or just being over Northampton)
While your lady is not actively discouraging you, take this as a ringing endorsement, and save your runway light moments for this forum. Yes they are just beautiful
While your lady is not actively discouraging you, take this as a ringing endorsement, and save your runway light moments for this forum. Yes they are just beautiful
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When I was going through my PPL my ex-wife didn't want to know what I was doing and certainly did not sympathise with my flying achievements - NFT,GFT etc
My view is that she found flying is expensive, so I was spending money that she felt I should be spending on us (ie her priorities)
Secondly flying is a selfish activity. Although she may support you in other activities, women find flying a really difficult rival - they might be able to deal with an affair, but they don't know how to deal with an obsession like flying.
The indifference is a warning sign for you. You do need to talk it out now, otherwise you will find she will treat your flying as a cause for divorce - not incompatibilty but adultery!!
I've been divorced for 10 years as a result of misunderstanding women's attitudes. I recommend getting it sorted asap.
My view is that she found flying is expensive, so I was spending money that she felt I should be spending on us (ie her priorities)
Secondly flying is a selfish activity. Although she may support you in other activities, women find flying a really difficult rival - they might be able to deal with an affair, but they don't know how to deal with an obsession like flying.
The indifference is a warning sign for you. You do need to talk it out now, otherwise you will find she will treat your flying as a cause for divorce - not incompatibilty but adultery!!
I've been divorced for 10 years as a result of misunderstanding women's attitudes. I recommend getting it sorted asap.
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Infifferent anyone!
Mur007 has it spot on. I always thought flying was the stuff of romantic heroism; the epitome of man's timeless struggle against the last unconquered element. So when I started my PPL I sallied forth to the pub ready to hold discourse with admiring friends on my joining the brotherhood of bold aviators. To my shock and surprise, attention wandered, eyes glazed, gazes became less admiring, if not actually averted and, to put it bluntly, they were bored.
But I don't think it need be a case of divorce.
But I don't think it need be a case of divorce.
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A small group of people are totally enthralled by aviation, and the idea of leaving earth.
My experience has been that a vast majority have feelings about the hole thing, which range from ambivilence, to down right hostility. You can't change that. Perhaps your wife will grow you appreciate aviation, but beware that pressing it, could make it worse. If negative experiences are expected, that will be the percetion, and it's really easy to perceive aviation negatively, if that's what you are expecting.
Hopefully you can plan a trip which is so certain of success, that it will serve to demonstrate the fun, without the fear. Do not demonstrate steep turns to her!
Try for an aviation based social event to go to together. Particularly, if she can meet other wives, ideally happy flying wives. Ideal would be to team up with another pilot, who is extremely confident with his four place aircraft, take your wife on a two couple's trip. The other more experienced wife might help her to see the fun in the whole endevour. Take care though that nothing goes wrong. The negative can be worse that the postive very easily....
Prepare yourself that flying just may never be something she embraces. Let her know that she is entitled to her opinion, if you're entitled to yours, that may be the best you can hope for!
My experience has been that a vast majority have feelings about the hole thing, which range from ambivilence, to down right hostility. You can't change that. Perhaps your wife will grow you appreciate aviation, but beware that pressing it, could make it worse. If negative experiences are expected, that will be the percetion, and it's really easy to perceive aviation negatively, if that's what you are expecting.
Hopefully you can plan a trip which is so certain of success, that it will serve to demonstrate the fun, without the fear. Do not demonstrate steep turns to her!
Try for an aviation based social event to go to together. Particularly, if she can meet other wives, ideally happy flying wives. Ideal would be to team up with another pilot, who is extremely confident with his four place aircraft, take your wife on a two couple's trip. The other more experienced wife might help her to see the fun in the whole endevour. Take care though that nothing goes wrong. The negative can be worse that the postive very easily....
Prepare yourself that flying just may never be something she embraces. Let her know that she is entitled to her opinion, if you're entitled to yours, that may be the best you can hope for!
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women find flying a really difficult rival
Maybe just give it time? Or see if she can come up with you on one of you lessons? Must be perfect flying conditions tho' - no bumps or lumps. Or maybe give her a trial lesson as a present?
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Interested wife.
Most wives are interested in their partner's activities, they just don't always approve of them. Seems you have to find time to ask specifically what troubles your wife regarding you flying. You and she are the only ones who can sort it out. Good luck!!!
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Wives and flying
Once you get her to accept your new hobby as a new way of getting places for an enjoyable day out or weekend away you may fins, as I did, the next complaint is how boring it can be to be a passenger! I have recently solved that one by buying her an iPad with the navpro app so she can follow where we are on the moving map display and when that gets boring she can read an electronic book on the thing. It might also solve this year's Christmas present dilemma.
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So when I started my PPL I sallied forth to the pub ready to hold discourse with admiring friends on my joining the brotherhood of bold aviators.
"He'll tell you!"
I've been divorced for 10 years as a result of misunderstanding women's attitudes.
But seriously... I think men are bad at multitasking and very good at focusing on one thing for a long time. To the point where a hobby may become an obsession. I have not only seen this in flying, but also in computers (when computers were considered a "hobby") and photography (particularly now that digital is of high-quality and dirt cheap).
Maybe it's not the flying itself that she doesn't understand, maybe it's the obsession with it.
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As a woman and a pilot, I think I'm better qualified to answer this than any of you so far....
As someone said earlier, why don't you ask her? Women LIKE to talk about their feelings, strange as it may seem to some of you.
She is probably very articulate and will welcome the chance to tell you if she's simply indifferent to seeing boring old runway lights, actually resents the expense despite earlier discussion, thinks it's OK but wishes you wouldn't go on about it quite so much, or even...would quite like to have a go herself, but is desperately suppressing that as you can't possibly afford two pilots in the family (that does happen, trust me on this).
IMHO, speculation is a bit of a waste of time. You've been together ten years; can't you talk to each other?
As someone said earlier, why don't you ask her? Women LIKE to talk about their feelings, strange as it may seem to some of you.
She is probably very articulate and will welcome the chance to tell you if she's simply indifferent to seeing boring old runway lights, actually resents the expense despite earlier discussion, thinks it's OK but wishes you wouldn't go on about it quite so much, or even...would quite like to have a go herself, but is desperately suppressing that as you can't possibly afford two pilots in the family (that does happen, trust me on this).IMHO, speculation is a bit of a waste of time. You've been together ten years; can't you talk to each other?
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Thank you all for your replies. I am certain this is not a divorce issue so I can relax on that score. I think many of you are correct when you point out that aviation, like other pastimes, does not inspire most people. In fact almost everyone I have mentioned it to are bored within seconds. Thankfully I have a mate that also holds a PPL so we can bore each other.
I particularly like the quote;
"How do you know there's a pilot in the room?"
"He'll tell you!"
...........very true.
I will, however, have a go at confronting the issue with my other half over the weekend. I'll report back.
I particularly like the quote;
"How do you know there's a pilot in the room?"
"He'll tell you!"
...........very true.
I will, however, have a go at confronting the issue with my other half over the weekend. I'll report back.
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I reckon you should speak to her about it.
Pick a good moment, not when she is harrassed with something else.
Emphasise the possibility of trips abroad (whether you can do that from where you are in Ireland I don't know).
Pick a good moment, not when she is harrassed with something else.
Emphasise the possibility of trips abroad (whether you can do that from where you are in Ireland I don't know).
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I think the biggest hurdle is the reliability issue.
Many people are not at all interested in aviation, but they might be interested in going somewhere reasonably far away in a short time, (France for lunch etc.) but after the third time of the flight being cancelled due to weather or tech failure they become much less enthusiastic.
My other half hasn't even set eyes on my a/c!
Many people are not at all interested in aviation, but they might be interested in going somewhere reasonably far away in a short time, (France for lunch etc.) but after the third time of the flight being cancelled due to weather or tech failure they become much less enthusiastic.
My other half hasn't even set eyes on my a/c!
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The answer is pretty obvious really! Prior to you actually taking up flying this was all a dream and as far as she was concerned would remain so.
Hence she could be supportive and interested over something which was never going to happen.
Now you are actually doing it she is petrified of recieving THE call.
"I am afraid madam your beloved Jimmy has crashed over the channell pretending to be a world war pilot and doing dog fights. The poor sod never stood a chance recovering from that dive in the 150".
"Why did I encourage him? Why did I take such an interest? Its all my fault now my beloved Jimmy has gone and I am all alone to rear the 10 kids" !!!
Remember too the picture you have of yourself in Ray Bans and a leather jacket at the flying club looking up at the clouds in a knowing way isnt the picture she has of you!
She remembers what a complete Wonker you really are. You are the guy who cannot even follow her shopping list never mind a check list.
The guy who cannot do the simplest of tasks without messing up?
You are the Wonker who last time you went shopping on your own and took the baby you brought the shopping back and left the baby in the store.
She had to take all the frantic calls from local radio, the police and the supermarket.
She also knows how you always get her to paint the ceilings as you claim you are scared of heights and climbing ladders?
Should you ever achieve that licence by bribing various people with vast sums of money and threats she also realises that one day she may have to risk her own life by going with you.
You have some options you either try and persuade her that its all really safe or saturate her to confront her fears.
Leave gruesome accident reports dotted around the house? Buy movies like death at 30,000 feet etc. She will then realise that its all inevitable.
Lastly as you go out of the door mumble " a man has to do what a man has to do and add I may not return for some time.
Pace
Hence she could be supportive and interested over something which was never going to happen.
Now you are actually doing it she is petrified of recieving THE call.
"I am afraid madam your beloved Jimmy has crashed over the channell pretending to be a world war pilot and doing dog fights. The poor sod never stood a chance recovering from that dive in the 150".
"Why did I encourage him? Why did I take such an interest? Its all my fault now my beloved Jimmy has gone and I am all alone to rear the 10 kids" !!!
Remember too the picture you have of yourself in Ray Bans and a leather jacket at the flying club looking up at the clouds in a knowing way isnt the picture she has of you!
She remembers what a complete Wonker you really are. You are the guy who cannot even follow her shopping list never mind a check list.
The guy who cannot do the simplest of tasks without messing up?
You are the Wonker who last time you went shopping on your own and took the baby you brought the shopping back and left the baby in the store.
She had to take all the frantic calls from local radio, the police and the supermarket.
She also knows how you always get her to paint the ceilings as you claim you are scared of heights and climbing ladders?
Should you ever achieve that licence by bribing various people with vast sums of money and threats she also realises that one day she may have to risk her own life by going with you.
You have some options you either try and persuade her that its all really safe or saturate her to confront her fears.
Leave gruesome accident reports dotted around the house? Buy movies like death at 30,000 feet etc. She will then realise that its all inevitable.
Lastly as you go out of the door mumble " a man has to do what a man has to do and add I may not return for some time.
Pace
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With a less than aviation mad woman (which is 99% of them) you have to pick your day for a trip carefully. My wonderful girlfriend of 7.4 years is very happy to fly with me, and we have been to lots of places, as far as Crete or S. Spain, but I have to pick the wx carefully. Personally I don't do heavy IMC enroute anyway (icing conditions are never predictable, who wants to be in a tumble dryer, etc) but with her I have to be more careful still.
Loads of male pilots have given up flying permanently due to pressure from their women, and it always seems so pointless, because a relationship should be one of mutual support for each other's "projects".
Short trips (1-day or overnight) offer the best value because you can visit some nice city, and high pressure weather is often present for a few days at a time which is just right.
At the other end of the scale, if going away for say 2 weeks, it is no use trying to predict the return weather so you just go, keeing the dates a bit flexible and sometimes she will take a commercial flight back. It's no big deal, and on the few occassions we did that, I nearly always had a perfect flight back. Only once I had to divert due to wx (to Lydd, ILS, overnight in a hotel).
When we do a long trip, we set aside 2-3 days for getting out of the UK, and about 75% of the time we manage to get away on the first day (one always flies on the first technically suitable day, even if the following day "looks perfect"). On another 20% of the time we get away on day 2 or day 3. Only once did we have to cancel the flying holiday and take an airline somewhere, but we did a flying holiday later in the year anyway.
Avoid stops in places where you are not stopping for a reason i.e. pick any fuel stops to be overnight stay places anyway, so if you have to stay an extra night it doesn't matter.
With an IR it is easier but not as much easier as most PPLs would think - the weather doesn't care for what papers you've got. What an IR does, at least 90% of the time, is allow you to access airspace which the bl00dy ATC units in question should have let you into under VFR if only they complied with ICAO airspace classification and were not so ana11y retarded. On most long IFR trips (and I always fly IFR when going abroad, nowadays) I log very little actual instrument time; often 15 mins in 15hrs of flying.
Loads of male pilots have given up flying permanently due to pressure from their women, and it always seems so pointless, because a relationship should be one of mutual support for each other's "projects".
Short trips (1-day or overnight) offer the best value because you can visit some nice city, and high pressure weather is often present for a few days at a time which is just right.
At the other end of the scale, if going away for say 2 weeks, it is no use trying to predict the return weather so you just go, keeing the dates a bit flexible and sometimes she will take a commercial flight back. It's no big deal, and on the few occassions we did that, I nearly always had a perfect flight back. Only once I had to divert due to wx (to Lydd, ILS, overnight in a hotel).
When we do a long trip, we set aside 2-3 days for getting out of the UK, and about 75% of the time we manage to get away on the first day (one always flies on the first technically suitable day, even if the following day "looks perfect"). On another 20% of the time we get away on day 2 or day 3. Only once did we have to cancel the flying holiday and take an airline somewhere, but we did a flying holiday later in the year anyway.
Avoid stops in places where you are not stopping for a reason i.e. pick any fuel stops to be overnight stay places anyway, so if you have to stay an extra night it doesn't matter.
With an IR it is easier but not as much easier as most PPLs would think - the weather doesn't care for what papers you've got. What an IR does, at least 90% of the time, is allow you to access airspace which the bl00dy ATC units in question should have let you into under VFR if only they complied with ICAO airspace classification and were not so ana11y retarded. On most long IFR trips (and I always fly IFR when going abroad, nowadays) I log very little actual instrument time; often 15 mins in 15hrs of flying.
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It's always worth ensuring that you are talking in plain English about your flying.
When I first started, my flying lesson stories quickly became filled with aviation acronyms and jargon. The one that stumped my boyfriend quite early was referring to aircraft by the last two letters of the regn.
"who the F***'s Mike Whiskey? Is he a new instructor?"
That said, being supportive of your other (potentially equally "boring") hobbies, but not this one does suggest something is bothering her. Why not have a chat?
My other half's top three concerns are along the lines of (1) she's gonna kill herself (2) it's incredibly expensive and (3) has her PPL led to anything remotely useful yet? Nope.
When I first started, my flying lesson stories quickly became filled with aviation acronyms and jargon. The one that stumped my boyfriend quite early was referring to aircraft by the last two letters of the regn.
"who the F***'s Mike Whiskey? Is he a new instructor?"
That said, being supportive of your other (potentially equally "boring") hobbies, but not this one does suggest something is bothering her. Why not have a chat?
My other half's top three concerns are along the lines of (1) she's gonna kill herself (2) it's incredibly expensive and (3) has her PPL led to anything remotely useful yet? Nope.
I must be very lucky in having had girlfriends who have absolutely loved flying, and pester me to plan the next flying holiday 
My present girlfriend has a good 150+ hours right seat time, and makes a good copilot
My present girlfriend has a good 150+ hours right seat time, and makes a good copilot