Diamond 40.. A good a/c to fly?
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Diamond 40.. A good a/c to fly?
Hi all,
Looking at possibly converting into a Diamond 40 within the near future. I've had a look around once (very nice too) and I wondered what you all think of the a/c?
e.g. Handling, Safety, etc etc
Many thanks, much appeciated
Cirrus
Looking at possibly converting into a Diamond 40 within the near future. I've had a look around once (very nice too) and I wondered what you all think of the a/c?
e.g. Handling, Safety, etc etc
Many thanks, much appeciated
Cirrus
The Cooler King
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Can you show me how to do that trick!!! 
Seriously though, the Diamond is a lovely aircraft to fly with great visibility, especially if you are coming off of a high winged machine like the 172.
As bugsmashers go, it's in a league of it's own. Of course it would need to be flight tested by me for a day or two so let me know when you get it!
Seriously though, the Diamond is a lovely aircraft to fly with great visibility, especially if you are coming off of a high winged machine like the 172.
As bugsmashers go, it's in a league of it's own. Of course it would need to be flight tested by me for a day or two so let me know when you get it!
Join Date: Feb 2006
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Very easy to fly, and it will be newer than whet you are used to.
Performance is good and the fuel econ is great.
Also depends on G1000 or Classic, either way, great to fly.
EI
Performance is good and the fuel econ is great.
Also depends on G1000 or Classic, either way, great to fly.
EI
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If you are used to something relatively powerful (180hp +) then you will be disappointed in the performance on the takeoff roll. It maybe modern, but it is still only 135hp. The same with the initial climbout.
Handling is very good, the stall is a non-event, visibility is good and the pre takeoff checks are simplicity themselves.
Overall a nice machine, but still with a few issues in regard to reliability. If only there was a 200hp diesel version!
Handling is very good, the stall is a non-event, visibility is good and the pre takeoff checks are simplicity themselves.
Overall a nice machine, but still with a few issues in regard to reliability. If only there was a 200hp diesel version!
Join Date: Jul 2003
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Ive just finished my check out on the DA40, im a low hour PPL and previously trained on the C152 and PA28.
The Diamond is very nice to fly, comfortable and relatively quiet inside.
The main differences are things like FADEC, fuel transfer and having not only working and up to date sat nav but all radio's and nav equipment working which if you have flown the typical C152 and PA28 is a novelty, and also getting used to the higher speeds, you can catch people up in the circuit if your not careful with the numbers, set up well it easily cruises at 124kts, ground speed on Satuday was 139kts along the south coast !!
The walk around is simple however dipping the tanks is an interesting exercise !!
It does like to eat the runway on take off, would be interested to hear other people's view on restrictions on runway length such as operating through Bembridge and Sandown which are my regular haunts.
Visibility is very good so enjoy !!
OA
The Diamond is very nice to fly, comfortable and relatively quiet inside.
The main differences are things like FADEC, fuel transfer and having not only working and up to date sat nav but all radio's and nav equipment working which if you have flown the typical C152 and PA28 is a novelty, and also getting used to the higher speeds, you can catch people up in the circuit if your not careful with the numbers, set up well it easily cruises at 124kts, ground speed on Satuday was 139kts along the south coast !!
The walk around is simple however dipping the tanks is an interesting exercise !!
It does like to eat the runway on take off, would be interested to hear other people's view on restrictions on runway length such as operating through Bembridge and Sandown which are my regular haunts.
Visibility is very good so enjoy !!
OA
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If i was buying a DA40 now, for IFR touring around Europe, I would buy the 180HP Lyco avgas version.
According to Diamond's own figures (ref: Loop magazine advert) there is a £20/hour difference in total operating costs, and when you factor in the huge price difference there is no contest.
And that's before one considers the big performance difference at anything below 8000ft or so. Funny how Diamond quote runway lengths for the avgas version, and quote fuel economy figures for the diesel version
Diesels (or something burning avtur) are definitely the technology of tomorrow, but "tomorrow" (in terms of proven reliability) is not here yet.
According to Diamond's own figures (ref: Loop magazine advert) there is a £20/hour difference in total operating costs, and when you factor in the huge price difference there is no contest.
And that's before one considers the big performance difference at anything below 8000ft or so. Funny how Diamond quote runway lengths for the avgas version, and quote fuel economy figures for the diesel version
Diesels (or something burning avtur) are definitely the technology of tomorrow, but "tomorrow" (in terms of proven reliability) is not here yet.
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nice to fly but dog slow. the G1000 is great to use but give me a Cessna with a G1000 any day.
I fly the TDI version regularily for a guy who needs to go on business trips and does not have an IR. I flew the avgas version from Florida to Halifax and back. The avgas version is a much better aircraft, faster (not cessna fast) and of course much better on the ground roll.
The tdi is a good airways machine as the turbo keeps the power on to a good FL but at those levels the gap is very narrow in TAS. The tdi wins on the economy on a long haul.
Given the choice I would buy a Cessna 182 probably Turbo with a G1000 fit.
I fly the TDI version regularily for a guy who needs to go on business trips and does not have an IR. I flew the avgas version from Florida to Halifax and back. The avgas version is a much better aircraft, faster (not cessna fast) and of course much better on the ground roll.
The tdi is a good airways machine as the turbo keeps the power on to a good FL but at those levels the gap is very narrow in TAS. The tdi wins on the economy on a long haul.
Given the choice I would buy a Cessna 182 probably Turbo with a G1000 fit.
Some articles here;
http://philip.greenspun.com/bboard/q...viation&topic=
DA40XL;
http://www.avweb.com/eletter/archive.../679-full.html
http://www.aero-news.net/news/genav....8CCF&Dynamic=1
C182 Turbo likes its fuel, 14-16 gallons /hr in cruise.
Compared to the DA-40 series, heavy to fly also.
I have never flown the DA-40 TDI only the Avgas versions.
The DA40XL will get a payload increase and with a speed of almost 160 kts it beats the 182 for sure.
Don't forget this is basically glider technology and still severely overdesigned.
Gliders that can pull 4-5 g's have a tail with the circumference of a soda can.
Diamond wouldn't bother putting a double spar in the wing if the tail would not hold up.
The maintenance manual is free to download from the Diamond website;
http://www.diamondair.com/pdfs/owner...40/DA40AMM.pdf
Look up the section fuselage and the section wings.
So is the POH/AFM
http://80.121.174.62/support/PDF/DA4...7-complete.pdf
The G1000 handbook is free to download from the Garmin website here:
http://www.garmin.com/support/userMa...t=010-G1000-DI
As far as subjective reasoning goes;
Would you rather board your airplane dry (temporary) but have less visibility in flight (permanent)?
Would you rather be cooler on the ground (temporary) but have less visibility in flight (permanent)?
http://philip.greenspun.com/bboard/q...viation&topic=
DA40XL;
http://www.avweb.com/eletter/archive.../679-full.html
http://www.aero-news.net/news/genav....8CCF&Dynamic=1
C182 Turbo likes its fuel, 14-16 gallons /hr in cruise.
Compared to the DA-40 series, heavy to fly also.
I have never flown the DA-40 TDI only the Avgas versions.
The DA40XL will get a payload increase and with a speed of almost 160 kts it beats the 182 for sure.
but i'm not sure about the narrow rear fuselage.
Gliders that can pull 4-5 g's have a tail with the circumference of a soda can.
Diamond wouldn't bother putting a double spar in the wing if the tail would not hold up.
The maintenance manual is free to download from the Diamond website;
http://www.diamondair.com/pdfs/owner...40/DA40AMM.pdf
Look up the section fuselage and the section wings.
So is the POH/AFM
http://80.121.174.62/support/PDF/DA4...7-complete.pdf
The G1000 handbook is free to download from the Garmin website here:
http://www.garmin.com/support/userMa...t=010-G1000-DI
As far as subjective reasoning goes;
Would you rather board your airplane dry (temporary) but have less visibility in flight (permanent)?
Would you rather be cooler on the ground (temporary) but have less visibility in flight (permanent)?
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Seeing is believing on the performance figures and 160kts will be an eye opener. To date they have failed to deliver any of the promised performance.
Also very naughty quoting TAS at 10,000ft.
Not knocking them, they are a joy to fly, but I stiull think a Cessna beats them hands down at the moment.
Also very naughty quoting TAS at 10,000ft.
Not knocking them, they are a joy to fly, but I stiull think a Cessna beats them hands down at the moment.
Ok,Ok, my disclaimer
I said "almost", that leaves some room for interpretation.
From the Lancair website:
and
mmmm, and using mph in stead of kts, I like that, numbers are higher, maybe Diamond should use kilometrs/hr on their website.
160 kts= 290km/hr.
almost 160 kts
From the Lancair website:
Cruise
@ 24,000 ft. (typical)
330 mph
@ 24,000 ft. (typical)
330 mph
@ 8,000 ft. (typical)
Superior TIO-360
Lycoming IO-390
@ 24,000 ft. (typical)
Superior TIO-360
Lycoming IO-390
210 mph
220 mph
260 mph
n/a
Superior TIO-360
Lycoming IO-390
@ 24,000 ft. (typical)
Superior TIO-360
Lycoming IO-390
210 mph
220 mph
260 mph
n/a
mmmm, and using mph in stead of kts, I like that, numbers are higher, maybe Diamond should use kilometrs/hr on their website.
160 kts= 290km/hr.
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Another thing to consider is the stick vs yoke situation, all Diamondairs have a stick. Seats are (or at least were - it's been a while) non-adjustable, however the pedals are.
Chocks away!
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Sorry to go slightly off-topic, but does anyone have any experience of "Flying Time" based at Shoreham (the old Flying Hut club maybe?) who have a fleet of DA40's plus a Twin Star?
Thanks.
Thanks.
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The DA40D overall is a super aircraft.
Compared to a traditional SEP the aircraft is a lot more streamlined and I guess its power-to-weight ratio is also lower. So it demands superior speed control and anticipation. But calculate your speeds to fly correctly (depending on the weight of the aircraft) and fly accurately and you'll be safe.
Its glide performance is also excellent which makes PFL's different and, once you are attuned to it, easier as your glide range is better.
Exceptional visibility, ergonomics, FADEC and traditional stick controls all make for a pleasant experience.
And, last of all, cost. Despite its 125 kt cruise it's a cost effective ride.
Try it.
Compared to a traditional SEP the aircraft is a lot more streamlined and I guess its power-to-weight ratio is also lower. So it demands superior speed control and anticipation. But calculate your speeds to fly correctly (depending on the weight of the aircraft) and fly accurately and you'll be safe.
Its glide performance is also excellent which makes PFL's different and, once you are attuned to it, easier as your glide range is better.
Exceptional visibility, ergonomics, FADEC and traditional stick controls all make for a pleasant experience.
And, last of all, cost. Despite its 125 kt cruise it's a cost effective ride.
Try it.
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I have some time on the 42, a bit less on the 40, both the diesel versions. The 42 has the G1000 fitted as standard. It is the pedals that move not the seats. The argument is this makes for a far more rigid seat construction and therefore presumably it is easier to meet the impact safety specifications.
The FADEC appears to work very well. However on both the 40 and 42 the power reduction is far more linear than for a conventional engine. In consequence, and combined with a very clean airframe, the approach technique is more like a turbo prop.
In my view both aircraft are ideally a little under powered so expect longer take off runs and less load carrying ability, however on the plus side in the cruise the performance is exceptional and given the fuel consumption, the range is astonishing. The cockpit is modern and well designed. In the G1000 version I think it would be difficult to beet the cockpit ergonomics.
The FADEC appears to work very well. However on both the 40 and 42 the power reduction is far more linear than for a conventional engine. In consequence, and combined with a very clean airframe, the approach technique is more like a turbo prop.
In my view both aircraft are ideally a little under powered so expect longer take off runs and less load carrying ability, however on the plus side in the cruise the performance is exceptional and given the fuel consumption, the range is astonishing. The cockpit is modern and well designed. In the G1000 version I think it would be difficult to beet the cockpit ergonomics.
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The DA40-180 is lovely to fly. The controls are very responsive. Cruise at 2,000'-5,000' is 130kTAS at 75% power (~10 US gal/hour).
Rear-seat passengers report some yawing in turbulence that you can't feel in the front seats (and hence can't control). Actually it's probably too fast an oscillation to control anyway.
Take off performance is very good even at max weight (plenty of power) but the landing distance can be quite long when heavy.
Someone mentioned the seats -- yes, they're not adjustable but they fit me very well and I can happily sit in them for a 2-hour flight. I guess it depends on your shape (I'm tall and thin).
The DA40-TDI I haven't flown but it's certainly slower and has poorer take-off performance but much lower fuel costs.
Mark
Rear-seat passengers report some yawing in turbulence that you can't feel in the front seats (and hence can't control). Actually it's probably too fast an oscillation to control anyway.
Take off performance is very good even at max weight (plenty of power) but the landing distance can be quite long when heavy.
Someone mentioned the seats -- yes, they're not adjustable but they fit me very well and I can happily sit in them for a 2-hour flight. I guess it depends on your shape (I'm tall and thin).
The DA40-TDI I haven't flown but it's certainly slower and has poorer take-off performance but much lower fuel costs.
Mark
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The DA40D overall is a super aircraft.
Compared to a traditional SEP the aircraft is a lot more streamlined and I guess its power-to-weight ratio is also lower. So it demands superior speed control and anticipation. But calculate your speeds to fly correctly (depending on the weight of the aircraft) and fly accurately and you'll be safe.
Its glide performance is also excellent which makes PFL's different and, once you are attuned to it, easier as your glide range is better.
Exceptional visibility, ergonomics, FADEC and traditional stick controls all make for a pleasant experience.
And, last of all, cost. Despite its 125 kt cruise it's a cost effective ride.
Try it.
Compared to a traditional SEP the aircraft is a lot more streamlined and I guess its power-to-weight ratio is also lower. So it demands superior speed control and anticipation. But calculate your speeds to fly correctly (depending on the weight of the aircraft) and fly accurately and you'll be safe.
Its glide performance is also excellent which makes PFL's different and, once you are attuned to it, easier as your glide range is better.
Exceptional visibility, ergonomics, FADEC and traditional stick controls all make for a pleasant experience.
And, last of all, cost. Despite its 125 kt cruise it's a cost effective ride.
Try it.
Thread Starter
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WOW!! Lots of replies!! 
, many thanks all! .. now time to read them!
"Can you show me how to do that trick!!! "
Wouldn't you like to know
hehe! .. nice one
, many thanks all! .. now time to read them!"Can you show me how to do that trick!!! "
Wouldn't you like to know
hehe! .. nice one