Not much for sale at the moment
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Not much for sale at the moment
Recently I was 'daydreaming' about a purchase in these hallowed halls. As I've got more and more serious, and refined my requirements, I've discovered that there don't appear to be many 'planes on the market at the moment.
Is this a seasonal thing?
Anyway, it seems many of the adverts sit on club-house walls, and there are only so many of those one can visit... If anyone knows of anything that might fit the bill (and isn't advertised in the usual places), perhaps they could let me know?
I'm looking for a two-seater with a reasonable turn of speed and an enclosed cockpit for <£8k.
It must permitted or Pt.CofA'd. Other than that I'm open to suggestions.
BRL - hope this is OK - just zap it if not!
Is this a seasonal thing?
Anyway, it seems many of the adverts sit on club-house walls, and there are only so many of those one can visit... If anyone knows of anything that might fit the bill (and isn't advertised in the usual places), perhaps they could let me know?
I'm looking for a two-seater with a reasonable turn of speed and an enclosed cockpit for <£8k.
It must permitted or Pt.CofA'd. Other than that I'm open to suggestions.BRL - hope this is OK - just zap it if not!
Last edited by In Altissimus; 26th Jan 2004 at 23:04.
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I was looking at the small-ads fairly recently, things really start to get interesting at around the £10-12k mark (e.g. Condors, basic Jodels and Aeronca Champs). £8k might be on the slightly low side. Alternatively, why not look for a couple of others to chip in, many more options then and only a fraction of the fixed costs...?
(or there's a VP-1 with "approved dummy gun" on the PFA classified ads for <£4k
)
(or there's a VP-1 with "approved dummy gun" on the PFA classified ads for <£4k
)
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Evo,
Know what you mean about the apparently magic £12k figure...
Not looking for a group for this - I want my own toy that I can play with whenever the fancy takes me
Know what you mean about the apparently magic £12k figure...
Not looking for a group for this - I want my own toy that I can play with whenever the fancy takes me
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Not looking for a group for this - I want my own toy that I can play with whenever the fancy takes me
IMHO though it's still probably worth saving up a bit extra. I'd be the first to admit that my knowledge is fairly basic, but sub £10k seems to be either very basic (do you like hand-swinging the prop? fresh air? Fine if you do... but you may not) or very knackered. However, there are some very nice aeroplanes to be had for not much more than £10k. Usual disclaimers about finding a friendly PFA inspector before buying anything, but i'm sure you knew that already
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My advice to you In Alt is as follows........
1. Keep your powder dry. Don't rush in to buying something you might regret. If you do, you can guarantee that what you really want will be advertised the week after you part with your cash. I have made this mistake twice and will not do it again.
2. Be realistic about what you can afford and also about what kind of flying you want to do. If you can afford to pay out £8k are you sure you can afford the upkeep? If you want something purely so you can get airborne and "have a laugh" than your budget is perfectly ok.
3. Don't be tempted to stretch yourself. You'll only find yourself in a forced sale situation in 2 years time and that's not what you want.
4. Be flexible. If you need to do a taildragger course to open your horizons then do it. I have recently found that the tailwheel route has allowed me access to some brilliant a/c that until now have been unavailable to me.
5. Ask around. Get some flights in the kind of a/c you plan to buy. You'll soon know what you like and what you don't.
Sorry if I sound dictatorial but only you will know when you have found what you are looking for. There is nothing worse than getting it home and wishing it was something else!
If I was in your shoes i'd go and buy an Evans VP1. They look like they are a bundle of fun and I've never heard a bad word said against them.
Just my tuppence worth!
P.S Most importantly..............have fun. We 'aint 'ere long so do wha you want to do.
1. Keep your powder dry. Don't rush in to buying something you might regret. If you do, you can guarantee that what you really want will be advertised the week after you part with your cash. I have made this mistake twice and will not do it again.
2. Be realistic about what you can afford and also about what kind of flying you want to do. If you can afford to pay out £8k are you sure you can afford the upkeep? If you want something purely so you can get airborne and "have a laugh" than your budget is perfectly ok.
3. Don't be tempted to stretch yourself. You'll only find yourself in a forced sale situation in 2 years time and that's not what you want.
4. Be flexible. If you need to do a taildragger course to open your horizons then do it. I have recently found that the tailwheel route has allowed me access to some brilliant a/c that until now have been unavailable to me.
5. Ask around. Get some flights in the kind of a/c you plan to buy. You'll soon know what you like and what you don't.
Sorry if I sound dictatorial but only you will know when you have found what you are looking for. There is nothing worse than getting it home and wishing it was something else!
If I was in your shoes i'd go and buy an Evans VP1. They look like they are a bundle of fun and I've never heard a bad word said against them.
Just my tuppence worth!
P.S Most importantly..............have fun. We 'aint 'ere long so do wha you want to do.
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FInance
Money is cheap these days.
I reckon you wouldn't get much for £8k. If you did it will probably be a bit of a dog with a money funnel in the bonnet.
Borrow a bit extra on Finance - spread it over a lot of years and with a final balloon payment ( a biggie), thus keeping the costs down and enabling you to either gear up to sell it 'when the balloon is about to pop' or refinance the balloon - all is do-able.
Finance companies like the more common aircraft types, simply because they are known quantities that can be accurately valued.
I have to say that there are hangars everywhere with 'bargain basement' aircraft in a thousand bits/ interest lost/ hangarage accumulating.
If you ain't got the money to fund a worse-case non-insured scenario ( blown donkey etc.) then you really ought to consider hedging your bets and syndicate.
Not sporty I know but if you were to take the financial risk and buy an aircraft outright; then shares in it should be worth more pro-rata than what you paid.
Do the calculation on any 'shares for sale' ad and you will come up with a very expensive aircraft every time.
Final words of wisdom - flying ain't cheap. However, if you are a competent engineer then you can at least avoid some of the 'take out your wallet and repeat after me, help yourself' requests.
HP
I reckon you wouldn't get much for £8k. If you did it will probably be a bit of a dog with a money funnel in the bonnet.
Borrow a bit extra on Finance - spread it over a lot of years and with a final balloon payment ( a biggie), thus keeping the costs down and enabling you to either gear up to sell it 'when the balloon is about to pop' or refinance the balloon - all is do-able.
Finance companies like the more common aircraft types, simply because they are known quantities that can be accurately valued.
I have to say that there are hangars everywhere with 'bargain basement' aircraft in a thousand bits/ interest lost/ hangarage accumulating.
If you ain't got the money to fund a worse-case non-insured scenario ( blown donkey etc.) then you really ought to consider hedging your bets and syndicate.
Not sporty I know but if you were to take the financial risk and buy an aircraft outright; then shares in it should be worth more pro-rata than what you paid.
Do the calculation on any 'shares for sale' ad and you will come up with a very expensive aircraft every time.
Final words of wisdom - flying ain't cheap. However, if you are a competent engineer then you can at least avoid some of the 'take out your wallet and repeat after me, help yourself' requests.
HP
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Monocock & HP,
All good advice. Maybe I should have made it clear that I'm really just after something for 'a bit of fun' (just not too tardy). I'm planning on keeping my share in the 172 for more 'serious' flying.
Somehow I suspect this is all a bit like buying a house; most people end up with something quite different to their original specs. What I first thought I wanted was a fast single-seater tricycle gear beast. I'm moving ever closer to a tailwheel, two-seater - but it has to be fast enough to be fun, without being chronically unstable in the air or on the ground
Who knows what I'll end up with
All good advice. Maybe I should have made it clear that I'm really just after something for 'a bit of fun' (just not too tardy). I'm planning on keeping my share in the 172 for more 'serious' flying.
Somehow I suspect this is all a bit like buying a house; most people end up with something quite different to their original specs. What I first thought I wanted was a fast single-seater tricycle gear beast. I'm moving ever closer to a tailwheel, two-seater - but it has to be fast enough to be fun, without being chronically unstable in the air or on the ground
Who knows what I'll end up with
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I A,
Hi mate, just a quickie to say that you really need to join the PFA. If you end up with a PFA type you need to be a member anyway. Being a member now gets you popular flying every 2 months which will have a bunch of aircraft for sale in the back. Another benefit is access to PFA engineering, although busy, they hold a great amount of detail about generic types and specific aircraft on file and are always worth asking if you have any queries before handing over the money for your shiny new steed.
Cheers
Kingy
Hi mate, just a quickie to say that you really need to join the PFA. If you end up with a PFA type you need to be a member anyway. Being a member now gets you popular flying every 2 months which will have a bunch of aircraft for sale in the back. Another benefit is access to PFA engineering, although busy, they hold a great amount of detail about generic types and specific aircraft on file and are always worth asking if you have any queries before handing over the money for your shiny new steed.
Cheers
Kingy
In Alt I know of an Auster for sale which is based about 15 mins flying time from EGSG which will have a new Annual (Pvt C of A) with two years to run before the Star Annual. The seller might have a pprune name that begins with an L and ends in a W
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Only joking.
I don't know why private a/c ad's aren't allowed on this forum anyway.
Let's see how long the recognition and delete process takes..................here comes an advert as a new thread.
I don't know why private a/c ad's aren't allowed on this forum anyway.
Let's see how long the recognition and delete process takes..................here comes an advert as a new thread.
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An Update
I dunno, I really dunno.
I've looked at two machines that came near my spec (OK had to raise the price range a bit), but neither really cut the mustard.
Let's not talk about Shadows at the moment shall we... And the ARV Super was so nearly the right 'plane for me. One stupid problem - no baggage space to speak of.
I have come to the very sad conclusion that this:
beast leads only to a bloomin C150/2
This thought saddens me so much that I think I'll just stay in the syndicate for now.
I've looked at two machines that came near my spec (OK had to raise the price range a bit), but neither really cut the mustard.
Let's not talk about Shadows at the moment shall we... And the ARV Super was so nearly the right 'plane for me. One stupid problem - no baggage space to speak of.
I have come to the very sad conclusion that this:
- All metal
- Nosewheel
- 2 place
- (plus weekend baggage!)
- Price up to around £12k(ish)
beast leads only to a bloomin C150/2
This thought saddens me so much that I think I'll just stay in the syndicate for now.
I thnk it's fair to say that if you are buying outright, you have four choices:-
(1) Raise your price limit
(2) Drop your "fast" requirement. (Why do you need something fast if you are only after "a bit of fun" anyway?).
(3) Buy something in somewhat less than 100% condition and spend time sorting it out.
(4) Buy a single seater.
The fact is, nobody is going to sell a fast, good condition, 2-seater for £8k, they don't need to.
G
(1) Raise your price limit
(2) Drop your "fast" requirement. (Why do you need something fast if you are only after "a bit of fun" anyway?).
(3) Buy something in somewhat less than 100% condition and spend time sorting it out.
(4) Buy a single seater.
The fact is, nobody is going to sell a fast, good condition, 2-seater for £8k, they don't need to.
G
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I would have thought that a £12k C150 would be a complete dog? Maybe with the cheap dollar you might get something a bit better, but then you've got to get it over here, G-reg'd etc.
