8 year old predicts crash
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Aberdeen
Posts: 1,234
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I have flown a friend's Pa22 quite extensively. After the rebuild and weighing we complied an excel weight and balance chart which allowed rapid checking of all the possible parameters.
Interestingly it was impossible to exceed the aft limit if there was 200lbs in the front seats - and this aircraft had the extra rear fuel tank. In other words if you could get the doors to close, had one fat boy in the front and were under 2000lbs weight and balance was not an issue.
Neither was take off performance, light it leap into the air, heavy it flew like your typical spamcan.
But like all light aircraft it didn't like the heat. We transited through Popham on a very hot day at mauw and there was none of the usual rocket like performance. But it is plenty long enough - however with some loss of power or turbulence it would require a steady nerve and confidence.
Be interesting to see what the cause is determined as.
Interestingly it was impossible to exceed the aft limit if there was 200lbs in the front seats - and this aircraft had the extra rear fuel tank. In other words if you could get the doors to close, had one fat boy in the front and were under 2000lbs weight and balance was not an issue.
Neither was take off performance, light it leap into the air, heavy it flew like your typical spamcan.
But like all light aircraft it didn't like the heat. We transited through Popham on a very hot day at mauw and there was none of the usual rocket like performance. But it is plenty long enough - however with some loss of power or turbulence it would require a steady nerve and confidence.
Be interesting to see what the cause is determined as.
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Basingstoke
Age: 35
Posts: 185
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Interesting to note that none of the people who witnessed the crash heard anything unusual in the engine note. They did see plenty of other clues.
The ATC guy dialled 999 before it hit the ground and at least two people were running towards it well before it hit. An AAIB inspector was on the airfield at the time.
The people on the ground at Popham were superb and the folks inside were lucky. However, the passenger is very unlikely to be welcomed into Popham again after selling his photos and sensationalist story.
The ATC guy dialled 999 before it hit the ground and at least two people were running towards it well before it hit. An AAIB inspector was on the airfield at the time.
The people on the ground at Popham were superb and the folks inside were lucky. However, the passenger is very unlikely to be welcomed into Popham again after selling his photos and sensationalist story.
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Bristol
Posts: 35
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by gasax
But like all light aircraft it didn't like the heat. We transited through Popham on a very hot day at mauw and there was none of the usual rocket like performance. But it is plenty long enough - however with some loss of power or turbulence it would require a steady nerve and confidence.
Be interesting to see what the cause is determined as.
Be interesting to see what the cause is determined as.
The temp was around 33 and we noticed a reduction in our normal performance, our weight and balance was fine. We cleared the trees beyond 21, but there was a brief anxious moment that we thought we might 'brush our ass' on the trees
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Savannah GA & Portsmouth UK
Posts: 1,784
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
In the current weather there's an additional hazard.
Nice hot day, not much wind. All of a sudden a thermal lifts off and you have a very localised change in wind direction which could turn your 5 kt headwind into a tailwind.
Mike
Nice hot day, not much wind. All of a sudden a thermal lifts off and you have a very localised change in wind direction which could turn your 5 kt headwind into a tailwind.
Mike
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Massachusetts Bay Colony
Age: 57
Posts: 476
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by Captain Airclues
At last, someone who can answer my question. What is the gradient of runway 21?
Pitts2112
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Massachusetts Bay Colony
Age: 57
Posts: 476
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by FBS
No Pitts2112, he is asking a general question about 21, the Tripacer failed to fly from 26.
Sorry, but I don't know the exact slope. Why not give them a call?
01256 397733
All I know is that the slope on the approach end of 03 seems to exactly match the descent angle of my Pitts. I just seem to float forever on that d*&n runway just feeling for the ground....
Pitts2112
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Scotland
Posts: 71
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by FBS
The people on the ground at Popham were superb and the folks inside were lucky. However, the passenger is very unlikely to be welcomed into Popham again after selling his photos and sensationalist story.
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Savannah GA & Portsmouth UK
Posts: 1,784
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
We cleared the trees beyond 21, but there was a brief anxious moment that we thought we might 'brush our ass' on the trees
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Massachusetts Bay Colony
Age: 57
Posts: 476
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by scottish_ppl
Having seen the photos I would say this is one passenger that is fully entitled to tell his story as sensationally as he likes, to whoever he likes...
General Aviation overall
Popham airfield which kindly hosted him and looked after him and his family
His mate who was flying the airplane
The group of owners of the aircraft
Every right to do it. Still seems a very low-rent thing to do and he'll get very short shrift from me if he comes up to the field again.
Pitts2112
Perhaps he has contributed any revenue from this publicity towards the cost of replacing the aeroplane. If it was out of limits on take off performance it is unlikely that the insurance company will contribute.
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Massachusetts Bay Colony
Age: 57
Posts: 476
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by Captb747
Of course he could have done something quite simple in forgetting to turn the fuel on...........And before anyone says that its impossible........Its not
But could it have been a mere oversight on a checklist item as opposed to gross incompetence on behalf of the pilot as some would suggest? There would certainly be that possibility. That's the kind of issue we wait for the AAIB report to tell us.
Pitts2112
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Savannah GA & Portsmouth UK
Posts: 1,784
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Or it could be as simple as hauling it off and staggering along on the back of the drag curve with the airspeed reducing until it fell out of the sky.
None of us know the answer but if you want to speculate on why an aircraft within w&b limitations and fully serviceable fails to get away from the field that's one of them. Another would be localised windshear, caused for example by a thermal lifting off as alluded to earlier. In stronger wind conditions it could be turbulence of nearby obstructions that does it. It could be flying too close to the critical AoA so that it stalls in a gust.
All speculation as to the cause of course, and barring any evidence of mechanical failure the AAIB report is likely to to end up offering an opinion as to the factors that may have contributed rather than a definitive cause.
None of us know the answer but if you want to speculate on why an aircraft within w&b limitations and fully serviceable fails to get away from the field that's one of them. Another would be localised windshear, caused for example by a thermal lifting off as alluded to earlier. In stronger wind conditions it could be turbulence of nearby obstructions that does it. It could be flying too close to the critical AoA so that it stalls in a gust.
All speculation as to the cause of course, and barring any evidence of mechanical failure the AAIB report is likely to to end up offering an opinion as to the factors that may have contributed rather than a definitive cause.
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: sURREY
Posts: 117
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Yes absolutely correct. Speculation at this stage does not get anyone anywhere. Real Shame though. Enjoyed many trips to Sandown and Compton Abbas in CC along with IJ and PZ.........(when PZ was around)
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Earth
Posts: 1,189
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Popham is undoubtedly the best all round airfiled in the UK.
Any non-flying individuals who choose to shine a dark light on it for financial gain should walk the plank as far as I'm concerned.
Thousands of flyers pass through its visitors book annually. Some fly well. Some fly badly. Some can't fly for toffee. They all choose to visit though and make it what it is. Having Popham Airfield in the red-tops first five pages for bad reasons made my heart sink the morning after the incident.
If I went as a first time visitor to a Erotica event and sold my pictures to The Sun I would expect a bunch of perverts to chase me for my actions.....
Any non-flying individuals who choose to shine a dark light on it for financial gain should walk the plank as far as I'm concerned.
Thousands of flyers pass through its visitors book annually. Some fly well. Some fly badly. Some can't fly for toffee. They all choose to visit though and make it what it is. Having Popham Airfield in the red-tops first five pages for bad reasons made my heart sink the morning after the incident.
If I went as a first time visitor to a Erotica event and sold my pictures to The Sun I would expect a bunch of perverts to chase me for my actions.....
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Massachusetts Bay Colony
Age: 57
Posts: 476
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by Monocock
If I went as a first time visitor to a Erotica event and sold my pictures to The Sun I would expect a bunch of perverts to chase me for my actions.....
Pitts2112
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: sURREY
Posts: 117
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Well said Monocock, I absolutely agree with you. Popham is by far the most friendly and inviting airfield I have ever visited. for my own reasons it will always hold a special place in my heart..........As will CC IL and PZ...Cheers
