Camping by Air - Dangerous Goods?
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Essex
Posts: 128
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Camping by Air - Dangerous Goods?
I'm quite taken by the idea of "camping under the wing" - as seen in various fly-in photos, but how does this work in practice?
When I think about some of the equipment I've taken camping in our old VW or a tent in the past, much of it is probably deemed hazardous for taking on a private flight (or commercial, for that matter); gas stove, matches/lighters, etc.
So what happens in reality? Is "camping under the wing" simply a tent, sleeping bag and enough cash for a taxi to the nearest pub/restaurant, or can you legally carry what you need for a cuppa and some breakfast?
When I think about some of the equipment I've taken camping in our old VW or a tent in the past, much of it is probably deemed hazardous for taking on a private flight (or commercial, for that matter); gas stove, matches/lighters, etc.
So what happens in reality? Is "camping under the wing" simply a tent, sleeping bag and enough cash for a taxi to the nearest pub/restaurant, or can you legally carry what you need for a cuppa and some breakfast?
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Amsterdam
Posts: 4,598
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
My MSR Whisperlite is supposed to work fine on 100LL. I can store that in the aircrafts tanks, together with the rest of the fuel, until I need it. But if you're trying to cook on gas (as in Camping Gaz or something like that) I guess it's a matter of defying the law, or eat out.
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Abroad
Posts: 1,172
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Gas stoves should be Ok at the altitudes you'll be flying. After all, I carry and use mine at >10,000ft (although I get up there the old fashioned way: on foot and/or hands), so as far as canister pressures is concerned, that's not a problem. As for the risk of escape and ignition, well, that's up to you to judge it.
Having said that, if you're on just a weekend escapade and not going anywhere particularly remote, just eat cold food and use a thermos for your coffee/tea. The idea is to keep it simple.
Having said that, if you're on just a weekend escapade and not going anywhere particularly remote, just eat cold food and use a thermos for your coffee/tea. The idea is to keep it simple.
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Abroad
Posts: 1,172
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I wasn't referring to Boyle's law, but the ANO
"Arrêté du 2 février 2004 relatif aux formations de site, aux qualifications montagne et aux équipements requis pour le vol en montagne en avion" refers
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Cambridge, UK
Posts: 112
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
With 100LL actually having quite a lot of lead in it, is it a good idea to cook food with it? (genuine question - I'm willing to believe it's not a problem, but would like to see some substantiation)
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Amsterdam
Posts: 4,598
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
With 100LL actually having quite a lot of lead in it, is it a good idea to cook food with it?
With a few basic hygienic precautions this can be quite safe. Just make sure the soot on the outside of your pans doesn't get in contact with the food in any way (through your hands for instance) and only put food on the stove when the stove is fully heated up (blue instead of yellow flame). Also, don't roast anything over an open flame.
In addition to this, most stoves that burn liquid fuel instead of gas can be field-stripped and cleaned completely with minimum tools and if you cook on a fuel with additives in it, you need to clean regularly. All part of the charm, as far as I'm concerned.
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: UK
Posts: 45
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
LH2, I wasn't referring to Boyle's law, but the ANO. 
Rule 1 - Don't carry Dangerous Goods
Rule 2 - Rule 1 doesn't apply if you have permission from the CAA
Rule 3 - If you want permission from the CAA here are the hoops, please sart jumping.
Try this.... http://www.caa.co.uk/docs/1219/20080...tCanICarry.pdf
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Essex
Posts: 128
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Thanks everyone for your replies and links. 
I'm not in a position for camping by air yet, as I am still training, but hopefully I'll be able to put your recommendations to good use in the not too distant future. Must admit, I hadn't thought of petrol fuelled stoves, but I'm thinking the easiest solution will be thermos & pub!
Ta,
Red x
I'm not in a position for camping by air yet, as I am still training, but hopefully I'll be able to put your recommendations to good use in the not too distant future. Must admit, I hadn't thought of petrol fuelled stoves, but I'm thinking the easiest solution will be thermos & pub!
Ta,
Red x
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: EuroGA.org
Posts: 13,787
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
That CAA leaflet obviously applies to public transport.
I am not aware of any dangerous goods prohibition (other than weapons but that is a different subject altogether) on private flights, either G-reg or N-reg, in any European airspace.
The biggest problem I see with "camping under the wing" is that almost no airport or airfield will let you.
I am not aware of any dangerous goods prohibition (other than weapons but that is a different subject altogether) on private flights, either G-reg or N-reg, in any European airspace.
The biggest problem I see with "camping under the wing" is that almost no airport or airfield will let you.
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Manchester
Age: 40
Posts: 94
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Who needs gas...?
Whats wrong with a bag of charcoal and some fire lighters!?
Can't beat a good barbeque and most are very light and will flat pack with the aid of some basic tools... although, it is not advisable to set one up inside your tent though.
Whats wrong with a bag of charcoal and some fire lighters!?
Can't beat a good barbeque and most are very light and will flat pack with the aid of some basic tools... although, it is not advisable to set one up inside your tent though.
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Hellfire Corner
Posts: 374
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
The biggest problem I see with "camping under the wing" is that almost no airport or airfield will let you.
WR's system hasn't destroyed the Aeronca Club fleet yet, but the price of Avgas is making those breakfasts look something of a luxury.
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Kent UK
Posts: 42
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Checkout www.lyddaero.co.uk - Flying WAGS, item 4 of their charter. Sorry a bit of a thread change, but couldn't help it.
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Amsterdam
Posts: 4,598
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I am not aware of any dangerous goods prohibition (other than weapons but that is a different subject altogether) on private flights
Without prejudice to any other provisions of this Order, the Secretary of State may make regulations prescribing —
(a) the classification of certain articles and substances as dangerous goods;
(b) the categories of dangerous goods which an aircraft may not carry;
(c) the conditions which apply to the loading on, suspension beneath and carriage by an aircraft of dangerous goods
.......
(a) the classification of certain articles and substances as dangerous goods;
(b) the categories of dangerous goods which an aircraft may not carry;
(c) the conditions which apply to the loading on, suspension beneath and carriage by an aircraft of dangerous goods
.......
Furthermore, CAP393, section 7, seems to apply to all types of aircraft (GA and public transport) and specifically prohibits dangerous goods unless the operator has a certificate:
http://www.caa.co.uk/docs/33/CAP393.pdf
So my conclusion is that dangerous goods are prohibited on private flights.
And yes, the list of dangerous goods includes camping gas containers and flammable liquids.
Whats wrong with a bag of charcoal and some fire lighters!?
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Abroad
Posts: 1,172
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
That CAA leaflet obviously applies to public transport.
other than weapons
Talk about digressions, but what about if you're flying privately to Svalbard (Norway)? You are supposed to carry a high-powered rifle with you (and know how to use it) in case you enter into discussions with a bear on what to have for dinner.
Whats wrong with a bag of charcoal and some fire lighters!?
I hadn't thought of those single-use BBQs they sell at petrol stations (along with bags of charcoal). Well, they do that in Norway anyway, not sure I've seen them in the UK.I think I've posted this one before, but what the hell, here it goes again:
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: EuroGA.org
Posts: 13,787
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I would find it hard to believe that airliner passenger stuff applies to GA.
For starters, you can carry all kinds of stuff in the hold (checked baggage). This includes guns (obviously you need a firearm or shotgun permit to carry one about in the first place but that's a separate issue).
What relevance is the "in the hold" distinction to GA?
Common sense would seem to be more important. I would be concerned about carrying a flammable liquid container that was leaking, or a laptop with a huge lithium polymer battery. I suppose that one advantage of a Cessna is that you can always open the door and chuck the laptop out
For starters, you can carry all kinds of stuff in the hold (checked baggage). This includes guns (obviously you need a firearm or shotgun permit to carry one about in the first place but that's a separate issue).
What relevance is the "in the hold" distinction to GA?
Common sense would seem to be more important. I would be concerned about carrying a flammable liquid container that was leaking, or a laptop with a huge lithium polymer battery. I suppose that one advantage of a Cessna is that you can always open the door and chuck the laptop out
Red On, Green On
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Between the woods and the water
Age: 24
Posts: 6,487
Likes: 0
Received 2 Likes
on
2 Posts
You may find that your insurance co. is more interested in dangerous items in the aircraft than the CAA. However, given that the most dangerous item in a light aircraft is probably the chap/chapess holding the stick, perhaps not
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Amsterdam
Posts: 4,598
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Weapons
Weapons and "munitions of war" have their own separate article in the ANO, article 69. Again, seems to apply to all aircraft, GA included, and the article seems to apply the same principles as dangerous goods: cannot do, unless with permission from the CAA. There is one exception for police vehicles so that the police officer on board can carry his weapon, and there's this:
So if you intend to discuss dinner plans with a bear in Canada or Norway, you can legally take a rifle with you.
Nothing in this article shall apply to any sporting weapon or munition of war taken or carried on board an aircraft registered in a country other than the United Kingdom if the sporting weapon or munition of war, as the case may be, may under the law of the country in which the aircraft is registered be lawfully taken or carried on board for the purpose of ensuring the safety of the aircraft or of persons on board.
