Return of the lifetime PPL?

[douglas.lindsay]

The UK CAA seem to have started an interesting little rumour of their own today...

CAA issues renewal advice to JAR licence holders | CAA Newsroom | CAA

(para 3 : "The new EASA licences, which are set to replace all existing licences in April 2012, are expected to be non-expiring")

so maybe I'll just need to choose between renewing, or moving house...

[Jan Olieslagers]

For the little bit of rumour I heard - from sources I judge more or less credible - this would at the very best be the case for the ELSA light sport license. As I understand, the general tone will be one of further restricting our already limited privileges.

[Genghis the Engineer]

The EASA proposals are here; I can't find any reference to any licence expiring.

G

[Big Pistons Forever]

We have just started this nonsense in Canada. I was talking to a Transport Canada guy (Canadian equivalent to the CAA) the other day about this.
His response "Nothing has changed your license doesn't expire, you just have to pay $155 every 5 years to get a new aviation document"

[Jan Olieslagers]

And surely the license will still depend on a medical that DOES expire periodically? Making the change purely aesthetical indeed.

[Whopity]

Matt Lee, Head of Aviation Regulation Enforcement at the CAA, said: The new EASA licences, which are set to replace all existing licences in April 2012, are expected to be non-expiring, but, until then, JAR licence holders must comply with the current rules. Most JAR licences will become EASA licences on 8th April 2012. They will be physically replaced with EASA licences when next submitted to the CAA for renewal, or for any change or amendment.

Why would anyone need to submit a non expiring licence for renewal (Actually the correct JAA term is re-issue)?

[flyingpony]

I'm guessing that refers to the current JAR licence holder receiving his first EASA document when his 5 years are up(if after April 2012), only then is it a physical EASA non-expiring licence, rather than an EASA-compliant JAR licence.

[Whopity]

"will become" suggests that one day it will be a JAA licence, the next day its an EASA licence and subject to EASA rules!

[BillieBob]

I wonder if the national CPL and ATPL will also be non-expiring when they are re-introduced.

[Whopity]

The new EASA licences, which are set to replace all existing licences in April 2012, are expected to be non-expiring,

Even that statement is incorrect, but he is a new boy! What about Microlight Annex II etc?

[flybymike]

And I already have a non expiring Full ICAO CAA PPL which apparently cannot be exchanged for an EASA licence.

[shortstripper]

I'm still unsure what my best course of action is? I have a non expiring old UK PPL A, which I guess will become redundant except as a national licence in 2012, but this bit from the CAA site about EASA licences makes me unsure?

UK pilots with ICAO-compliant national aeroplane and helicopter licences should continue to be able to exercise the privileges of those licences in UK-registered EASA aircraft until some specified date after Part-FCL becomes mandatory;

Should I apply for a JAR/EASA licence now and run it alongside my UK licence (which I don't wish to surrender), or wait and see what happens? Is it likely that by doing so I will have to jump through more hoops later in order to continue to fly with the privileges I have now?

SS

[flybymike]

CAA have intimated that they will not have the man power be able to deal with conversion of 15000 National licences until perhaps 2015, and have suggested an interim period of validity. Personally I intend to delay transfer as long as possible.

[robin]

There is nothing to stop the CAA from coming to an agreement with EASA to have the ICAO-compliant UK-PPL directly transferred to the EASA PPL.

Except

The 15000 x £180 income they'd lose from doing that.

I'd guess most other countries would take a pragmatic approach but in our case.......

[tinpilot]

The CAA have already said that there will be a direct CAA PPL to EASA PPL transition:

Aeroplane and helicopter licences (and associated ratings) that are issued under national requirements (not JAR-FCL) and are compliant with ICAO Annex 1 will be converted to EASA licences in accordance with the second annex to the Part FCL regulation. This will apply to UK national aeroplane licences other than the NPPL(A), and to all UK national helicopter licences.

From this document.

[BillieBob]

in accordance with the second annex to the Part FCL regulation.

Which, assuming that you have at least 70hrs flight time in aeroplanes, will just require a check flight to prove your ability to use radio navigation aids. Having said that, it will probably be cheaper in the long run to trade in the UK PPL for the JAA equivalent (which is accepted as an EASA PPL) prior to 2012.

[robin]

Why should you need a check ride/ "small test" if you have evidence of use of rad nav aids

If I were to transfer now it is a straight sign-off from my CFI +£180 cheque to the CAA. Why should I pay that when my licence for life is already ICAO-compliant?

[BillieBob]

Why should you need a check ride/ "small test" if you have evidence of use of rad nav aids

Because it is in the nature of a bureaucracy to take nothing on trust. The requirement of Annex II to Part-FCL is to "demonstrate the use of radio navigation aids" not to "provide evidence that you have used". Besides, how else would they pay for all those bureaucrats without test fees?