Life Insurance and the Private Pilot.
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Join Date: May 2003
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Life Insurance and the Private Pilot.
Hi all and a Happy New Year to all.
'Er indoors brought up a valid point the other day............
Does my Life Insurance cover private flying (and even worse Flight Testing - which I find myself doing more and more these days)?
I know the answer...NO!
All joking aside, the consequences for all of us if the worse happens (and the Insurance Company wriggles out) are extremely serious eh?
So, the question is, can anyone recommend a company that understands our passion, and would cover us for these ("extremely hazardous"!) activities at a sensible rate.
I think that it's a question we should all ask ourselves eh????
Regards to all.
Jez
'Er indoors brought up a valid point the other day............
Does my Life Insurance cover private flying (and even worse Flight Testing - which I find myself doing more and more these days)?
I know the answer...NO!
All joking aside, the consequences for all of us if the worse happens (and the Insurance Company wriggles out) are extremely serious eh?
So, the question is, can anyone recommend a company that understands our passion, and would cover us for these ("extremely hazardous"!) activities at a sensible rate.
I think that it's a question we should all ask ourselves eh????
Regards to all.
Jez
Moderator
I am covered for all of my flying activities, including fixed and rotor wing test flying by my insurer, which is Trans America Life, here in Canada. I think that the broker selling the insurance is as important as the insurance company. When I first took out the policy about 13 years ago, my 3000 hours at the time was plenty, and they did not ask any more questions about the flying. The broker did not know me at all, but understood flying very well, and made it not a problem. I did have the sense that were I to have been a student pilot, the numbers might have been a bit different. I was told that the premium I was offered was only slightly higher than the regular for my age, and much lower than had I been a smoker. When renewal time can a few years ago, other companies were not eager for my business, particularly as I had added helicopters and test flying modifications to my flying. The original company was perfectly fine though, and I went back with them.
Interestingly I am also separately life insured as a volunteer firefighter, which I have also done for more than 15 years. Under that "firefighter" policy, I am covered 24/7 for absolutely anything except flying! I suppose that they think that walking into burning buildings in less dangerous than flying! Even if I fly on behalf of the fire department, which I do every month or so, they will not cover me!
My odd life insurance story:
In my capacity as a firefighter, I was called to a plane crash at the local airport. It was my very good friend, who owned the airport, and the flying operation. He'd managed to kill himself in his school's 150. Stupid flying. We lifted out who was left after a stop, which the coroner told us was about 200 G's (you don't want to know how he knows). The next day, as the business was closed, I was there helping out and answering phone calls. Who should call but my friend's life insurance broker, asking for him, as it would soon be time to renew. I decided there was no point in delaying the inevitable; "Well I'm sorry to tell you that you won't be able to speak to XXX, because yesterday.....". "Oh, thank you", Click.
Find a co-operative broker first, then have him search for the insurance you need, then fly (live) safe and don't need it!
Pilot DAR
Interestingly I am also separately life insured as a volunteer firefighter, which I have also done for more than 15 years. Under that "firefighter" policy, I am covered 24/7 for absolutely anything except flying! I suppose that they think that walking into burning buildings in less dangerous than flying! Even if I fly on behalf of the fire department, which I do every month or so, they will not cover me!
My odd life insurance story:
In my capacity as a firefighter, I was called to a plane crash at the local airport. It was my very good friend, who owned the airport, and the flying operation. He'd managed to kill himself in his school's 150. Stupid flying. We lifted out who was left after a stop, which the coroner told us was about 200 G's (you don't want to know how he knows). The next day, as the business was closed, I was there helping out and answering phone calls. Who should call but my friend's life insurance broker, asking for him, as it would soon be time to renew. I decided there was no point in delaying the inevitable; "Well I'm sorry to tell you that you won't be able to speak to XXX, because yesterday.....". "Oh, thank you", Click.
Find a co-operative broker first, then have him search for the insurance you need, then fly (live) safe and don't need it!
Pilot DAR
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From the UK life insurance perspective:
Flying, or indeed any activity whatsoever, is fully covered by a pre-existing life policy unless the activity is specifically excluded.
The trick might be getting insured after one has taken up flying.
IME, there is no problem if you fly 50-100hrs/year and if one shops around the companies, one finds one which doesn't care that much. There have also been some brokers advertising in the backs of the flying mags which sell some stuff like that.
Flying, or indeed any activity whatsoever, is fully covered by a pre-existing life policy unless the activity is specifically excluded.
The trick might be getting insured after one has taken up flying.
IME, there is no problem if you fly 50-100hrs/year and if one shops around the companies, one finds one which doesn't care that much. There have also been some brokers advertising in the backs of the flying mags which sell some stuff like that.
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One quick but efficient option might be to join the FFA (Fédération Française Aéronautique). You can get various levels of insurance from €11.- to ~€150.- per year. I'm sure there must be an equivalent scheme in the UK, perhaps from AOPA or something similar?
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AOPA used to do AOPA Wings Insurance which was carried by Marsh.
Then suddenly, several years ago Marsh dropped the business with about 6 weeks notice, with no offer of re-insuring its existing customers (including me): even AOPA didn't know about it.
To give AOPA their due, I contacted Martin Robinson direct and he fixed me up with preferential rates with Besso (google 'em)
As already said, pre-existing LIFE policies (taken out before you started or had any intention to fly- important that last bit) are valid, but don't neglect the personal accident bit as well as the two are occasionally mutually exclusive.
In other words if you wipe yourself out while flying in USA (your policy is world-wide isn't it?), then your loved ones will pick up a tidy packet.
If however you injure yourself badly, need major surgery, spend weeks in hospital then get Medi-flighted back, you ain't covered.
Surprising how this aspect is un appreciated by many.
Cusco
Then suddenly, several years ago Marsh dropped the business with about 6 weeks notice, with no offer of re-insuring its existing customers (including me): even AOPA didn't know about it.
To give AOPA their due, I contacted Martin Robinson direct and he fixed me up with preferential rates with Besso (google 'em)
As already said, pre-existing LIFE policies (taken out before you started or had any intention to fly- important that last bit) are valid, but don't neglect the personal accident bit as well as the two are occasionally mutually exclusive.
In other words if you wipe yourself out while flying in USA (your policy is world-wide isn't it?), then your loved ones will pick up a tidy packet.
If however you injure yourself badly, need major surgery, spend weeks in hospital then get Medi-flighted back, you ain't covered.
Surprising how this aspect is un appreciated by many.
Cusco
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I was a pilot long before I took out life insurance and that was no problem, no extra cost. Just no professional competition flying allowed.
Just s an aside: I also have a Visa Corporate credit card and it now comes with a free insurance for medical repatriation, search and rescue, medical assistance abroad (emergency surgery etc). The limits are quite substantial; unlimited medical expenses, 25000€ SAR expenses, 1500€ dentist expenses, etc. This is also valid for spouse and children below 25 years too. The only catch is: it is valid only while abroad. I have read the contract and there is no exclusion for flying.
Just s an aside: I also have a Visa Corporate credit card and it now comes with a free insurance for medical repatriation, search and rescue, medical assistance abroad (emergency surgery etc). The limits are quite substantial; unlimited medical expenses, 25000€ SAR expenses, 1500€ dentist expenses, etc. This is also valid for spouse and children below 25 years too. The only catch is: it is valid only while abroad. I have read the contract and there is no exclusion for flying.
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Traffords are good - I have my travel insurance with them and they do an annual multi-trip policy which includes cover for flying.
My life insurance didn't have a problem with flying but I did have to specify number of hours (total and per year), licences held, how much time I spend doing aeros (<5 hours per year, as passenger!), &c &c. The forms seem to have become more complicated as time has gone on. But they haven't refused yet. Traffords I know can also arrange life insurance.
PM me if you can't find the contact details for Traffords and I'll dig them up.
Tim
My life insurance didn't have a problem with flying but I did have to specify number of hours (total and per year), licences held, how much time I spend doing aeros (<5 hours per year, as passenger!), &c &c. The forms seem to have become more complicated as time has gone on. But they haven't refused yet. Traffords I know can also arrange life insurance.
PM me if you can't find the contact details for Traffords and I'll dig them up.
Tim
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An interesting point that came up recently is how long it takes for Life insurers to pay out in air crashes. Someone I know is being told that the insurers will not pay out until after the AAIB report is published and probably not till after the inquest. Just worth considering how long those might take when planning for any eventualities.
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Why not ring your insurance company and ask if they cover private flying?
Legal and General do.
Otherwise get an annual policy through Traffords.
Or call other insurance brokers and see if they can find what you need.
Usually getting cover for a PPL is no problem but if you are doing stacks of hours each year and/or have a CPL or ATPL it probably will be a problem and you'll need more specialist cover.
Legal and General do.
Otherwise get an annual policy through Traffords.
Or call other insurance brokers and see if they can find what you need.
Usually getting cover for a PPL is no problem but if you are doing stacks of hours each year and/or have a CPL or ATPL it probably will be a problem and you'll need more specialist cover.
