Ball point pen flying experience

[Pilot DAR]

A quote from a recent list of Transport Canada enforcement actions:

"A private pilot applying for a commercial license made false entries in his pilot's logbook in an attempt to increase his total flying hours. The individual was sanctioned with a license suspension totalling 360 days."

Good for Transport Canada!

When tied in with;

What we have in flight training today is a heritage of inexperience.

so well written from another post, it is a reminder that a [true] number in a logbook is important milestone, but the experience so much more so. The hour requirements are minimums considered by the authority necessary for adequate exposure to experience building events. It's not how many times you went around the circuit. Even with the real number of minimum hours, you're only just were you need to be to move up. Dummying up the time in your logbook really shows that you don't get that!

It irks me to see threads on "building hours". How about building experience, the hours will fill themselves in while you're doing that!

As another wise poster once said: "You can have 1000 hours, or an hour a thousand times".

Pilot DAR

[IO540]

IMHO the reason we see so much "hour building" interest is the artificial way the ATPL is structured - particularly in Europe where it is a CPL/IR followed by a load of hour building to reach 1500 TT including (AIUI) 100 at night.

If we had the concept of "demonstrated competence" then hour building would not take place. Hour building usually involves renting the cheapest possible spamcan and flying back and forth - or PPL instructing - and thus has practically zero relevance to the ATPL which is generally about carrying paying passengers in a highly automated multi crew cockpit.

[Airbus Girl]

I guess that is why they introduced the MPL.

[A and C]

IO540

The irony is that the problem I see most from the young FO's is that they can't revert to to the "basics", a fully automated ILS to autoland is no problem, ask them to fly a visual circuit and the problems start!

A good dose of VFR european touring would be of more use to them than they (or the industry big wiggs) know

[Sciolistes]

IMHO the reason we see so much "hour building" interest is the artificial way the ATPL is structured - particularly in Europe where it is a CPL/IR followed by a load of hour building to reach 1500 TT including (AIUI) 100 at night.

If we had the concept of "demonstrated competence" then hour building would not take place. Hour building usually involves renting the cheapest possible spamcan and flying back and forth - or PPL instructing - and thus has practically zero relevance to the ATPL which is generally about carrying paying passengers in a highly automated multi crew cockpit.

I don't really know who you have met or spoken to, but I really don't see hour building practiced in this way. For a start, the term "hour building" most usually refers to the hours post PPL to qualify for CPL training. Post CPL/IR the time to 1500 hours is for the ATPL license. This time isn't hour building, typically it is actually commercial time which must include multi-crew and has nothing to do with the MPL (referring to other post). If anything, the cited concern with the MPL is that it reduces actual flying time considerably and just, so the argument goes, the ability to excersise sufficient command judgement.

In terms of "demonstrated competence", that is what the CPL and IR skill tests are for, not to mention the sim check, followed by the type rating, the license skill test, then the line training, the recurrent LOFT, OPC/LPC and line checks. So one doesn't get to hold an ATPL without completing at least 23 exams and 12 official skills tests and checks!

It irks me to see threads on "building hours". How about building experience, the hours will fill themselves in while you're doing that!

Just to provide a counter point, hour building (in the most recognised sense) with the major FTOs is a structured exercise aimed to build the trainees experience. The self-managed modular chaps I have met generally look to try something different each flight. One chap really made the most of his IMC rating and, I would say had much more experience in his first 150 hours than many PPLs achieve in 500.