PPL Costs & Expected Duration

[Okavango]

Ok, thanks for everyones input on PPL questions. I've spoken to a few schools and I've now found one that seems good. Their package is competitive at £5500 all inclusive (exams, course material etc, 45hrs flight), though most importantly they seem a keen competent outfit. I think the landing fees are a rough estimate, it was ~£5000 not including them. However, one of the more expensive schools I spoke to said that I should budget for 60hrs (and this at their rate of £150/hr).

My question is, how many hours does it take Joe Average to pass, and if you have your PPL, how many hours did you take? I consider myself to be above average aptitude and was thinking 50hrs (as I know 45hrs is exceptional). It would be good to know that any school is providing effective training though at the moment it's hard to gauge.

Also, I'd be grateful to know general calendar durations for training. I know it's not unusual for people to take 18months-2yrs, though how quick can it be done (not down the intensive Florida route as I'll be working full time). As my job is relatively flexible, my thinking is I can fit in up to 4 flights a week (during summer hours), of which I'd expect 1/3 - 1/2 to be cancelled, plus one holiday week during a spell of good weather of maybe a flight a day if I'm lucky. Is it possible to gain your PPL in this way in 4-5 months or am I being unrealistic? Thanks again.

[PompeyPaul]

Highly inflamatory

Hi,

Unfortunately I feel your question is going to lead to all sorts of finger pointing and "if you went solo in 10 hours then your school is irresponsible" type arguments.

You are also going to get lots of people posting, it's not about aptitude it's about the aircraft you learn in, the airspace around you, how often you fly, how lucky you are with wx etc.

It's true, there's lots of variables, yet I understand at the start of the PPL you need to know a cost and what to expect so all the hedging doesn't mean anything if you haven't even got a starting point.

So, taken with a massive dose of salt:

I passed my PPL, on the money, at 45hours (I'm told most do it 50/60 hours)
It cost me, probably, around 11k all in I would say, maybe a shade less.
I did this in just over a 9 month period, first flight was in late November 06 (28th?), pass was in early August 07 (2nd?)

As others are going to do to death here, I'd just itterate. I was lucky and didn't have to hardly any significantly long breaks due to wx. The longest I went in between flights was 3 weeks. I booked to fly once a week, but at times booked flying on the Satuday AND Sunday - that was tough.

I also took a week off work and flew every day, usually twice. That was Saturday \ Sunday \ Monday \ Tuesday \ Wednesday (cancelled due to wx got an exam done instead) \ Thursday \ Friday \ Saturday \ Sunday

Went back to work more tired than when I left. It was that time where I really learnt to fly, had I not of done it, then my learning time would be significantly longer. I still remember the hour I learnt to fly, it's just a shame it took 20hours of training to get to that 1 hour!

£5.5k does sound cheap, very cheap. Suspiciously so to me, but then I'm in the South East and everything is expensive. If you are in the stix oop norf then it may be possible.

The other thing, I've got to tell somebody at the start of the PPL, is 2 things I didn't realise.

1. This is a massive undertaking

There is significant home study, and exam preperation. I work long hours in IT and getting home each night to spend an hour or 2 reading is a tough commitment. It's really not easy, and things all did start to get a bit on top of me around May time whilst I was crunching for exams, working my ass off at work, and trying to get the flying hours in.

That doesn't include the week you spend getting out of work @ 18:30, to get to the airfield @ 19:30 to spend a couple of hours going through radio calls to get back home for 22:00. That's a long, tough day, to do for a week solidly.

Roughly I'd say you've got to accept that you are taking on a part time 'A' level, or maybe 3 or 4 GCSE's into your routine.

2. Flying is fun, but at times you will be SCARED

Sometimes flying is scarey. Sometimes you will be terrified. Don't want to put you off, but this isn't bowles that you are taking up.

Don't go for the cheapest training you can. What you are learning may well save your life one day. Treat as such. If the worse came to the worse do you want the bargain basement training ? Or do you want the platinum plated executive version ?

3. Flying is the greatest thing ever

You will NEVER be sorry you got that pilots license. Still to this day I think about it, or tell somebody, and it still sends shivers down my spine that I know how to fly

[dont overfil]

Spend as much time as you can soaking up information at the flight school.
I was fortunate to get regular trips in the back seat and it's amazing what you can learn when you are not under pressure.

[Okavango]

Great Reply - USEFUL FOR FUTURE REFERENCE

Paul - thanks for that - that's absolutely excellent. Yes - I agree on the price and was going to go to the best school regardless, it's just luck that the intended school is the most competitive. If you could break down the £11k that would be fantastic (this seems very high even at todays rates?). This is exactly what I needed thanks again.

[Slopey]

11k is not high depending where you train. Watch out for landing fees - once you're into the circuit training you could rack up 40/50+ landings - if you tried that at Aberdeen for example - not that you could cos you'd never get to do circuits - it'd cost you 800-900 alone! (and a a hire rate of 150 + vat + landing fees, you'd be looking at +10k to train here).

Check how landing fees are charged, if it's per full stop, or per touch & go!

Personally I did the Florida route - all in just under £5k, 4.5 weeks, job done

Also - NEVER EVER pay up front!!!!

[IO540]

Average UK PPL time is 55 to 65hrs depending on who you ask.

Cost varies but £8000 is probably average.

Some did it in the min (45) but they were either exceptionally talented and young people, or they had copious amounts of unlogged flying time with other pilots.

If you can pull off a lot of flying time as a passenger, with a good pilot, you will easily do a PPL in the minimum time.

The USA is still cheaper but fuel costs have risen steeply so it's not as cheap as it used to be.

The single most important factor is whether you can fly every day and treat it as a full time project with no distractions. It has been done in the UK but rarely because of weather and also most people prefer to fit the PPL into their lifestyle. Whereas if they go to the USA they fly all the time which obviously helps.

I would recommend Arizona over Florida. However the only CAA approved school (for a JAA PPL) outside Florida is in S California. All the others will give you an FAA PPL.

[mike172]

I did my PPL with Cambridge Aero Club so I didn't pay any landing fees. All in all I would say I spent a little over £8000 including equipment, books and test fees etc. Not bad considering I flew in modern Cessna 172SP's with very good instructors and nice facilities.

I would agree with IO540 in that you should try to have lessons as frequently as possible. You'll finish much quicker that way and save yourself some cash as well. I passed in 50 hours but my training was spread over two years due to college, weather, part time work and a lack of cash. I did often have large breaks in my training, once I had almost five months between lessons.

If I could do it again I would have finished college first so I could concentrate solely on flying. That said, I don't regret starting and completing my PPL at all. In fact I'm pretty proud that I managed to study for my A-levels, earn money and pay for my training myself.

£5,500 does seem like good value so go for it and have fun!

[RTN11]

Mine probably cost me around £8-9k over 2 years and about 70 hours (my 1st 14 hours were an RAF flying scholarship, then didn't fly for 8 months so pretty much had to start from scratch).

£5k does sound cheap, and it's about what I was quoted for my training. If you go over the 45 hours, or do more dual than was budgeted for then the cost goes up. Also, you've got to get your medical and pay licence fees, including the radio licence.

If I were you I'd budget for 60 hours at least. Worst case senario, you finish in 45, and you have money left to build some experience. Better than going way over budget, and having to worry about finances half way through the licence.

[TommyGun]

Jersey Aero Club 45 hour PPL Course including equipment/tutorials/radio telepphony test/all ground exams/final skill test (no extra landing fee cost) £5665.00

I know this is probably no good to you, but if you could take 4/5 weeks off work, you get class A and class D airspace under your belt and awesome cross country experience to France/UK/Guernsey/Alderney.

JAC also organise great rates at a local guest house, so all in would still be cheaper than the UK.

(£11k sounds painfully steep)

Just a quick note, I thoroughly recommend IMC rating as well as PPL as it does sharpen your skills considerably.

[Top Gunn]

I'd say circa 60 hours on average.

As with PompeyPaul, I was on the money too. Did my first hour in Nov and Skills Test in May of the following year. Solo in 9h45 - end Jan (still waiting for my medical until then!) Biggest gap between lessons was 4 weeks (weather at end Nov/early Dec was pathetic, caused much frustration! Then 3 wks in Feb, wx again!) Managed to get a week's worth in during the April where I racked up 18h40! QXC @ 27h15. I booked to fly once a week, sometimes got the odd extra hour in but couldn't do Sat and Sun due to instructor unavailable; they need time off too!

Total cost in the region of £6k (fuel was slightly cheaper then!) which included most of the hours on C152, some on PA28-161, exam fees, nav eqpt (charts etc), license issue, medical AND club membership (landing fees, circuits included). Not sure of their costs right now but I can highly recommend the school I used. CFI & DCFI both top blokes but that might be no help to you considering your relative location!

Top tips;

1. Be prepared to get weathered off or not to have access to serviceable aircraft; even with 4 or 5 available to me during the time I learnt, there was the odd occasion where there was nothing as school a/c have a tendency to go tech rather often (not surprising the amount they get bashed around by students!)

2. Stick with it, sometimes you'll get frustrated. It isn't the instructor's fault if the wx is pants! Use this time wisely to get the theory under your belt. Get your R/T practical done as early as you can or you'll be waiting around for an R/T examiner after you've passed your Skills Test and can't get your license issued until you've passed this one.

3. If you can fit 4 flights a week in during the Summer, I'll take my hat off to you. Not only are you going to be competing with others for aircraft availability (it isn't just student pilots who want the aircraft), you need to consider instructor availability too (perhaps they might want to take Summer holidays?) Furthermore, the school won't want to rush you too much; they know they've got a steady income stream out of you over an average period; they need to protect their interests. Final point on this one is that believe it or not, learning to fly is both mentally and physically hard work. Don't underestimate how tired you'll be after more than 60-90 mins in the saddle, especially when you roll the Nav into the mix!

4. Enjoy it - at the end of this you will be a qualified pilot (then the learning really begins)! Don't let any of the above put you off, just trying to put things into perspective for you.

Best of luck, whichever route you choose (check NOTAMS first though)

Stood by for flames......

[bjornhall]

Sounds like a lot of good suggestions here! But, you can do it all "wrong" (as in, not following the advice given here) and still get your license at a reasonable cost and within reasonable time. What I am saying is, if you can follow the advice, by all means do! If you can't, get the licence anyway; no point putting it off because you can't fly every day or whatever.

E.g., myself:
"Always shop around to find the best school available" - Only one school available in my area, so that went out the window.

"The most important thing is to find a good instructor and stick with him/her" - So far I have flown with 6 different instructors, and been assigned to another 2 who left for greener pastures before I even had time to fly with them...

"Budget for 55/60/75 hours" - I didn't budget at all.

"It's imperative to fly regularly, with several lessons per week and no long gaps between lessons" - I flew 3 hours in 2006, 9 hours in 2007 and 1 hour in the first three months of 2008, because my school was unable to recruit any instructors.

Still look set to get the licence this summer, in 46 - 47 hours all in all. So remember, the advice you get might be the best way of doing it, but it's not the only way of doing it!

[Gertrude the Wombat]

It's still the wrong question.

(Unless you're intending to get the licence, tick it off as "done that", and move on to cave diving or whatever else is next on your list.)

The right question is: "once I've got the licence, can I afford to keep flying, year on year, as much as I want to?".

That's the income question. The "how much does a PPL cost" is a capital question - almost anyone can add £8k to their mortgage as a one-off and not notice it.

[flybymike]

60 hours, 18 months, 2 lessons a week, 50% lost due weather, £2500, but then that was twenty five years ago...

[PompeyPaul]

Not a bad deal!

60 hours, 18 months, 2 lessons a week, 50% lost due weather, £2500, but then that was twenty five years ago...

In 2007, £2,500.00 from 1983 is worth

£6,078.25 using the retail price index.
http://www.measuringworth.com/ppower...ar_result=2007

[Piper.Classique]

Forty hours, £28.00 per hour, bearing in mind that I was an apprentice being paid £25.00 per week, so I needed a second job. Book, exam fees on top, over two years because that's how little money I had so I had to do it that way. Wx cancellations, but very strict with myself about only flying when I could progress, so as to save the maximum amount of money. At the time an approved course was 35 hours, ordinary course 40 hours min. I actually scraped in at 39 hours 45 mins, on a scruffy C150, with about five hours on a SF25 owned by the gliding club (got that in return for helping with the refabric of the SF25). Would have loved to learn on a chipmunk, but the 150 was cheaper and nearer home. I didn't have a car so couldn't travel far anyway. The second job was essential This was in 1981 and I always managed to continue to fly since, though at least once I had to renew by test due to lack of hours. Of course I was young and keen! Things got better when I got a job as a bus driver, and could afford to fly a lot more.
I see that would now cost £3,093.93 plus the books and exams

[astir 8]

Check old threads about "how many hours it took to solo". There's a fairly hard link with age as well as continuity and instructing quality.

[TommyGun]

Took me 11 hours to go solo, but I was lucky enough to get an RAF flying scholarship and was sent to Dundee for 3 weeks to do 20 hours flying.

[Julian]

60 hours, 18 months, 2 lessons a week, 50% lost due weather, £2500, but then that was twenty five years ago...

I took mine in '02 for £2500 and 62 hours over 4 weeks. The most I have heard in the UK was a mate who did his at MSF, 12 months and £17,000!!!

J.

[Piper.Classique]

Took me 11 hours to go solo, but I was lucky enough to get an RAF flying scholarship and was sent to Dundee for 3 weeks to do 20 hours flying.

So, based on solo at 11 hours, how many hours from there to the licence?
Allowing for all the mandatory times, looks like a solo between ten and fifteen hours should allow for a licence in under fifty hours assuming no major problems later. This said, everyone seems to stick somewhere, very few just sail through. Might be interesting to know what most posters found hardest for them.

[airborne_artist]

Their package is competitive at £5500 all inclusive

What are the payment terns for this package?