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Seaplane landings England legal?

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Seaplane landings England legal?

Old 12th Jun 2012, 22:48
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In the 1989 film "Dealers" with Paul McGann and Rebecca De Mornay someone took off in what looked like a Cessna 182 seaplane from the Thames near Tower Bridge. It looked real.

I remember thinking at the time there must have been a lot of redtape to wade through to arrange that. I presume it would be impossible these days. As there aren't many seaplanes around I wondered if it it was G-ESSL?

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Old 13th Jun 2012, 12:55
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Scotland is different. There you can land in many Lochs.

I'm actually not convinced it's much different in England except for the obvious no landing spots like the Lake district etc. This thread has provided no definitive answer either. There's a speed limit on many parts of the Thames, but outside that I can't see any references to any specific prohibition banning seaplanes.
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Old 14th Jun 2012, 20:25
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water water where?

The Dealers was filmed using G-BKMM (cr.) and that's a C180K which was on Amphibs and flown by Keith Sissons. The crew needed to clear the river with a boat first to ensure a clear path for the Thames scenes. The lake scene's where filmed on a shortish lake not far away. Great flying scenes and cool movie.

There are very few lakes in the UK compared to where I fly. They mostly look like reservoirs with the odd established sailing club. Only the odd one in Wales looked like I could drop in with the Lake Bucc.... I think you probably could explore more and more options getting permissions where necessary but the density of water there is not really worth the effort.

Irish
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Old 14th Jun 2012, 21:59
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The quickest way to find out if it's legal to land on a stretch of water is to go and land there. If no-one says anything you're laughing, and if someone does say anything they'll probably tell you which law you've broken and from there you can reverse engineer the procedure for getting the permission.
(Although I conceed that it might prove expensive and you might not get to do it again.........)
On the positive side, you would be well qualified to come back here and tell us the correct procedure!

Small print: I do so hate to conceed that in today's litigious world it is now necessary to add a disclaimer in that none of the above is meant to be taken as legal advice and anyone confused or misguided enough to construe it as such should seek urgent medical attention.
I also realise at this point that the smallest font size on here is not sufficiently small to make my small print look anything like real small print but if I continue adding text then the paragraph(s) may indeed begin to resemble something that might, to the casual observer, be akin to genuine small print rather than the inane ramblings of someone who's bored and tired and should really be tucked up in bed at this hour ready for another busy day at work tomorrow.
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Old 16th Jun 2012, 08:18
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As far as I know, these guys are still active. Photograph of Aircraft G-WATR
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Old 16th Jun 2012, 19:28
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Yes, but Neil is based at Loch Earn, which is in Scotland, quite a fair way up as well as I recall. So, other than a quite pleasant photo, your point is?
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Old 18th Jun 2012, 16:30
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I seem to recall one o fthe Norfolk Broads being used for a Floatplane test in one of the comics a few years ago?

I flew Chalks Mallard from Miami-Bimini-Nassau in 1980 (It was the Blue & White one used in the opening sequence of Miami Vice and then sadly crashed a few years ago)

In 1981 I flew Long-Beach to a bit of Pacific off the coast of Catalina Island in an Avalon Mallard where we were met by a rib to take us into the harbour, the swell was up so it was rather interesting transferring to the Rib and then back again for the return!

When my Numbers come up I will be importing an Antilles Goose or restored Mallard for flying between here and my Villa at Como...
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Old 20th Jun 2012, 20:57
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England difficult cos water is classed as private property and they have medieval trespass laws. Lake District National Park speed limited so impossible.

Scotland, much more free and easy. Best choice of landscape, water and FREEEEEEEDOM ! Checkout, www.scotlandonfloats.com.
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Old 20th May 2013, 21:45
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Solving the problems

The EU FUSETRA (Future Seaplane Traffic) programme is interesting re law and seaplane bases and well worth googling, but I think the future could offer much more....

As far as I can tell, wings off or wings folded, a seaplane is a boat, not a seaplane. This would allow taxiing in harbours and estuaries, also enabling physical access to marinas and docks.

Composites are used for building high-spec yachts identically to light aircraft (diamond, Cirrus etc) which will deal with airframe corrosion when used by seaplanes.

New hull forms derived from racing multihull yachts have been developed for seaplanes, which will be i) lighter ii) less drag iii) far more seaworthy.

Used in amphibs (to enable airfield use for inland options), would these serve, even in England and Wales?
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Old 21st May 2013, 08:01
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Slight thread drift;

A couple of Sundays ago I was on a task in the helicopter which took me to the North Norfolk Coast just east of D207. Descending through 2000' I got a TCAS warning at 5 miles 2000' below. As position (not bearing remained constant) I just thought someone was doing some very low flying. About 1 minute later I realised the target was stationary, then I saw an aircraft in the water. I turned towards it thinking someone might have ditched and his transponder was still going, I went for a closer look, when suddenly his engine started and he took off, and re-landed, and then did it again.

I've got no idea what kind of aircraft it was, but on a sunny, calm Sunday I was very jealous. Lucky git.............

SND
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Old 30th May 2013, 16:19
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After getting my floatplane rating in Canada a few years back I did look into what would be involved in renewing said rating with the CAA. I eventually decided that flying mainly from Barton EGCB, there was little likelihood of landing on the Manchester Ship Canal so I gave up the idea.
But I did get as far as getting the recommended Royal Yacht Association books because to keep a floatplane rating in the UK it is necessary to know the light signals shown by a dredger operating at night!
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Old 30th May 2013, 16:54
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Is that Lake still in the long grass at Elstree visited years ago and the grass was a few feet high around it.

On checking I see Adam asked about the poor thing some years back.

Last edited by N707ZS; 30th May 2013 at 16:57.
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Old 30th May 2013, 19:12
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What sort of seaplane was it out there near the D207 SND? Was it a flying boat with a pylon mounted engine, or a float type airplane?

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Old 30th May 2013, 22:52
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North Norfolk Coast just east of D207
So it was sitting in the Wash?
Was it this?
N8004B Lake LA-4 Buccaneer | Flickr - Photo Sharing!

Last edited by UV; 30th May 2013 at 22:55.
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Old 31st May 2013, 00:04
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From what I heard the Lake is still sitting at Elstree rotting away. Really is sad as it used to be in good nick. Had the batwing modification as well, which makes the takeoff much shorter. There are a few Lakes flying in the UK, though.
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Old 31st May 2013, 20:50
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RE: N8004B photo - that's my fat head there with four up and bags heading on off on my stag do, over to Liverpool. 4 airplanes in loose formation, and I managed to beat the C182RG chock to chock on the trip from Weston. Landed number 2 behind him on 27 in Liverpool and made the first exit 200m from the 27 threshold, which pip'ed the 182 at the post. Not so bad for a 26 foot cabin cruiser.
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Old 1st Jun 2013, 07:39
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Irish Seaplane and UV;

It was definately pylon mounted, I didn't go below 1000' as he was having a nice play and I didn't think he had seen me or knew I was there so I just left him plenty of room. From 1000' and about quarter of a mile from above he was difficult to identify, I did wonder about Osprey or Lake, or possibly even the Teal that was knocking around 30 years ago (I last saw one of those in Cumbernauld looking very sad about ten years ago)

SND
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Old 21st Sep 2014, 15:53
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With the new amphibious LSA's such as the Icon A5 and the Akoya coming available soon (well at least the A5), it would be really good to get some clarity on whether it would be worthwhile getting one.

I've found a house that we might buy that is on a lake, but it doesn't own the bank nor the lake (it's actually a modest house). A risk that I'm willing to take is that landing/taking off won't cause offence, and it won't cause any damage to the lake. The bank itself is inaccessible to whomever owns it, so I was thinking of cheekily making a temporary slip of stones and gravel so that the plane can be garaged on the house's property.

I think one concession that needs to be volunteered (I feel) is to offer to pay reasonable landing fees to the appropriate land owners. Reasonable wouldn't be much, say £10 which is what you'd pay to land on a grass field. Perhaps if there was a UK seaplane association that would administer the (annual) collection and payment of landing fees (based on log books), and could approach right-holders on behalf of all members so there was a list of approved landing sites...

Ah, such a pipe dream..
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Old 22nd Sep 2014, 12:27
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dwadda,

As I'm in Canada, I cannot comment on the permissions associated with aircraft waterway use in the UK. I will suggest, however, that lots of consideration be given to the operational suitability of the lake of opportunity. There are lots of factors which can become apparent, making a body of water not so suitable as one could hope. I can offer more thoughts, with more detail on the lake.

As for the neighbourhood, I had great success with the neighbours when I purchased the property I now have for my runway, back in 1988. I asked permission form everyone, while agreeing to never fly over their homes. Then I put my planes to use for the local fire department, flying searches, and fire spotting, and I always took the local farmers for a fly, if they needed to check their fence lines.

It's a matter of presenting the positives, before the negatives are seen to prevail.
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Old 23rd Sep 2014, 22:06
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"I've found a house that we might buy that is on a lake, but it doesn't own the bank nor the lake (it's actually a modest house). A risk that I'm willing to take is that landing/taking off won't cause offence, and it won't cause any damage to the lake. The bank itself is inaccessible to whomever owns it, so I was thinking of cheekily making a temporary slip of stones and gravel so that the plane can be garaged on the house's property"

Before you get into a boundary dispute with your new neighbour, try the lake out first with a boat. See who comes out to stop you if any. It's much cheaper to try launch a boat and fail than try launch a plane and fail.

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