Two men injured as plane crashes

[Gertrude the Wombat]

Originally Posted by Chuck Ellsworth

Please read my comments again and maybe point out where I was wrong?

You weren't wrong at all ... it's just that:

as long as you make sure it is clear of traffic

rules out pretty well all the roads round here pretty well all of the time (except late at night when I'm not flying anyway), so whilst a "suitable road" might indeed be better than standing crops the non-existence of "suitable roads" in south-east England in daylight means that in practice this isn't a choice one meets very often round here.

[Chuck Ellsworth]

Getting a bit off subect here but what the hell:

Just another comment on the DC3.

I had the fun of flying Fifi Kate one of the airplanes used in Band of Brothers last summer, delivered the thing from Lelystad to Valkenberg Hollland for an annual inspection.

It had been around thirty years since I flew a DC3, but it is such an easy airplane to fly it only seemed like one day since I had flown one....they are a magnificant flying device and a real pleasure to fly.

Sorry for the hijack and my rambling..getting old you know so I hope you all will forgive me..

C.E.

[Chuck Ellsworth]

Quote:

" I have three high-viz jackets and the fact that I'm alive proves their worth, "

I have flown for coming up on 54 years and outside of a couple of airports in England and a few in Europe I never wore a high vis jacket...

Does that mean I'm just one lucky SOB to have not been run over by an airplane??

C.E.

[powerless]

A useful web site covering selecting fields can be found at http://www.field-landings.co.uk/.
It is primarily aimed at glider pliots but may be useful to all.

[Fournicator]

Can anyone else hear an echo in here?

[Paris Dakar]

First off, let me say that I'm pleased that the folk in this incident escaped without serious injury. Not personally knowing the area at all, the standing crops may have been their only option?

To suggest that someone is 'idiotic' for considering landing on a road seems a little harsh and a tad rude. You don't choose when and where to have engine problems therefore your choices of a suitable landing spot may well be limited. According to Gycoler's profile he operates out of the Isle of Man, so let's assume that you are overhead Douglas (but not within gliding distance of Ronaldsway) when you suffer an engine problem - one option that could be available might be the beach? But what if the engine problem happened if you were overhead Snaefell? Personally, I'd be opting to land on the road albeit twisty and narrow because I'd really doubt that landing on the surrounding craggy rocky area would be condusive to a succesful outcome.

I accept that the M25 at 08.30 would be a seriously poor error of judgement but the A1M just south of Newcastle at 05.30 could be a consideration if all else failed.

[stiknruda]

the A1M just south of Newcastle at 05.30 could be a consideration if all else failed.

I'm not so sure - if you did avoid the lighting and the sign gantreys, you'd be bound to be zapped by the speed cameras

[Paris Dakar]

stiknruda,

I'm not so sure - if you did avoid the lighting and the sign gantreys, you'd be bound to be zapped by the speed cameras

You're ded right, and knowing my luck it will be one of those forward facing cameras that will catch the reg on the side too! Double bonus - the local law enforcement will be agitated cos I blocked the motorway, the CAA will want to know why I did what I did, and to round matters off I'll get a photo of the event through the post complete with fine and fixed penalty notice

I forgot to mention that I did see a Piper Malibu(?) on a freeway in Florida that had landed as a result of a problem. It was late afternoon and how he/she hadn't hit anyone was totally beyond me - the road was very busy. The aircraft was neatly parked next to the median (but not on it) and the police were directing the motorists around it.

[G SXTY]

This forced landing was in Essex, near Tiptree. For those who don’t know the area, it’s as flat as a snooker table and full of nice big fields. The only road around there straight enough and wide enough to accommodate even a 152 would be the A12 – and each to his own, but I’d rather land in a field full of hungry wild animals than on a road like that.

And as for avoiding vegetation, I did some PFLs not a million miles from there just last weekend, and it was quite sobering just how few fields didn’t have standing crops . . .

[OpenCirrus619]

When I was doing my PPL I was getting worried about PFLs - the advice I was given was:

The aim as a PPL, should you get engine failure, is to walk away from the wreckage.

I'd say that the folks in this case achieved the aim.

There's been many people killed by trying to save the aeroplane: e.g. stretching the glide to get to a better field. A good number of those would be alive today had they just accepted the fact their pride and joy was going to get broken and concentrated on getting the energy involved as low as possible at the point of impact.

When considering the merits of roads vs. fields the following points have been made to me in the past:

• Roads have signs / gantries / street lamps / .... - most of which you can't spot from the air
• Most roads are not wide enough. When you compare the width of a motorway to that of a runway do remember that the runway does not usually have armco down either side.
• Car drivers (if you are lucky) will be expecting people to pass them on the left and right. If you pass them overhead they are likely to be so suprised they will cause a major pile up or run into YOU.
• Should the car you land behind notice you in his mirror its 50/50 that he will slam on the brakes - can your 152 / PA38 outbrake a modern car with ABS?

The bottom line is that, should you find a bit of road clear of obstacles to land on, a car / lorry driver will probably spoil your day anyway. Better just to accept the field of crops, a bent airframe and an intact body.

Just my few cents worth.

OC619

[Microfright]

http://www.wkrn.com/node/30683#top
I wonder how the CAA would react to this situation?

[Gertrude the Wombat]

Originally Posted by WR

Chuck:
If you're going to land on a highway you'd better have one on.

There are, I'm told by people who wear them for work, two contradictory responses of the public to seeing people wearing hi-ris vests out and about on the streets:

(1) assuming they're someone important and in authority

(2) completely failing to see them at all.

[Final 3 Greens]

Road or Field

Surely this is about situational awareness and decision making?

I'd take whichever option appeared to offer the highest probability of success at the time.

[Chuck Ellsworth]

" (I can't believe you took my post seriously, did you?) "

WR, no , I figured you were joking and thought if you were serious you had far greater neuron disconnects than it would be within my ability to help you out with.

I had to quit flying for a living because of my inability to keep up with or understand all the new rules and policies that have to be dealth with just to fly airplanes that I have been flying for longer than most of these cretins who dream up these rules have been alive.

I am fed up, finished and relieved to go on with my life without having to be insulted just to earn a living.

I have a real advantage over all the people who are starting in aviation and that is that I learned to fly and worked in the industry when personal accountability, airmanship and the ability to actually fly aircraft was the norm.

So to my brethern in aviation you have my sincere condolances for your having to be treated like some zombie by people who couldn't find their as.holes with a set of moose antlers telling them how to do their job.

There you go WR.... I hope we are on the same frequency now?

Chuck E.