Operating a Foreign homebuilt in the UK
Thread Starter
Joined: Dec 2004
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From: East Anglia
Operating a Foreign homebuilt in the UK
Does anyone know what the rules are for operating an aircraft on the Swedish Homebuilt register in the UK?
This would be a Giles 202 composite aircraft which is not 'approved' by the PFA. It was also built as a certified aircraft by CAP as the CAP222.
There is already a homebuilt Giles 202 flying on the Swedish register and that was imported from the US as an EAA aircraft.
I am thinking of doing the same but want to understand any Gotchas beforehand. I am thinking of importing the A/C from the US to Sweden and putting it on the Swedish register. I would then operate it in the UK but get the annuals etc done in Sweden ( this is a paperwork exercise so the aircraft could stay in the UK).
Many thanks for helpful answers
This would be a Giles 202 composite aircraft which is not 'approved' by the PFA. It was also built as a certified aircraft by CAP as the CAP222.
There is already a homebuilt Giles 202 flying on the Swedish register and that was imported from the US as an EAA aircraft.
I am thinking of doing the same but want to understand any Gotchas beforehand. I am thinking of importing the A/C from the US to Sweden and putting it on the Swedish register. I would then operate it in the UK but get the annuals etc done in Sweden ( this is a paperwork exercise so the aircraft could stay in the UK).
Many thanks for helpful answers
Joined: Oct 2007
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From: england
I do not think you can do this. A Swedish aircraft in their home built category cannot be flown in this country without specific permission and on a very temporary basis.
The Cap 222 was never certified because the money to complete the job was lacking once it became clear that a substantial redesign was needed following the fatal crash in France when the rear end detached.
The Cap built 202 that was operated over here was on a CAA permit I believe. It may be that you could get one of those but that or an EASA permit seem to me to be the only hope.
I hope I am wrong because the 202 is a wonderful bit of kit. But this is my understanding of the position anyway.
The Cap 222 was never certified because the money to complete the job was lacking once it became clear that a substantial redesign was needed following the fatal crash in France when the rear end detached.
The Cap built 202 that was operated over here was on a CAA permit I believe. It may be that you could get one of those but that or an EASA permit seem to me to be the only hope.
I hope I am wrong because the 202 is a wonderful bit of kit. But this is my understanding of the position anyway.
Joined: Jan 2002
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From: Niort
thirty seconds with the search facility would have given you the answer - I'll save you the trouble.
Foreign homebuilts can visit for a month, with CAA permission there can stay for 3 months.
So you should get plenty of touring experience in if you go down this route!
The CAA have been wish to this ruse for a long time.....
Foreign homebuilts can visit for a month, with CAA permission there can stay for 3 months.
So you should get plenty of touring experience in if you go down this route!
The CAA have been wish to this ruse for a long time.....
Joined: Apr 2003
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From: Midlands
Give Francis Donaldson a call at PFA engineering, or send him an email. He will advise you of the current position re the a/c. If one has been put on a CAA permit then this is the obvious route to take.
Rod
Rod
Joined: Aug 2000
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From: S Warwickshire
There aren't any Giles homebuilts on the UK register, although the One-Design has gone through the PFA system.
I have previously bought a homebuilt in from Sweden and had the one month allowed by AWN52 before getting a UK permit through the PFA.
The Giles certainly fits within the parameters that the PFA are allowed to administer, but as a 'first of type' would require investigation by them to get approval of the design.
That is going to take a bit of time and money, but is, in principle, do-able.
The full list of currently accepted PFA types is at:
http://www.pfanet.co.uk/Engineering%...0by%20Type.pdf
I have previously bought a homebuilt in from Sweden and had the one month allowed by AWN52 before getting a UK permit through the PFA.
The Giles certainly fits within the parameters that the PFA are allowed to administer, but as a 'first of type' would require investigation by them to get approval of the design.
That is going to take a bit of time and money, but is, in principle, do-able.
The full list of currently accepted PFA types is at:
http://www.pfanet.co.uk/Engineering%...0by%20Type.pdf
Thread Starter
Joined: Dec 2004
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From: East Anglia
Mark 1,
I have looked at the list. Unfortunately, there are no two seaters capable of Advanced aerobatics competition in it.
I am looking for an aircraft that can compete at Advanced when flown solo, but which also has a second seat to take my children to a contest or to show someone a lazy roll and loop on a Sunday. The Pitts S2 and Extra fit the bill but neither are PFA.
The Giles would fit my requirements perfectly.
ZA
I have looked at the list. Unfortunately, there are no two seaters capable of Advanced aerobatics competition in it.
I am looking for an aircraft that can compete at Advanced when flown solo, but which also has a second seat to take my children to a contest or to show someone a lazy roll and loop on a Sunday. The Pitts S2 and Extra fit the bill but neither are PFA.
The Giles would fit my requirements perfectly.
ZA
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 143
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From: East Sussex
CR100
Hi , there is a CR100 for sale on www.afors.co.uk, plus 8,minus 6, two seats and on a PFA aerobatic permit, full inverted and 3 blade MT, not mine but flew her for check flight today !
Will.
Will.
Joined: Aug 2000
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From: Norfolk
I believe that there are two, two hole S2's on permits. One lives not far from ZA. The other (G-PITS) is on rebuild in Ireland.
David, go the whole hog and just order a new Extra 300. You know you want to!
Stik
David, go the whole hog and just order a new Extra 300. You know you want to!
Stik
Thread Starter
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 832
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From: East Anglia
Stik,
I can only afford the left wing of an EA300, but just need someone to buy the right one. Mr Goff didn't respond to calls or a letter. If you know someone else, I have a nice EA300 in my sights and a hangar and strip for it.
Just missed a great EA200, where I could have afforded both wings!!
ZA
I can only afford the left wing of an EA300, but just need someone to buy the right one. Mr Goff didn't respond to calls or a letter. If you know someone else, I have a nice EA300 in my sights and a hangar and strip for it.
Just missed a great EA200, where I could have afforded both wings!!
ZA
Joined: Aug 2000
Posts: 1,966
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From: Norfolk
ZA
Fixate more on yourself and Elaine - she will get to go places with you in the new Extra. This is not a dress rehersal mate, this is your once-only chance around the block. Your kids are bright/savvy enough to do well for themselves without you gift-wrapping their future in the Extra that you never had!
My folk spend all their time "skiing" - spending the kids inheritance!
Love
Stik
Fixate more on yourself and Elaine - she will get to go places with you in the new Extra. This is not a dress rehersal mate, this is your once-only chance around the block. Your kids are bright/savvy enough to do well for themselves without you gift-wrapping their future in the Extra that you never had!
My folk spend all their time "skiing" - spending the kids inheritance!
Love
Stik
A little less conversation,
a little more aviation...
Joined: Jun 2003
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From: Bracknell, UK
Originally Posted by tigerbatics
Thought about an Eagle? There are a fair number about and it is rather nicer than an S2 and a PFA machine as well.
ZA - if you haven't done so already, talk to AC about the process of putting the 222/202 on the UK register; very sadly, I don't think its ever going to happen again.
I hear rumours about the MX2 being brought onto the register, but they're exactly that - rumours.
Joined: Aug 2000
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From: Norfolk
As someone who has both an Eagle and an S2 in his hangar, "an Eagle is rather nicer than an S2", did make me smile!
Nicer if you want to trundle down to the coast with ageing aunt on a Sunday afternoon and show her a loop.
The roll rate is atrocious, I've only flown 4 different Eagles and none of them were "stellar" about the longitudanal axis.
The MX is not without its critics Stateside - and I mean chaps that have flown it.
Nicer if you want to trundle down to the coast with ageing aunt on a Sunday afternoon and show her a loop.
The roll rate is atrocious, I've only flown 4 different Eagles and none of them were "stellar" about the longitudanal axis.
The MX is not without its critics Stateside - and I mean chaps that have flown it.
Joined: Oct 2007
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From: england
There must be four very odd eagles about. The three I have flown were identical to all the Pitts S2s in roll that I have flown, save one which the Tiger club had several years ago and that was really terrible.
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From: Norfolk
Tigerbatics - all four Eagles (G-reg) roll at about the same roll-rate, one (Justiciar's) is nominally more adept and is far faster, than the others S&L.
But to compare them to a late, symmetrical aileron, spade enabled S2 - is pure fantasy.
All 4 Eagles will run away from my similiarly powered S2.
But to compare them to a late, symmetrical aileron, spade enabled S2 - is pure fantasy.
All 4 Eagles will run away from my similiarly powered S2.