Glider Pilots of PPRuNe
Not much soaring lately. My ship has been in the box rather than tied out, as we had a vintage soaring meet and a contest 3 weeks after. They needed my spot. Plus I have been trying to finish my FAA instrument rating. Yesterday however I talked my wife into letting me take my two boys. The older boy has been eager to get into the ASK21, as he has only been in the 2-33. Took him up first. The younger boy went for his first ride earlier in the summer. We were in the back of a Schweizer 2-32, a 3-place sailplane. That turned out to be a bit of a bust, as I didn't realize the canopy skirt took out some more of the view as compared to canopy open. I wish I had propped him up with cusions a little better so he could see. But he did great in the back of the 21, holding his 3 stuffed animals. When we cleared the edge of the ridge he let out a "wow!!!" and it was all good from there. Not much of a soaring day but I would trade that day for any 3 great solo days.
-- IFMU
-- IFMU
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First solo, UGC, Bellarena, Northern Ireland
This is my first solo, K21. Would have shaved for the picture if I knew I'd be flying solo today (Sunday 9th). I started gliding with Ulster GC. I didn't get to fly often due to crazy work rotas, Irish weather, transportation hassle and weekend only (pretty much) instructing.
Flown K13, K21, DG505 (once) and G103. If it wasn't for my intensive gliding 'holidays' flying old Twin Astir, I'd be far from solo now. Many thanks to all instructors at UGC, namely Brian, Ted and Phil and Robert in Aeroclub Prievidza (organiser of WGC 2010!!), all folks of Queens Uni GC as well. Also grateful for nice pics taken by Kerry.
I didn't want to post 'my credentials' (as if there are any..) until I went solo, since I could then talk about being glider pilot, logging some P1 time.
I'm already dreaming of places far away with gorgeous nature, thermals, wave. It's all quite far from my current skill level, though. Solo is a licence to learn, so it is.
Flown K13, K21, DG505 (once) and G103. If it wasn't for my intensive gliding 'holidays' flying old Twin Astir, I'd be far from solo now. Many thanks to all instructors at UGC, namely Brian, Ted and Phil and Robert in Aeroclub Prievidza (organiser of WGC 2010!!), all folks of Queens Uni GC as well. Also grateful for nice pics taken by Kerry.
I didn't want to post 'my credentials' (as if there are any..) until I went solo, since I could then talk about being glider pilot, logging some P1 time.
I'm already dreaming of places far away with gorgeous nature, thermals, wave. It's all quite far from my current skill level, though. Solo is a licence to learn, so it is.
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Mainly RAFGSA flying. First flight T21 Swinderby 1967 when a frustrated Vulcan co-pilot. Silver C 30 days later in K8.
Gold C, 2 Diamonds, Full Cat.
Last flight (bar a few) ASW17 500k triangle from Bicester 1976.
Tug Pilot c1000 hours mainly ag Chipmunks at Bicester.
Now retired, the only times I get airborne are when my 14m F-One Bandit kite hauls my 17 stone bulk out of the water. Of all my flying, including RAF military, airline and Rothman's Pitts, it is the Halcyon Days of my Bicester gliding that I miss most. I am forever grateful to the likes of Dickie Feakes, 'Black' Jack Harrison and John Dellafield for introducing me to the wonderful world of gliding.
Thank you.
Gold C, 2 Diamonds, Full Cat.
Last flight (bar a few) ASW17 500k triangle from Bicester 1976.
Tug Pilot c1000 hours mainly ag Chipmunks at Bicester.
Now retired, the only times I get airborne are when my 14m F-One Bandit kite hauls my 17 stone bulk out of the water. Of all my flying, including RAF military, airline and Rothman's Pitts, it is the Halcyon Days of my Bicester gliding that I miss most. I am forever grateful to the likes of Dickie Feakes, 'Black' Jack Harrison and John Dellafield for introducing me to the wonderful world of gliding.
Thank you.
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Could anyone advise of the cost of running and insuring a glider?
I was thinking something like a Pegase. Am hopeful to complete my Silver this year and by next season I should have 40-50 hours P1; what sort of glider is suitable for that experience? Say up to £20k. Am I better looking at shares instead?
I was thinking something like a Pegase. Am hopeful to complete my Silver this year and by next season I should have 40-50 hours P1; what sort of glider is suitable for that experience? Say up to £20k. Am I better looking at shares instead?
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Running and insuring a Pegase
Oversteer
I'm a Peg owner and currently pay about £750 per year for insurance, but that's with 480 hours and a Basic Instructor Rating (but add back in a loading for a rather silly and expensive ground handling accident a couple of years ago). Annual inspection and ARC should cost around a couple of hundred quid or so a year, and then there's the trailer parking fee of between £100 and £300 depending where you fly from.
Insofar as flying a Peg is concerned, as long as your speed control on approach is good there's no reason why a Pegase or ASW19 should be beyond your competence, but check with your CFI and try and fly a club one somewhere (eg Gransden Lodge) before you commit. My former syndicate partner had much less experience than me and coped quite adequately with ours.
Caught me on a good day, as I did my first 300km in 4 years on Saturday, and shaved 45 minutes off my best time for the distance
Cheers
Pegpilot
I'm a Peg owner and currently pay about £750 per year for insurance, but that's with 480 hours and a Basic Instructor Rating (but add back in a loading for a rather silly and expensive ground handling accident a couple of years ago). Annual inspection and ARC should cost around a couple of hundred quid or so a year, and then there's the trailer parking fee of between £100 and £300 depending where you fly from.
Insofar as flying a Peg is concerned, as long as your speed control on approach is good there's no reason why a Pegase or ASW19 should be beyond your competence, but check with your CFI and try and fly a club one somewhere (eg Gransden Lodge) before you commit. My former syndicate partner had much less experience than me and coped quite adequately with ours.
Caught me on a good day, as I did my first 300km in 4 years on Saturday, and shaved 45 minutes off my best time for the distance
Cheers
Pegpilot
You didn't have plans to spend money on anything else, now, did you? 
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Hello, Peg pilot, and Oversteer!
The Pegase is an excellent glider. It has no vices. It should have a forward airtow hook and a winch hook in the wheelbox. Don't consider any glider without a forward airtow hook, if you can help it, it may save your bacon more than once.......
But I recommend, Oversteer, at your present level, that you fly your club machines; hopefully you can get weekday availability; weekends the club gliders may be in great demand. In that case, for experience on type, be willing to fly in the morning, and bring it back for the person who intends to use it for a X-country or a badge flight. (if you ever don't bring it back when you promised, don't expect to be forgiven!)
When you have your silver and a few X-countries under your belt, sit in different gliders to see if they fit your butt, and have enough headroom.
I spent 8 hours and 53 minutes sitting in my peg, doing a 500. ( Not very fast, but got round.) And you might plan to have oxygen installed, for that trip to Aboyne.
Then see if any LS4 or Pegasus or ASW19 or well tried and tested glider with no vices is owned by a syndicate who would possibly welcome you to help share the bills. Especially if you promise to retrieve your partners when they land out ........
Buying one on your own nearly always results in underutilisation. Lots of yachts sit at the dock and never move.
The Pegase is an excellent glider. It has no vices. It should have a forward airtow hook and a winch hook in the wheelbox. Don't consider any glider without a forward airtow hook, if you can help it, it may save your bacon more than once.......
But I recommend, Oversteer, at your present level, that you fly your club machines; hopefully you can get weekday availability; weekends the club gliders may be in great demand. In that case, for experience on type, be willing to fly in the morning, and bring it back for the person who intends to use it for a X-country or a badge flight. (if you ever don't bring it back when you promised, don't expect to be forgiven!)
When you have your silver and a few X-countries under your belt, sit in different gliders to see if they fit your butt, and have enough headroom.
I spent 8 hours and 53 minutes sitting in my peg, doing a 500. ( Not very fast, but got round.) And you might plan to have oxygen installed, for that trip to Aboyne.
Then see if any LS4 or Pegasus or ASW19 or well tried and tested glider with no vices is owned by a syndicate who would possibly welcome you to help share the bills. Especially if you promise to retrieve your partners when they land out ........
Buying one on your own nearly always results in underutilisation. Lots of yachts sit at the dock and never move.
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Inter University Flying Comp...This was at Pocklington.
The Ka8 on the winch queue..with a fantastic sky...
Me in the Ka8.. some good altitude..
I had a particularly good week, went from 9 solos to Bronze with my XC Endorsement completed and a Silver height... Plus my university won the Progression Competition
The Ka8 on the winch queue..with a fantastic sky... Me in the Ka8.. some good altitude..I had a particularly good week, went from 9 solos to Bronze with my XC Endorsement completed and a Silver height... Plus my university won the Progression Competition
Nice to see some more soaring pics on this thread.
Congratulations on your solo MartinCh. The ASK21 is a nice machine to fly. They don't let us solo it on the hill until we have at least a private rating and a little time. Our primary trainers are the Schweizer 2-33's. A great machine in its own right, though many sneer at them. Very low cost, very strong and forgiving, easy to repair. The -21 is a pretty nice all around club ship though. We have 3 of them.
Thanks for the kind words cjboy. If you were to move over here to take up gliding again you would not be the only Englishman in the club!
Very true. I seem to fly mine less than 20 hours/year. The balance of my soaring is in club ships, taking somebody else in a 2-place. I can't justify owning a glider financially when I can rent a club ASK-21 for $9/hour, or a 1-26/1-34/2-33 for $6/hour and a $23 tow. But, when it is a great day, and I actually get time to go, I don't have to wait, don't have to share, I just go and fly.
glider12000, great photos. Glad you had a great week, get as many of them as you can now in case work/family etc makes it harder later.
-- IFMU
Congratulations on your solo MartinCh. The ASK21 is a nice machine to fly. They don't let us solo it on the hill until we have at least a private rating and a little time. Our primary trainers are the Schweizer 2-33's. A great machine in its own right, though many sneer at them. Very low cost, very strong and forgiving, easy to repair. The -21 is a pretty nice all around club ship though. We have 3 of them.
Thanks for the kind words cjboy. If you were to move over here to take up gliding again you would not be the only Englishman in the club!
Originally Posted by mary meagher
Buying one on your own nearly always results in underutilisation. Lots of yachts sit at the dock and never move.
glider12000, great photos. Glad you had a great week, get as many of them as you can now in case work/family etc makes it harder later.
-- IFMU
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And you might plan to have oxygen installed, for that trip to Aboyne.
Lead to this
which leads to this . . .
It's just the best way to spend the weekend, with the best people.
(we even allow "full timers" who do it as a day job on the airfield at the weekends)
Aboyne is a fairly magical place, hope to see you up there (may even show you where to get the O2
)middle piccie looks for all the world like a "photoshop" job, it's actually taken with a Sony compact, held above my head and forced flash _on_.
ABO, only place in the UK you can do a 300k triangle as a "local soaring" flight .
and where you usually end up with a "diamond" before you can go XC . . .
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Calling any PPRUNE glider pilots in Scotland...
I'm a glider pilot who's coming to Scotland for a year, to do a postgrad course at uni. I'll be joining Portmoak and, since I'm not current, I have some refresher flying booked in there when I arrive later this month.
I also hope to visit as many of the Scottish gliding clubs during the year as I can, and would love to hear from any glider pilots flying in Scotland with any tips, advice, suggestions to impart - please feel free to PM me.
Apologies for brief diversion from main thread, and ta very much
Bird-watcher
PS: Those wave pix look just fantastic... Can't wait!
I'm a glider pilot who's coming to Scotland for a year, to do a postgrad course at uni. I'll be joining Portmoak and, since I'm not current, I have some refresher flying booked in there when I arrive later this month.
I also hope to visit as many of the Scottish gliding clubs during the year as I can, and would love to hear from any glider pilots flying in Scotland with any tips, advice, suggestions to impart - please feel free to PM me.
Apologies for brief diversion from main thread, and ta very much
Bird-watcher
PS: Those wave pix look just fantastic... Can't wait!
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I'd echo Mary Meagher's comments about trying as many types as possible before buying. The Pegase is a very good glider, handles well, has no real vices except perhaps that it's rather sensitive on the elevator when lanching and landing (PIOs on early flights are commonplace). However, I just don't enjoy flying them. If you had the same reaction, you'd be sorry you bought one!
My suggestion for someone just finishing their Silver would be to find an insurance share for a year if they can. That will tell you (a) how much flying you might be likely to do, and (b) how many times you would have flown but it wasn't your turn in the glider. From that you can work out whether to buy a share or buy your own.
Visit other clubs and fly their single seaters so you have points of comparison when seeking to buy.
I suspect PegPilot's costs for annual inspection and renewal are on the low side - I'd budget £400 and be pleased if there was change. Say £1,200 a year before you fly it, plus club subscription and trailer parking fee.
My suggestion for someone just finishing their Silver would be to find an insurance share for a year if they can. That will tell you (a) how much flying you might be likely to do, and (b) how many times you would have flown but it wasn't your turn in the glider. From that you can work out whether to buy a share or buy your own.
Visit other clubs and fly their single seaters so you have points of comparison when seeking to buy.
I suspect PegPilot's costs for annual inspection and renewal are on the low side - I'd budget £400 and be pleased if there was change. Say £1,200 a year before you fly it, plus club subscription and trailer parking fee.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cjboy
Lovely pics IFMU, if we could do that in the UK I'd still be gliding!
What can't you do in UK?
Take the kids for a jolly, unless you are an instructor, or perhaps in some special "circle of trust" which is only open to the few....
Originally Posted by cjboy
Lovely pics IFMU, if we could do that in the UK I'd still be gliding!
What can't you do in UK?
Take the kids for a jolly, unless you are an instructor, or perhaps in some special "circle of trust" which is only open to the few....
Some smaller clubs seem to have these rules to make sure they get new Basic Instructors coming through.
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Sounds like you are flying at the wrong club! I have flown many friends and family with no Instructor rating. Just needed a check flight to get it signed off. Easy, just part of the club rules.
Some smaller clubs seem to have these rules to make sure they get new Basic Instructors coming through.
Some smaller clubs seem to have these rules to make sure they get new Basic Instructors coming through.
First Glider Landing on Pavement
Worked around a couple blue holes North of the home field and got stuck into cloud streets in the general direction of first turnpoint. Rounded that, headed back to the cu, first dying, second one taking me up to 6000' (after letting me examine possible fields
) and happily trucked back South to find the streets veering off into Class C
and blue on the way home
-- well there were itty bitty puffs every 20 km or so which worked quite well and managed to hopscotch from one airfield to the next for most of the way. A bit warm for trailer retrieves and every bit closer to home reduces the air retrieve cost. Got to a busy field during a traffic lull -- the freq was uncharacteristically quiet and there was no lift to be found; so time for my first glider landing on pavement. Nice touchdown and rollout, but the glider just kept rolling and rolling, even with double panel spoilers out. But the runway was long and eventually attempted a turnoff to the grass between the lights.
A few folks turned out and were quite helpful in pulling the glider to a spot on the ramp where it was out of the way. And there was no shortage of volunteers to position the glider on the runway when the towplane showed up
The employees and C-152 / C-172 students came out for cockpit tours.
Oh yes, there was a bit of noise from the tail skid on take off that took me a while to catch on to
Well, that's three of the fields North of home that I've landed on. Farther North gets more expensive, but there's local tows available if they will fit you in. Another member did his 50 km. the same day and chose to land instead of flying back. He had to call for an expensive retrieve, but got a bit of a reduction as the towplane picked me up on the way back.
) and happily trucked back South to find the streets veering off into Class C and blue on the way home -- well there were itty bitty puffs every 20 km or so which worked quite well and managed to hopscotch from one airfield to the next for most of the way. A bit warm for trailer retrieves and every bit closer to home reduces the air retrieve cost. Got to a busy field during a traffic lull -- the freq was uncharacteristically quiet and there was no lift to be found; so time for my first glider landing on pavement. Nice touchdown and rollout, but the glider just kept rolling and rolling, even with double panel spoilers out. But the runway was long and eventually attempted a turnoff to the grass between the lights.A few folks turned out and were quite helpful in pulling the glider to a spot on the ramp where it was out of the way. And there was no shortage of volunteers to position the glider on the runway when the towplane showed up
The employees and C-152 / C-172 students came out for cockpit tours.
Oh yes, there was a bit of noise from the tail skid on take off that took me a while to catch on to
Well, that's three of the fields North of home that I've landed on. Farther North gets more expensive, but there's local tows available if they will fit you in. Another member did his 50 km. the same day and chose to land instead of flying back. He had to call for an expensive retrieve, but got a bit of a reduction as the towplane picked me up on the way back.
Last edited by RatherBeFlying; 21st Aug 2009 at 19:10.
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Soaring in USA
Furloughed Int'l Cargo pilot in California.......440 glider hours, 1260 flights (lots of winch launch patterns) ......... Aerotow, winch, auto, self-launch ........CFIG.......Tow pilot - VG-2150, CE-182, MXT-7, A-9.........I have been to 25000+ a few times, ~20 years ago in wave (Calif. City, CA).......One thing about soaring sites - many don't fly anywhere other than the home field, and for the traveling enthusiast, it's curious to see that what is considered normal ops at one field - "the way it's done", is absolutely verboten at another field; AND vice-versa..........
Last edited by 727gm; 21st Sep 2012 at 06:59. Reason: punct.
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Hi to all you glider types
I was a member at Essex Gliding Club based at North Weald and Ridgewell.
Personal circumstances (work mainly) made me let it go about 3 yrs ago. A real shame as I was just about to complete by BI course.
Flew various types and had a half share in an ASW 15 (JDR). I'd be interested if anyone knows where JDR is now.
longest flight 6 3/4 hours - pissed like a donkey when I go back !
Now just started powered flying. Keep wanting to turn when we fly through lift, but my instructor won't let me
I was a member at Essex Gliding Club based at North Weald and Ridgewell.
Personal circumstances (work mainly) made me let it go about 3 yrs ago. A real shame as I was just about to complete by BI course.
Flew various types and had a half share in an ASW 15 (JDR). I'd be interested if anyone knows where JDR is now.
longest flight 6 3/4 hours - pissed like a donkey when I go back !
Now just started powered flying. Keep wanting to turn when we fly through lift, but my instructor won't let me
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taking the kids for a jolly......
Actually, I think that is a terrible idea. If they are under ten, they will be bored, and probably throw up.
If they are between ten and fourteen, they will want to learn, and still be too young to solo, and YOU are the wrong one to teach them!
If they are over 14, under 21, as above. Though probably more interested in the opposite sex by this time. Joining a youngster's group at your local club (like ours at Shenington) gives them friends and kindred spirits, and fully qualified instructors. I certainly would not like any child of mine to fly in a glider with an unqualified person. And simply being a solo pilot with a basic rating leaves a lot of room for problems. It is not as easy as flying in a l52 or a warrior.
If your wife/girlfriend wants to fly with you, in a glider, once again you will probably put her off for life. Same result as for the under tens.
If they are between ten and fourteen, they will want to learn, and still be too young to solo, and YOU are the wrong one to teach them!
If they are over 14, under 21, as above. Though probably more interested in the opposite sex by this time. Joining a youngster's group at your local club (like ours at Shenington) gives them friends and kindred spirits, and fully qualified instructors. I certainly would not like any child of mine to fly in a glider with an unqualified person. And simply being a solo pilot with a basic rating leaves a lot of room for problems. It is not as easy as flying in a l52 or a warrior.
If your wife/girlfriend wants to fly with you, in a glider, once again you will probably put her off for life. Same result as for the under tens.