What do i need (rating)
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What do i need (rating)
Hello to all and hope everyone had a good christmas and will have a great new year.
just a quick question about type rating, i am near the end of my PPL training now and will be getting the IMC, IR, MEP, Night Ratings after that can i fly a BEECH KING AIR 200 with all that or do i need a type rating / check out flights
thanks in advance
craig
just a quick question about type rating, i am near the end of my PPL training now and will be getting the IMC, IR, MEP, Night Ratings after that can i fly a BEECH KING AIR 200 with all that or do i need a type rating / check out flights
thanks in advance
craig
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piston
Ok thank you for your reply.
i guess i should ask another question that im unsure on and that is what is the biggest (piston plane) inregards to paasenger number for example the BEECH KING AIR 200 has 10 passenger seats.
can anyone tell me what the largest piston plane there is i could fly with a MEP rating
thanks
Craig
i guess i should ask another question that im unsure on and that is what is the biggest (piston plane) inregards to paasenger number for example the BEECH KING AIR 200 has 10 passenger seats.
can anyone tell me what the largest piston plane there is i could fly with a MEP rating
thanks
Craig
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As I understand it with an MEP rating you can fly any MEP aircraft without a check up to 5700Kg MTOW. Above this size you'll need a type check. However, you will also need to note that by law, with a PPL the PIC must pay all flying expenses for aircraft with more than 5 seats.
Out of interest why do you want to get the IR and IMC?
Finally you need 70 hours P1 before you can get an MEP rating though I wouldn't touch anything as big or complex as a king air with this minimum amount. It is a lot of plane to handle, especially alone.
Out of interest why do you want to get the IR and IMC?
Finally you need 70 hours P1 before you can get an MEP rating though I wouldn't touch anything as big or complex as a king air with this minimum amount. It is a lot of plane to handle, especially alone.
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Piston twins of more than 6 seats that can be flown on a PPL are thin on the ground. When it comes to aircraft of which I have personal experience, the MEP aeroplane sub 5,700kg with the most seats that I can think of is the DH Dragon Rapide, which manages up to eight plus the pilot. Not sure if some of the bigger Cessnas come in under the weight limit? A C404 can carry up to 12, I think, but it's not the sort of thing generally available for PPL hire. Neither is a Rapide, for that matter. Another (theoretical) possibility is the delightful DH.104 Dove / Devon, which I believe can be configured with up to 6 in the cabin and two up front. Very few of those left, though. The BN2 Islander used to carry, I think, 7 pax max plus one pilot. Again, very rare these days.
In practical terms, I reckon six seats including crew is about your lot on a plain PPL-MEP - unless anyone knows of a larger type still available for hire.
In practical terms, I reckon six seats including crew is about your lot on a plain PPL-MEP - unless anyone knows of a larger type still available for hire.
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M8 you really don't want to be flying a king air on low hours.
Most of the MCC schools have king air sims for the course if you want to have a play you should be able to get access for under 50 quid per hour.
Although I can assure you after 15mins and your first engine failure on go around you won't be so keen to fly the machine by yourself.
Most twins unless you own your own have an insurance requirment of 50hours MEP. Which if you do a 55hour IR course in a FNPT 1 and your CPL in the twin you might just get enough.
MJ
Most of the MCC schools have king air sims for the course if you want to have a play you should be able to get access for under 50 quid per hour.
Although I can assure you after 15mins and your first engine failure on go around you won't be so keen to fly the machine by yourself.
Most twins unless you own your own have an insurance requirment of 50hours MEP. Which if you do a 55hour IR course in a FNPT 1 and your CPL in the twin you might just get enough.
MJ
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choices
hi and thanks for your replies
my plan is a little simple i guess for me still being a student any may no understand the true reality but here is my plan.
1. finish PPL
2. Complete Night, IMC, IR
3. Complete MEP Rating
4. Hour Build (usa)
5. Complete ATPL Ground School
6. Complete CPL (A)
once complete i shall do some check flights and try and get some hours as PIC on a twin
do you know any fliying schools that have the KING AIR flight sims as my computer is just to slow for Flight SIms
i understand that there is so many people which huge knowledge and experience so please your views are very important to my way of thinking
Craig
my plan is a little simple i guess for me still being a student any may no understand the true reality but here is my plan.
1. finish PPL
2. Complete Night, IMC, IR
3. Complete MEP Rating
4. Hour Build (usa)
5. Complete ATPL Ground School
6. Complete CPL (A)
once complete i shall do some check flights and try and get some hours as PIC on a twin
do you know any fliying schools that have the KING AIR flight sims as my computer is just to slow for Flight SIms
i understand that there is so many people which huge knowledge and experience so please your views are very important to my way of thinking
Craig
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mate no offence but your plans sound a bit all to c0ck
for instance, if going down the professional route as a long term aim, you have to do the ATPL ground school before you get your IR. you also need to hour build before you get the IR, as its an ICAO requirement to have at least 50 hours XC before the IR rating can be issued.
IMC and IR are totally different, and from what you've said so far it doesnt appear you actually know just how different they are. Not only course hours, but the theory side is immensly different.
perhaps you should read Lasors 2006 on the CAA website
www.srg.caa.co.uk
for instance, if going down the professional route as a long term aim, you have to do the ATPL ground school before you get your IR. you also need to hour build before you get the IR, as its an ICAO requirement to have at least 50 hours XC before the IR rating can be issued.
IMC and IR are totally different, and from what you've said so far it doesnt appear you actually know just how different they are. Not only course hours, but the theory side is immensly different.
perhaps you should read Lasors 2006 on the CAA website
www.srg.caa.co.uk
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I think what people are getting at Craig, is the why and how you want to fly a B200. It makes a difference....
On the offchance that you can write a large cheque and want to fly your own KingAir; I'd tell you to keep it on the N reg and fly it on an ordinary FAA ME licence - no ratings under 12,500lbs.
If you want to be paid for it then it depends on where you will be doing it, and for whom.
On the offchance that you can write a large cheque and want to fly your own KingAir; I'd tell you to keep it on the N reg and fly it on an ordinary FAA ME licence - no ratings under 12,500lbs.
If you want to be paid for it then it depends on where you will be doing it, and for whom.
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this is kind of OT, but if I wanted to fly a Turbo Prop and I only had a PPL, what rating would I need to get? Would i just need an individual type rating for the turbo prop aircraft i want to fly or would I frst need to get my MEP and then do an individual type rating?
Thanks
Thanks
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You are in the US, Jai. There are no type ratings under 12,500lbs for a turboprop. On a PPL you can fly a Caravan.....if your insurance company let you.
With a plain vanilla MEL you can fly a Kingair (up to 200).
With a plain vanilla MEL you can fly a Kingair (up to 200).
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Craig,
Hour Builder is right - you really need to review your approach to this in order to do it in the most time and cost effective route.
As noted, you need to do your ATPL theory before you can do the IR. You do not need to do the IMC as part of the ATPL, but it can help make the IR easier - if you are flying regularly and keep current at it.
I also wouldn't do your MEP until after the your theories - again, keeping current whilst you do the theory - plan on at least 9 months if Distance, less if full-time - will cost you an absolute fortune.
There's loads of resources in the Professional training forum - it's probably worht you spending some time in there and seeing how other people are going about gaining their license.
Good luck with it all though!
DW
Hour Builder is right - you really need to review your approach to this in order to do it in the most time and cost effective route.
As noted, you need to do your ATPL theory before you can do the IR. You do not need to do the IMC as part of the ATPL, but it can help make the IR easier - if you are flying regularly and keep current at it.
I also wouldn't do your MEP until after the your theories - again, keeping current whilst you do the theory - plan on at least 9 months if Distance, less if full-time - will cost you an absolute fortune.
There's loads of resources in the Professional training forum - it's probably worht you spending some time in there and seeing how other people are going about gaining their license.
Good luck with it all though!
DW
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Pretty amazing stuff to read. Somebody learning to fly and planning to fly a King Air right away.
As someone who wanted to get a plane (or a share in something half decent) from nearly the start (and got shot down by all instructors I spoke to) I really admire that, and hope it isn't a wind up.
Instructors will really love such a student. Actually, not; most PPL-level instructors will be totally scared of such a student. He will need to get seriously well sorted out on the instructor front, with a real working ATPL man who is current on the type and can teach the right procedures right from the start. The stuff one learns in a PPL belongs to the Dark Ages, for someone wanting to fly IFR.
My input, knowing next to nothing about turboprops, is to get an N-reg one, and get an FAA PPL/IR. I doubt anybody will be willing to teach the type rating to somebody without an IR (certainly true for bizjets).
If the UK (or EASA, a few years down the road) manages to kick out N-reg planes, then the pilot will have to upgrade to a JAA PPL/IR and spend a wad putting the plane on G. That is about the worst case scenario though and it will probably never happen. All the same, I would avoid planes that would have massive certification issues going on G.
As someone who wanted to get a plane (or a share in something half decent) from nearly the start (and got shot down by all instructors I spoke to) I really admire that, and hope it isn't a wind up.
Instructors will really love such a student. Actually, not; most PPL-level instructors will be totally scared of such a student. He will need to get seriously well sorted out on the instructor front, with a real working ATPL man who is current on the type and can teach the right procedures right from the start. The stuff one learns in a PPL belongs to the Dark Ages, for someone wanting to fly IFR.
My input, knowing next to nothing about turboprops, is to get an N-reg one, and get an FAA PPL/IR. I doubt anybody will be willing to teach the type rating to somebody without an IR (certainly true for bizjets).
If the UK (or EASA, a few years down the road) manages to kick out N-reg planes, then the pilot will have to upgrade to a JAA PPL/IR and spend a wad putting the plane on G. That is about the worst case scenario though and it will probably never happen. All the same, I would avoid planes that would have massive certification issues going on G.
Well It's great to have ambition but perhaps you are setting your sights a tad high at this stage, C150 - kingair <100 hours?
Are you aware of the performance of an aircraft like the Kingair?
Unless you have a shed load of dosh and you intend buying your own one (doubt the insurance company would let you) then I would love to know who is going to let you fly one?!
I would suggest if you have your heart set on flying the kingair, you either work at getting your ATPL's and all that goes with them, get the experience then apply for a first officer job with Gama or somebody like that.
Or, you could do the FAA licence, find a kingair on the N reg (no type rating) , and try and blag your way into the right hand seat.
Are you aware of the performance of an aircraft like the Kingair?
Unless you have a shed load of dosh and you intend buying your own one (doubt the insurance company would let you) then I would love to know who is going to let you fly one?!
I would suggest if you have your heart set on flying the kingair, you either work at getting your ATPL's and all that goes with them, get the experience then apply for a first officer job with Gama or somebody like that.
Or, you could do the FAA licence, find a kingair on the N reg (no type rating) , and try and blag your way into the right hand seat.
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Insurance could (would) be an issue. But other than that, why not? I read about a guy in the US with 50(?) hours ME time, and he did a 737 type rating - just to prove that you don't need to be able to fly MEPs to fly a Boeing.....Everyone I have talked to about the 200 reckons it's easier to fly than a Seneca....so there you go.
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lol it probably is easier to fly then the Seneca, but its definately harder to fly then a 150...lol jk
Even though I posted what I did earlier, it was purely to help this guy, who has seen a plane he likes and is aiming to someday fly it. I think thats pretty cool tbh.
good luck
HB
Even though I posted what I did earlier, it was purely to help this guy, who has seen a plane he likes and is aiming to someday fly it. I think thats pretty cool tbh.
good luck
HB
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just a quick question about type rating, i am near the end of my PPL training now and will be getting the IMC, IR, MEP, Night Ratings after that can i fly a BEECH KING AIR 200 with all that or do i need a type rating / check out flights
ATPL and type rating
In principle you can do it on a PPL but you would need to have done an High Performace Aeroplane course, the material and test is currently not available for this and the ATPL stuff is considered 'equivalent'
FAA land
As Flyingfemme says.
For both, to be able to make any sensible use of such a machine you need an IR and a few buckets of dosh to pay for the upkeep and running costs.
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A king air is not a machine you can just jump into, straight from "normal" PPL flying.
It is big, heavy, fast and complex. Compared to a 73 it isn't difficult, but compare it to most PPL available a/c it is in a different league.
As has been pointed out before, larger a/c aren't more difficult to fly, but they are totally different to operate safely. With the lax attitude most have to reading the POH in something like a PA28, then I shudder to think of the same attitude being applied to something like B200.
It's not impossible by any means, but it is improbable, certainly in JAR land.
A type rating on a king air in the U.K is around £12K I think.
It is big, heavy, fast and complex. Compared to a 73 it isn't difficult, but compare it to most PPL available a/c it is in a different league.
As has been pointed out before, larger a/c aren't more difficult to fly, but they are totally different to operate safely. With the lax attitude most have to reading the POH in something like a PA28, then I shudder to think of the same attitude being applied to something like B200.
It's not impossible by any means, but it is improbable, certainly in JAR land.
A type rating on a king air in the U.K is around £12K I think.