Recommended routes
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Recommended routes
Im planning a trip fromLiverpool to Clacton and the route i have came up with is:
Liverpool - WHI - LIC - Northampton sywell - Duxford - CLN - Clacton
VFR, If anybody has done a simlar trip what was your routing?
Thanks Chris
Liverpool - WHI - LIC - Northampton sywell - Duxford - CLN - Clacton
VFR, If anybody has done a simlar trip what was your routing?
Thanks Chris
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What is wrong with direct.
The only airspace which could be an issue is a clearance though East Midlands, but they are usually pretty helpful. If they are not skirt around to the north which would not amount to much of a diversion.
The only airspace which could be an issue is a clearance though East Midlands, but they are usually pretty helpful. If they are not skirt around to the north which would not amount to much of a diversion.
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I'd aim for direct too, rather than scud running between BHX and EMA's airspace. EMA are usually pretty good or if not, go north and get into that nice big patch of class G early and climb to fl100 all the way down to Bury St Edmonds. Lots of options for a radar service too without bothering the busier fields going your way.
If military a/c float your boat, route via Lakenheath (F-15's) and Mildenhall (KC-135's, KC10's, C130's) for a little look. Lakenheath provide a good radar service too and always amusing hearing that American drawl on the radio, whilst trying to pronounce some of the local towns !!.
If military a/c float your boat, route via Lakenheath (F-15's) and Mildenhall (KC-135's, KC10's, C130's) for a little look. Lakenheath provide a good radar service too and always amusing hearing that American drawl on the radio, whilst trying to pronounce some of the local towns !!.
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As a general rule also try to avoid routing via airfields (nice though it is to be in the overhead if the engine decides to make you a glider!) - particularly small GA airfields where traffic routinely carries out overhead joins at various random levels, or ones like Sywell with frequent aerobatic competitions in the overhead. Ideally fly the most expeditious route, ie as direct as possible - although as you've done, putting a few navaids in there is wise as long as you remember that everyone else will be too!
For info I'm doing something similar in a few days, with my route being: Private site near Leeds -> BKY -> BPK -> EGSG. Don't turn unless you actually have to... As others have said EMA are pretty good at giving transits, so I'd suggest using them as much as possible! Large airfields with radar vectored approaches are also the exception to my avoiding overheads preference - the chances of inbound traffic messing around in the overhead are pretty minimal, so crossing the overhead at 90 degrees to the active runway may well be the easiest transit for the controller to arrange. Worst thing they can do is say no!
For info I'm doing something similar in a few days, with my route being: Private site near Leeds -> BKY -> BPK -> EGSG. Don't turn unless you actually have to... As others have said EMA are pretty good at giving transits, so I'd suggest using them as much as possible! Large airfields with radar vectored approaches are also the exception to my avoiding overheads preference - the chances of inbound traffic messing around in the overhead are pretty minimal, so crossing the overhead at 90 degrees to the active runway may well be the easiest transit for the controller to arrange. Worst thing they can do is say no!
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Some great advice here people, Direct seems to be more likely now and
avoiding the overhead of small airfields is something that obviously should be avoided even though i didnt think of that.
East mids shouldnt be a problem and if needs be ill route around..
Just waiting for a decent day now
cheers
avoiding the overhead of small airfields is something that obviously should be avoided even though i didnt think of that.
East mids shouldnt be a problem and if needs be ill route around..
Just waiting for a decent day now
cheers
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"Direct" is also the way I plan most long-distance x-country flights. Draw a straight line and then "rubber band" your track around those places where you don't want to be. CTRs are not a problem per se, but I do try to avoid the ILS areas - this almost invariably means a crossing more or less perpendicular to the runway. Also avoid ATZ at less than 1500' AGL and if practical, I try to rubber band in a few navaids or very obvious VRPs for easier navigation.
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The route i first planned 'in the original post' is very close to direct and is also the shortest route, Avoiding any major airspace and crossing a few beacons i think this is the 1. Iv drawn out the other routes mentioned in this thread and had a look at them, Id try a different 1 each time i visited Clacton or on the return maybe.
Thanks for the suggestions guys
Thanks for the suggestions guys
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Airfield overheads aren't too bad if you can speak to them on the radio first. Otherwise it's a bad idea as stated (and if they have an ATZ, illegal below 2000' AGL, anyway).
The problem comes when you are speaking to e.g. East Mids for a radar service or just general situational awareness and need to transit e.g. Leicester overhead. You can change to Leicester quickly and then back; better if you have two radios and a newish audio panel is to use both frequencies at the same time but that can increase the workload beyond a sensible level. Easier to avoid the airfield.
I remember once flying back IFR from Sleap to Benson and taking a vow I would never again do single-pilot IFR with only a four-year-old in the right hand seat, as I was fielding questions from:
a. the four-year-old (my son)
b. Shawbury on box 1
c. Gloucester on box 2
at the same time as trying to aviate and navigate. At least I was VMC on top!
Tim
The problem comes when you are speaking to e.g. East Mids for a radar service or just general situational awareness and need to transit e.g. Leicester overhead. You can change to Leicester quickly and then back; better if you have two radios and a newish audio panel is to use both frequencies at the same time but that can increase the workload beyond a sensible level. Easier to avoid the airfield.
I remember once flying back IFR from Sleap to Benson and taking a vow I would never again do single-pilot IFR with only a four-year-old in the right hand seat, as I was fielding questions from:
a. the four-year-old (my son)
b. Shawbury on box 1
c. Gloucester on box 2
at the same time as trying to aviate and navigate. At least I was VMC on top!
Tim
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Bad advice above re Lakenheath and Mildenhall: they will NOT let you go through their ATZ only their wider MATZ.They will however give you an excellent radar service and keep you clear of the heavy metal. Contrary to popular opinion they do speak English.
And Duxford will not want you anywhere near their overhead either as they often have display practice on the go.
And also Duxford to Clacton direct takes you unnecessarily close (actually through now since last year's airspace changes)to Stansted's Zone.
Are you using any Navaids? The Clacton VOR is not on the airfiled.
Bury St Edmunds as a waypoint is a good idea as the British Sugar factory can be seen for miles.
Enjoy your trip: remember there is a public footpath with right of way right across the middle of Clacton's runway so keep a good lookout for pedestrians and dog walkers when you're on final............
Clacton's runway is fairly short (600mIIRC) so if you haven't planted it by the footpath, local wisdom is to go around and have another go.
Cusco
And Duxford will not want you anywhere near their overhead either as they often have display practice on the go.
And also Duxford to Clacton direct takes you unnecessarily close (actually through now since last year's airspace changes)to Stansted's Zone.
Are you using any Navaids? The Clacton VOR is not on the airfiled.
Bury St Edmunds as a waypoint is a good idea as the British Sugar factory can be seen for miles.
Enjoy your trip: remember there is a public footpath with right of way right across the middle of Clacton's runway so keep a good lookout for pedestrians and dog walkers when you're on final............
Clacton's runway is fairly short (600mIIRC) so if you haven't planted it by the footpath, local wisdom is to go around and have another go.
Cusco
Last edited by Cusco; 21st Mar 2010 at 11:40.
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There is no "recommended route" in VFR; not in the UK, anyway.
You get the CAA 1:500k VFR chart and draw a line from A to B. Then you see whether that line intersects any controlled airspace (CAS); if it does you drag it over to some suitable waypoint to avoid that CAS. Same with danger areas, generally.
The choice of waypoints depends on how one is navigating. If doing it "traditional WW2 style" then you pick unambiguous land features e.g. weird shaped lakes. If doing it with a GPS then you pick items like to be in the GPS database already e.g. VORs, airway intersections.
Then, for each leg, you look 5nm either side of it for the highest obstacle, add 1000ft to it, and that is your MSA for that leg.
You get the CAA 1:500k VFR chart and draw a line from A to B. Then you see whether that line intersects any controlled airspace (CAS); if it does you drag it over to some suitable waypoint to avoid that CAS. Same with danger areas, generally.
The choice of waypoints depends on how one is navigating. If doing it "traditional WW2 style" then you pick unambiguous land features e.g. weird shaped lakes. If doing it with a GPS then you pick items like to be in the GPS database already e.g. VORs, airway intersections.
Then, for each leg, you look 5nm either side of it for the highest obstacle, add 1000ft to it, and that is your MSA for that leg.
Then, for each leg, you look 5nm either side of it for the highest obstacle, add 1000ft to it, and that is your MSA for that leg.
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One could argue that both ways, I guess.
MSA planning is a defence against hitting terrain in case of entering (illegally and inadvertently, no doubt) IMC.
It is also a defence against busting CAS, though in the southern UK one is unlikely to bust CAS by respecting the MSA
MSA planning is a defence against hitting terrain in case of entering (illegally and inadvertently, no doubt) IMC.
It is also a defence against busting CAS, though in the southern UK one is unlikely to bust CAS by respecting the MSA
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Bad advice above re Lakenheath and Mildenhall: they will NOT let you go through their ATZ only their wider MATZ.They will however give you an excellent radar service and keep you clear of the heavy metal. Contrary to popular opinion they do speak English.
And Duxford will not want you anywhere near their overhead either as they often have display practice on the go.
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G-the-W you amaze me.....
If an ATC is giving you a service and passing you instructions you either understand it in its entirety or you ask 'em to repeat the message:not just pick the bits that suit you.
Or can you really not cope with the American accent? The cousins really do get a lot of stick : I can honestly say that having flown from a strip right under their CMATZ for 17 years I have never had a problem understanding them and in occasional conditions of marginal VFR they have been positively helpful vectoring me onto the strip.
What's your callsign?: I must remember to give you a wide berth in the vicinity of the LKH/MLD CMATZ
Cusco
If an ATC is giving you a service and passing you instructions you either understand it in its entirety or you ask 'em to repeat the message:not just pick the bits that suit you.
Or can you really not cope with the American accent? The cousins really do get a lot of stick : I can honestly say that having flown from a strip right under their CMATZ for 17 years I have never had a problem understanding them and in occasional conditions of marginal VFR they have been positively helpful vectoring me onto the strip.
What's your callsign?: I must remember to give you a wide berth in the vicinity of the LKH/MLD CMATZ
Cusco
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Cusco
I have never had a problem going overhead Duxford (unless they have a display) which is unlikely at this time of year, but of course check the NOTAMs first.
Lakenheath dont speak English, so I have some symphathy. The first time I flew in the States it took me two days to work out what they were saying.
As I said in my first post, just go direct. I fail to understand why people want to make VFR flying so complicated. Draw a line A to B if there is any class D in the way ask for a clearance, but have a plan to route around. By all means avoid overheads but that should very much depends on your height and keeping your ears open and listening what is going on. The radio is your friend.
Now I agree if you are not using a GPS, are practising your VOR tracking skills or mark 1 eyeball, pencil and paper, straight lines are not going to work, but I guess you will know that anyway.
I have never had a problem going overhead Duxford (unless they have a display) which is unlikely at this time of year, but of course check the NOTAMs first.
Lakenheath dont speak English, so I have some symphathy. The first time I flew in the States it took me two days to work out what they were saying.
As I said in my first post, just go direct. I fail to understand why people want to make VFR flying so complicated. Draw a line A to B if there is any class D in the way ask for a clearance, but have a plan to route around. By all means avoid overheads but that should very much depends on your height and keeping your ears open and listening what is going on. The radio is your friend.
Now I agree if you are not using a GPS, are practising your VOR tracking skills or mark 1 eyeball, pencil and paper, straight lines are not going to work, but I guess you will know that anyway.
Avoid imitations
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(and if they have an ATZ, illegal below 2000' AGL, anyway).
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Just a quickie then I really must go and do something else:
Fuji: I take your point entirely about Duxford displays: one should look for NOTAMS.
However there are numerous restoration/engineering setups there who at any time will shoot off and practice in the overhead.
Aerobatic practice takes place frequently in the days leading up to air displays and this is not notammed.
They really aren't keen for stuff going through their overhead so have an alternative planned.
I am sure the OP will read the Duxford entry in Pooleys (or others) where he will detect this feeling.
Cusco
Fuji: I take your point entirely about Duxford displays: one should look for NOTAMS.
However there are numerous restoration/engineering setups there who at any time will shoot off and practice in the overhead.
Aerobatic practice takes place frequently in the days leading up to air displays and this is not notammed.
They really aren't keen for stuff going through their overhead so have an alternative planned.
I am sure the OP will read the Duxford entry in Pooleys (or others) where he will detect this feeling.
Cusco