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Buying your own Aircraft?

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Buying your own Aircraft?

Old 6th Oct 2010, 08:58
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Location: england
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Buying your own Aircraft?

I am just in the process of revalidating my JAA PPL, and have really got the flying bug back again ..

I do have a couple of cars I would be willing to sell, which could release upto 30k to buy an aircraft. I would be able to spend the running costs of the cars on an aircraft instead, so insurance/ hangarage shouldn't be too much of a problem.

Ideally a tidy Cessna 172 would be what I want, but a nice C-150 looks a good prospect, or maybe even a warrior. From what I have found on the net', there are a number of examples available for well under 30k, and I could probably stretch budget a bit to look at examples up to 40k?

When does buying your own aircraft become worthwhile? How much hassle is it converting an N reg aircraft to the G reg ?
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Old 6th Oct 2010, 09:04
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I would not try N to G unless it is worth serious money e.g. 100k+
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Old 6th Oct 2010, 09:39
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Doesn't answer your questions, but may answer the next question.
http://www.pprune.org/private-flying...-aircraft.html
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Old 6th Oct 2010, 09:43
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If you budget for "cheap" aircraft budget for two. The one you buy and another one you keep on your bank account.

And what makes owning an aircraft worthwhile?
Good question, in my case I like the freedom of having one. I can do what I like and when I like it. It is more expensive than renting or having a share but for me it is worth it.

-Kees
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Old 6th Oct 2010, 09:54
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A lot depends on how many hours you fly a year. Running a typical spamcan will cost an average of 5500 a year in maintenance (assume 100h) and around 5250 a year in fuel (assume 172 100h). On top you have insurance (1500) and parking which is very location dependent. That gives you a cost of 122 an hour not including parking.

The advantage is that you have very good availability, you can do a week in France at almost no notice and you know no one is abusing your pride and joy (except the engineers, of course).

Do you need IFR or night capability?

Rod1
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Old 6th Oct 2010, 09:55
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Kees, in some ways it makes more sense to rent, but at the end of your ownership, you will still have a possesion with value, so in the long run, with enough use, it would actually work out cheaper?

Rod, i'm not IFR so no need for anything fancy, GPS as a back up nav would be nice, but not vital. I am night rated, but there should be no major differences there? Most aircraft have panel lights or dome lights.

With regards to maintainance, I can do quite a bit myself being an RAF Aircraft engineer, and I will hopefully be doing my EASA B1 soon, so might be able to cover more than most people..
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Old 6th Oct 2010, 10:05
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If you dont need IFR then your as well going for a Permit type, considerably cheaper to run and in many cases higher performance for less money...
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Old 6th Oct 2010, 10:28
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Given your expertise and budget why not consider something like this?

VANS RV6 0-320 160hp Deltair
engine,TTAFE 400hrs, Sensenich metal prop,
Vetterman exhaust, electric trim, electric flaps,
aileron trim, Garmin GPS, Narco
radio/transponder, permit 06/11 constructed
98, yellow/blue, full set of outdoor covers,
32,500,

You will be able to do all your own maintenance, and it will do 145kn.

Rod1
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Old 6th Oct 2010, 10:40
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Join Date: Nov 2007
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May I suggest you stick with the golden rule:
If it fly's,floats, or f****, rent it.
That or go broke.
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Old 6th Oct 2010, 11:24
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Rod

I think that one may be sold (but please check with the owner if you're interested - advert in this month's Light Aviation magazine).

A more typical asking price for an RV6 is about 40-50k, but the drift does seem to be downwards...

You don't need to spend nearly that much on Permit type. Plenty of very serviceable ones out there for 15k.
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Old 6th Oct 2010, 11:25
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Syndicates, syndicates, syndicates...

- Share the cost, share the work, you'll get to fly it as much as you want anyhow, and you'll learn how to own and operate an aeroplane as you go along.

G

[Serial and parallel syndicate member - I currently own 2 x 1/8th shares, giving me 1/4 of the fixed cost and trouble of owning one aeroplane, but two aeroplanes to fly.]
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Old 6th Oct 2010, 12:17
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Is money no object at all - well probably best to buy.

However, it is difficult to get the use out of an aircraft by yourself - remember they like to be used.

In reality share the ownership between a very small group (I reckon 3 or 4 is ideal) and you almost get the best of both worlds. There are some real benefits (not just cost) of having a few others in with you.

Just a thought.
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Old 6th Oct 2010, 12:35
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I think Rod's estimate of 5k for annual maintenance is pessimistic. I realise he is quoting that figure from his past experiences so I am sure he is not making it up. We pay about 2k a year and do 100 hours. Our 50 hour check we do ourselves so there is a little saving there.
Hangarage in the north is about 1.2k a year but I believe Southerners get stuffed for 3 to 4k thus proving their is a little justice in the world.
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Old 6th Oct 2010, 13:08
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Northerners at Leeds Bradord get stuffed for 8k a year. Stick that on the monthlies and smoke it.
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Old 6th Oct 2010, 13:16
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The break even comes at about 50hrs per year, depending on aircraft of course. Below that, it's cheaper to rent. Above that, the better it gets. If you fly a lot, then it will become even cheaper.

Cheaper being a relative world, of course.

Syndicates probably being the cheaper middle ground option. But if you're like me, not much of a joiner of groups and a bit of a misanthrope, then that's not an option.
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Old 6th Oct 2010, 13:56
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Northerners at Leeds Bradord get stuffed for 8k a year. Stick that on the monthlies and smoke it.
Yep, it cost me 100 + to land and park up for a few hours two weeks back. Great service though!
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Old 6th Oct 2010, 14:19
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Join Date: Oct 2008
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This thread must get re-invented at least once a fortnight.
Makes me wonder how any of us ever flew before the internet.

"I am in the process of revalidating my licence"

"I am night rated"...oh no you're not ! ( may have been once)

"most aircraft have panel lights " fine, no problem then!


Last edited by hatzflyer; 6th Oct 2010 at 15:00.
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Old 6th Oct 2010, 14:47
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The breakeven between renting and owning is much more complex than just the total financial cost. Ownership brings a pile of stuff which is priceless:

- total access
- no arguments with group members
- maintenance to YOUR standard
- ability to take it away for holidays

to mention only a few.

Priceless.
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